2010 Formula One European Grand Prix

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Jezus! Why the hell was Kovalainen defending like that against a car 3 seconds a lap quicker? That certainly was not necessary. 👎
I’m very glad Webber is ok.

This is Formula 1 not Noble 1...

It may sound unnecessary but there is absolute no problem at all to race with Webber. He was racing, on the same lap so I found not a single problem at all to race eventhough he has a waaaay slower car compared to what Webber have.

I have to say, it's the faster car fault here. He was obviously faster, no need to folow so closely behind Heikki. He followed behind him until nearly the end of the straight! Just look back the replay, Webber turned left and followed Heikki and relized Heikki brake a bit earlier and by that time it was too late to turn right and away from the Lotus. Incidents like this happen anyway, but Heikki has rights to race.
 
That was a pretty interesting race, fantastic by Valencia's standards! Webber's crash was freaky, Kobayashi kicked arse, The outcome of those potential penalties should be interesting, and Vettel's victory was the icing on the cake! :D
 
Kobayashi, man of the race! :D

Webber's crash reminded me Villeneuve's (fatal) one. He was very, very lucky :scared:

Meanwhile, Alonso is nothing short of furious! :lol:
 
I understand that it was for position... but I really think Heikki should have known better. To stray out of the racing line that far in order to defend against a car in a completely different race of its own was silly. Lotus is almost driving at the pace of GP2 cars, and they were lapped four times during the course of the race.

Although pointless, I would have defended if I were driving the Lotus. But that was too aggressive if you ask me. Lotus should focus on who they are really racing against. It certainly aint the Red Bulls...
 
Sorry mate but again, they are racing... Slow car, newbies, less experience but it all doesn't matter because you are in Formula 1, they are all in the same class not like in Le Mans where they have LMP1 and LMP2 etc. The Lotus was running 103% in the leaders time so he is qualified to race with the others. Put it all aside, he was fine and to Silverstone we head...

EDIT: Trulli got lapped 4 times because he had a technical problem and was in pit for 2 laps. If not he would've been only 2 laps together with the Virgins and HRTs...
 
Yep... valid points, but I still think it was a poor decision. It’ll be interesting to read the post race comments from the teams on the situation.

Anyhow, I'm off to bed 👍.
 
Button is more than 25 seconds ahead of Alonso... that'll make his day - if he gets a 25 second pen!

C.
 
Jezus! Why the hell was Kovalainen defending like that against a car 3 seconds a lap quicker? That certainly was not necessary. 👎
I’m very glad Webber is ok.

Given how hard it is to overtake here he had a perfect right to defend his position. It's called racing. By the way Webber is not blaming him for the accident.

Button is more than 25 seconds ahead of Alonso... that'll make his day - if he gets a 25 second pen!

C.

Alonso's race was not actually affected by Hamilton passing the safety car. He has nothing to complain about. He's suggesting in interviews that the race was manipulated. If I was there I'd ask him if it was as manipulated as a certain Alonso/Renault win.
 
It was verging on being an interesting race (with the two Ferrari's catching) until the safety car. Thank god we don't have to go back there for at least another year.
 
I don't know how you guys liked this race. It was a bore fest until Kobayashi overtook two cars in the end.

Valencia shouldn't be in the calendar. It's imprssible to overtake in normal conditions there. (i know rules have to do with this, but the circuit is horrible).
 
Jezus! Why the hell was Kovalainen defending like that against a car 3 seconds a lap quicker? That certainly was not necessary. 👎
I’m very glad Webber is ok.

Errh... because he was defending for position? Doesn't matter if Webber is half a second quicker or half a minute quicker. He still has to earn the position.

Lotus is blaming Webber for braking too late. It was a weird incident. Whoever was at fault, Webber certainly left it off till way too late to pull out of Hekki's slipstream.
 
This is Formula 1 not Noble 1...

It may sound unnecessary but there is absolute no problem at all to race with Webber. He was racing, on the same lap so I found not a single problem at all to race eventhough he has a waaaay slower car compared to what Webber have.

I have to say, it's the faster car fault here. He was obviously faster, no need to folow so closely behind Heikki. He followed behind him until nearly the end of the straight! Just look back the replay, Webber turned left and followed Heikki and relized Heikki brake a bit earlier and by that time it was too late to turn right and away from the Lotus. Incidents like this happen anyway, but Heikki has rights to race.

That does seem to suggest that Heikki moved twice-once to the right of the track, and then again left. Webber was obviously assuming, incorrectly, that Heikki was going to keep his original line. Heikki's little twitch back was the main catalyst-therefore, racing incident.
 
I don't know how you guys liked this race. It was a bore fest until Kobayashi overtook two cars in the end.

