2012 Canadian Grand Prix

  • Thread starter Ross
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It might be simply his driving style. But then again, I do think a driver of a caliber such as Button's should be able to adapt to a certain style instead of expecting a compound to work like he wants it to.
 
Bram Turismo
It might be simply his driving style. But then again, I do think a driver of a caliber such as Button's should be able to adapt to a certain style instead of expecting a compound to work like he wants it to.
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That's the opposite of what I see Button as. He really doesn't adapt his driving style to the situation like a driver like Alonso does. Button is always smooth, accurate, and soft. It's consistent, and should be tyre freindly, but these Pirellis are working against him. His driving style isn't the best at getting heat into the tyres, and so he will struggle to get the front in, which leads to locking up and understeer, which kills his laptimes, as well as compromising tyre wear.

Jenson didn't struggle so much last year, because last year's car was a lot better at getting heat into the tyres, and there was significantly more downforce as well, which helped put more energy into the tyre.
 
Well it seams these tires allow drivers to push them through corners, but get ruined by braking and traction. Maybe that's the trick. I saw the one stoppers do some great driving today, keeping great pace, but still making them last.

Maybe Button is trying too hard to save them, and in the wrong way.
 
That is what I'm trying to say; If Button can't get heat into the tyres with smooth driving, he should be able to adapt to a more aggressive style. Surely a champion and such an experienced driver as Button should be able to adapt to the equipment brought to him.
 
Right...so I missed the race today. :ouch: I know that Lewis won (yay :D), but who else was in the top 5? (and any particular highlights?)
 
Yes, we see drivers weaving a lot between fast laps in practice, more than in the past I think. These tires like getting "twisted" but not spun or locked.
 
LMSCorvetteGT2
1. Hamilton
2. Grosjean
3. Perez
4. Vettel
5. Alonso
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Wow. :eek: That's quite a result! Lotus-Renault have really stepped up there game, and I'm sure the guys at Sauber were happy with Perez. 👍 Kinda sad/happy that the Kings (RBR) aren't dominating in their usual fashion this year.
 
hornet_burnout
Well it seams these tires allow drivers to push them through corners, but get ruined by braking and traction. Maybe that's the trick. I saw the one stoppers do some great driving today, keeping great pace, but still making them last.

Maybe Button is trying too hard to save them, and in the wrong way.
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I think it's the other way around. They seem to provide good traction, but the tyres will rip themselves apart and deteriorate in a corner if you push them too hard. The soft tyre walls that we have now is the cause of this, it's also why the tyres are so badly damaged from lockups this year.

Bram Turismo
That is what I'm trying to say; If Button can't get heat into the tyres with smooth driving, he should be able to adapt to a more aggressive style. Surely a champion and such an experienced driver as Button should be able to adapt to the equipment brought to him.
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As Martin Brundle has said years ago, drivers will tend to advance and refine their own personal driving style, rather than to adapt it to the conditions which they find themselves in. It's just their nature, and Jenson has been driving like that for the past 12 years.
 
Fun race today. But then again Canada always puts on a good race. Seven from Seven. Before we know it we'll have 20 different winners from 20 different races. Shame for Schumy. He just doesn't have an ounce of luck this year. If I were him I would retire again.


Driver of the day: Sebastain Vettel.
 
astrosdude91
Fun race today. But then again Canada always puts on a good race. Seven from Seven. Before we know it we'll have 20 different winners from 20 different races. Shame for Schumy. He just doesn't have an ounce of luck this year. If I were him I would retire again.


Driver of the day: Sebastain Vettel.
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Please explain

speed157
Wow. :eek: That's quite a result! Lotus-Renault have really stepped up there game, and I'm sure the guys at Sauber were happy with Perez. 👍 Kinda sad/happy that the Kings (RBR) aren't dominating in their usual fashion this year.
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Yeah good day for them, Vettel and Alonso had a different strategy that didn't work out in the end, either way Lewis was catching and pulling faster and faster laps.
 
Sebastian Vettel. By far the best driver in the field. If it wasn't for his race engineers letting him down, he would've run away with this one. He has brilliant race craft. So he get's driver of the day honors.
 
LMSCorvetteGT2
Once again how?
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Qualified 15th finished 3rd, drove through the field with very quick consistent driving, yet being very good on his tyres. He's had the pace and patience which gained him 12 places.
 
Hamilton was perfect, making the most of what he had, unlike his team mate and Alonso and Vettel. But Perez drove a superb race and my drive of the day is his.

3rd best Grosjean, and I also have to mention Maldonado who climbed well from 22nd.

Vettel tries to run with the lead, then holds back to try a one stopper only to fail and have to pit again in the end. Terrible race craft IMO.

1st was the tires that did that, now it's the team...
 
Indeed. Compared with Kobayashi who was strong all weekend, started 11th and finished 9th, and is definitely no slouch, Perez's race is outstanding.


edit:
on the Button thing, Martin Whitmarsh said:

"we, his team, failed to provide him with the tools with which to do the brilliant job we all know he’s capable of, and which he did so superbly here last year. He lost track time on Friday through no fault of his own, was unable to qualify as well as he would have done had he not lost that track time, and may have been further troubled today by a suspension set-up, different from Lewis’s, that left him with excessive rear tyre wear. We’ll have to check that out."
 