Valencia shouldn't be in the calendar. It's imprssible to overtake in normal conditions there. (i know rules have to do with this, but the circuit is horrible).

Seriously? This race was very interesting. The main reason for that was that safety car mixed up the field. There were plenty of battles going on, just not right at the front of the field.

Hamilton lost a bit of time to Vettel and then had the drive through, which is why they weren't battling. Button tried a couple of passes on Kobayashi, but he is a very aggressive blocker so he backed off like he usually does so he can save his tires, hence why there wasn't a battle going on their. The Williams behind Button couldn't keep up and had no hope of overtaking.

If you have a problem, it's with the TV coverage. It can't always be in the right place at the right time, they can't pre-meditate overtakes.
 
Mercedes CLK GTR CLR

;)

The CLK GTR raced at Le Mans in 1998, but the CLR was a completely different car.

On the Heikki - Webber accident:

I think Heikki and Mark need to share the blame for this accident. Heikki should not be braking when in the middle of the track and off the racing line while Mark should not be slipstreaming so close on Heikkis tail right in front of such a sharp corner while his car was clearly fast enough to make the move without so much slipstreaming.
 
That does seem to suggest that Heikki moved twice-once to the right of the track, and then again left. Webber was obviously assuming, incorrectly, that Heikki was going to keep his original line. Heikki's little twitch back was the main catalyst-therefore, racing incident.

Heikki didn't move right... Jeez we had this same argument at Turkey. A driver is allowed one move. But if they approach the corner in a blocking position like Kovalainen did, that doesn't count as a manoevre. He moved over the racing line for the braking zone (That is the one move that he is allowed), and Webber moved over thinking that Heikki was going to run wide to let him past because he was in a slower car. He was wrong, and it caused the end of his race.
 
Wow, finally Valencia comes good....though only because Webber got too needy with the overtaking.
Look, hundreds of times before we have seen defending no less aggressive than what Kovalainen did. Same goes for Webber's slipstreaming and overtake. We even had it at Monteal a few weeks ago with Schumacher and others.
The problem with this incident is that the Lotus was just not as fast as the Red Bull, and Webber and Kovy decided to get all toe-to-toe about it when they were too close.
Both of them misjudged how close they were to each other, the speed differential and their ability to move out of the way in time.

But as Webber was the one with the fast car and the one who was shoving his nose mere centimeters behind Kovy's gearbox, I think hes more to blame simply for pushing it so far. Its a bit like the Vettel/Webber incident - one driver could have made it a bit easier but they didn't have to. Just like the onus was on Vettel to then react appropriately to a hard-defending Webber, so its the onus on Webber this time to overtake Kovalainen with respect given to the difference in speed.

I think we also saw many drivers effectively panicking because of the reputation of this circuit. So many of the overtakes and driving was really ragged and desperate - everyone knew its hard to overtake around here and were desperately trying to make it stick somewhere.

Full marks to Vettel, Kobayashi, Hamilton and Barrichello for making the most of what they got. Ferrari should have done what Sauber did and split their cars rather than stacking but they got screwed by it. Pretty dumb really.
I kind of want to see everyone being penalised just for the :lol: and Kobayashi securing a podium :D.

Oh and I called the backmarkers creating the action :p
 
Latest news...

BBC
But Alonso, who finished ninth on the road, may yet regain fifth place. That is because Button (who finished third), Williams driver Rubens Barrichello (fourth), Renault's Robert Kubica (fifth) and Force India's Adrian Sutil (sixth) are all under investigation for breaching the rules in going too fast into the pits as the safety car was deployed.

Should penalties be applied to these drivers, then Kobayashi could be promoted to an unlikely third position.

Also under investigation for the same offence is Pedro de la Rosa, who finished 10th for Sauber.

Four drivers were exonerated from the same charge: Buemi (who finished eighth), Vitaly Petrov (11th for Renault), Vitantonio Liuzzi (13th for Force India) and Nico Hulkenberg, who retired his Williams a few laps from the finish.
 
:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

Holy 🤬!!!!!!!!!


Just when you thought Webber's day couldn't get any worse...
 
Ferrari should have done what Sauber did and split their cars rather than stacking but they got screwed by it. Pretty dumb really.
But they couldn't really. They both started on the softer of the 2 tyres, so couldn't have went as long as Kamui could. It only worked for the Sauber because he started on the harder tyre and could go very long, before changing onto the soft for a sprint.

Latest latest news.

Autosport
Nine drivers given five-second penalties

Sunday, June 27th 2010, 16:33 GMT

The FIA has handed five-second penalties to nine Formula 1 drivers for a safety car rules breach during the European Grand Prix.

Jenson Button, Rubens Barrichello, Nico Hulkenberg, Robert Kubica, Vitaly Petrov, Adrian Sutil, Sebastien Buemi, Pedro de la Rosa and Vitantonio Liuzzi have been penalised after the race for exceeding the safety car-in lap time.

The penalties mean Fernando Alonso is elevated from ninth to eighth, as he overtakes Buemi, and Nico Rosberg gets the final point from de la Rosa, 10th in the race.

The rest of the point-scoring positions remain unchanged.

The stewards also announced a 20-second penalty for Virgin's Timo Glock for ignoring blue flags.
 
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But they couldn't really. They both started on the softer of the 2 tyres, so couldn't have went as long as Kamui could. It only worked for the Sauber because he started on the harder tyre and could go very long, before changing onto the soft for a sprint.

They could have dropped Massa in later for his hards, like 1 lap later while they were still under safety car. It would have screwed him far less as at that point most of the field were still following and pitting, so Massa would have had a slight better overlap than he did waiting behind Alonso + waiting for his tyres.
Of course, hindsight helps but even so, Ferrari were mostly screwed for Massa at least because of stacking. Alonso was just unlucky.

I see the stewards used their special "do what you like" rule, as I don't believe 5 second penalties exist in the rulebook? Ferrari hence throw a tantrum :lol:.
 
They could have dropped Massa in later for his hards, like 1 lap later while they were still under safety car. It would have screwed him far less as at that point most of the field were still following and pitting, so Massa would have had a slight better overlap than he did waiting behind Alonso + waiting for his tyres.
Of course, hindsight helps but even so, Ferrari were mostly screwed for Massa at least because of stacking. Alonso was just unlucky.

I see the stewards used their special "do what you like" rule, as I don't believe 5 second penalties exist in the rulebook? Ferrari hence throw a tantrum :lol:.

Didn't Schumacher pit one lap later than the Ferrari's? Look what happened to him.


5 second penalties? Seriously what's the point.
 
Schumacher was already far further back, pitted twice to get the soft tyres out of the way and he had brake temperature problems. Plus the Mercedes was way off the pace this weekend.
Massa would have still dropped back regardless what Ferrari did, but I think stacking him like that cost him more than 1 lap with the safety car potentially.
 
Poor Alonso. To win some points back via penalties... and yet win so little... :lol:

Heikki didn't move right... Jeez we had this same argument at Turkey. A driver is allowed one move. But if they approach the corner in a blocking position like Kovalainen did, that doesn't count as a manoevre. He moved over the racing line for the braking zone (That is the one move that he is allowed), and Webber moved over thinking that Heikki was going to run wide to let him past because he was in a slower car. He was wrong, and it caused the end of his race.

And it won't get any better. Get the foil hats out, folks... this one will be discussed to death until Silverstone.

It did look like a twitch, but looking back, yes, it seems like it was merely Hekki pulling up to the proper line for braking. And he was braking. Webber didn't expect him to be braking because Webber was simply going too fast. If he'd pulled on the inside of Hekki, he may have been in danger of overshooting the corner. Which is why Lotus is saying that Webber braked too late.

Even if people want to assign blame to Kovalainen, that was at least 90% Webber's fault. You're the guy overtaking, pull out and pass the man! Don't ram it up his tailpipe, swerve into his sidepod or poke a hole in his tire by nudging him aside... pull out and make.it.stick.

Hmmm... Mark doesn't blame Hekki.

http://en.espnf1.com/f1/motorsport/story/21640.html

He wishes Hekki moved aside, but he admits he was caught out by how early the Lotus was braking. Hekki thinks Mark missed his braking point, but Mark says that the Lotus's braking point was much earlier than his, which is why he got caught out.

So, apparently, Hekki was running his race, braking where he thought he should be (and probably correctly, which is why the team backs him up), but the big problem is, the RBR has much better brakes, and Mark wasn't ready for that big a difference.

Makes sense.
 
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Red Bull really gives you wings and you fly like Webber did! I suppose I jinxed him by picking him to win!

Unfortunate racing incident but happens; glad Webber is OK.

An interesting race for Valencia now lets get to the next one!
 
What I meant was more so that Schumacher was stopped in the pit lane to let the pack pass. Wouldn't Massa have been stopped too till the pack passes?
 
5 second penalties? Seriously what's the point.
To annoy Fernando Alonso... good enough reason, really.

Seriously, I thought Alonso's whinging about Hamilton and the whole saftey car incident was nothing short of pathetic.
 
Do like (most) drivers and focus on the next race! :)

See you at Silverstone:tup:

That in car camera of Webber's was amazing see the clouds and blue sky:scared::dopey::)
 
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