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astrosdude91
Sebastian Vettel. By far the best driver in the field. If it wasn't for his race engineers letting him down, he would've run away with this one. He has brilliant race craft. So he get's driver of the day honors.
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Man astrodude I really like you (no really), but I love it how hard you troll here. :lol: (actually makes me laugh)
 
Bram Turismo
Starting from 15th, finishing third, setting fastest laptimes all over the place, making a 1-stopper work like no other driver does.

In a Sauber.


Drive of the day by a large margin.
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First off it's been documented that the car is alot easier on the tires that many others, that's point one. Point two however is that he wasn't making fast laps everywhere and his fastest lap wasn't achieved till lap 67, he did have the second best sector two time of the race. Let's not make the Sauber out to be the same type of car it has been the past two years, it is far better. The only thing I can really agree with here is that he moved up the field greatly with the help of one stop as well and the help of Vettel and Alonso's strategies not working in the end.

Truth is he raced hard to get up there but let's not stretch it out as if the car couldn't isn't capable of what we saw today. All in all he made the best out of his car and it helped in the end.

astrosdude91
Sebastian Vettel. By far the best driver in the field. If it wasn't for his race engineers letting him down, he would've run away with this one. He has brilliant race craft. So he get's driver of the day honors.
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Spoken like a true Vettel fan, you're doing well sticking to your cause though. As said last year when Hamilton had his awful strategies, it is as much his fault as his engineers. I can actually be swayed and agree that Perez had the best day, but Vettel salvaged his day.

I'd say Hamilton had the best day, but looking through the stats and team work as well as race craft, I'd have to give it to both Lewis and Sergio.
 
Driver of the day in my opinion was Grojean, good racing and made his strategy work

Moment of the day was Massa, Rosberg and Perez all going for it through the final chicane. :)
 
LMSCorvetteGT2
First off it's been documented that the car is alot easier on the tires that many others, that's point one. Point two however is that he wasn't making fast laps everywhere and his fastest lap wasn't achieved till lap 67, he did have the second best sector two time of the race. Let's not make the Sauber out to be the same type of car it has been the past two years, it is far better. The only thing I can really agree with here is that he moved up the field greatly with the help of one stop as well and the help of Vettel and Alonso's strategies not working in the end.

Truth is he raced hard to get up there but let's not stretch it out as if the car couldn't isn't capable of what we saw today. All in all he made the best out of his car and it helped in the end.
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Perez overtook:

Ricciardo
Hulkenberg
Raikkonen
Kobayashi
Button
Schumacher
Di Resta
Massa
Rosberg
Webber
Alonso
Vettel

I don't think you should try to undermine his performance. Let's not stretch it out as if the car is regularly capable of what we saw today. Even if his car was evenly matched with the drivers listed, gaining 12 positions is still a great achievement (Had it been a Red Bull or a Mclaren, it would've been a 'great recovery drive'). I do not believe the car was as good on it's tyres as you say, it's just that he pitted near the middle of the race whereas most others on one stops pitted around lap 20-25. I think there was very little time difference between a 2 stop and a one stop, if the pit windows were split evenly.

EDIT: But after reading the second half of your post, it seems you agree that it was a good drive.
 
astrosdude91
Sebastian Vettel. By far the best driver in the field. If it wasn't for his race engineers letting him down, he would've run away with this one. He has brilliant race craft. So he get's driver of the day honors.
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Qualifying 1st and finishing 4th is not nearly drive of the day. Vettel tried to run away in the opening laps, but Lewis and Alonso would have none of that, and while Vettel ran down his tyres, they waited and pounced. When Vettel ended up in 3rd, he fell off the radar, and it became a Lewis vs. Alonso affair.

He's lucky Alonso didn't stop otherwise he'd have been 5th. Drive of the day has to be Perez, Grosjean or Hamilton.
 
astrosdude91
Sebastian Vettel. By far the best driver in the field. If it wasn't for his race engineers letting him down, he would've run away with this one. He has brilliant race craft. So he get's driver of the day honors.
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Dude, I'm as big a Vettel fan as anyone but you have to be smoking crack if you think Alonso isn't the best driver in the field.
 
Seismica
Perez overtook:

Ricciardo
Hulkenberg
Raikkonen
Kobayashi
Button
Schumacher
Di Resta
Massa
Rosberg
Webber
Alonso
Vettel

I don't think you should try to undermine his performance. Let's not stretch it out as if the car is regularly capable of what we saw today. Even if his car was evenly matched with the drivers listed, gaining 12 positions is still a great achievement (Had it been a Red Bull or a Mclaren, it would've been a 'great recovery drive'). I do not believe the car was as good on it's tyres as you say, it's just that he pitted near the middle of the race whereas most others on one stops pitted around lap 20-25. I think there was very little time difference between a 2 stop and a one stop, if the pit windows were split evenly.

EDIT: But after reading the second half of your post, it seems you agree that it was a good drive.
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Why I usually tell people to read it through, I'm not undermining it at all, I acknowledge it was great, but when people tend to make it out as his car is just a step above that bottom three I challenge that. He made the most out of his car and pulled off a great drive, and it's been seen during the season that the cars good on tires more so than others, Sepang was one.
 

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