2013 Petronas Malaysian Grand Prix

  • Thread starter Thread starter lbsf1
  • 1,092 comments
  • 56,743 views
Müle;8309055
Does anyone honestly still like Vettel after this?

If so, why?

I HATE him even more. Helmut Marko can go fall in a wildfire for all i care.:banghead:

As for Kimi, i would be frustrated too. :grumpy:
 
Also with Mercedes, Brawn told Rosberg there's nothing up the road for you stay behind him. What about the podium?

That bothered me quite a bit. I know Hamilton had slowed down to maintain the pace that Mercedes wanted him to, but I still think Rosberg was clearly faster on this last stint and would have been able to pass in one of the DRS zones. He was robbed of a Podium finish. Something most drivers don't ever achieve in their driving career and would kill for that kind of result.

Lewis said it himself whilst on the Podium, being interviewed by Martin Brundle. He said that it should have been Rosberg up there, but because of what the team wanted, that's not how it was.

I completely understand the fact that teams have to maintain control over both of their drivers in the race and to make sure they get the maximum amount of points possible, but when it takes away opportunities like that for drivers, I think it's wrong. 👎
 
I was just thinking, after reading several posts here and elsewhere...

People are mad because Vettel disobeyed team orders and consequently passed Webber, but at the same time are mad that Rosberg obeyed team orders by not passing Hamilton. So, in one instance a driver is criticized for disobeying orders and in another it's because a driver obeyed team orders. Clearly, it depends on how folks feel about the driver in question. It's popular to hate Hamilton so the cool kids wanted him passed by Rosberg, but it's popular to hate Vettel winning so the cool kids wanted him not to pass.
 
Wow. Talk about tension...

But I think that the Mercedes team did the right thing by allowing Lewis to stay in front, mainly because they knew that Lewis' fuel problem was their fault rather than any fault of Lewis, so they took it upon themselves to keep the positioning how it would have been if they hadn't screwed up his fuel load.

In fact, it would have been interesting to see if Lewis (or indeed Nico) could have challenged the RedBulls if it weren't for those problems.

I agree the Vettel did the wrong by disobeying the team orders, but I also think the RedBull did wrong by putting those team orders there in the first place.
 
I think Vettel did the right thing. I also think that Mercedes as a team did the wrong thing. I don't take driver sides, I appreciate the racing, but today that racing was being over-ridden by team orders.
 
Looks like your video is only available to be viewed by Kim-Jong and his mates.
 
I'm gonna had my opinion, first about he Vettel-Webber incident. I understand both driver and even if I'm not a fan of Vettel and I hate how he cried on the radio to get the pass, I understand the move he made. People like him, by that I mean winner, wants to win if they can. Letting your team mate win is not an option to them and I find that quite good. If I were Webber I would be super pissed. Not an easy situation.

As for Rosberg. He passed Lewis several time on 1st drs zone just to be overtaken again in the 2nd (that was a bit before he got told to stay behind). My question is, why didnt he try to overtake him in the 2nd drs zone, ensuring himself a position he would have deserved ? Maybe I missed something.
 
I might be wrong but recently (before the race) I thought the SkyF1 team analysed one of McLaren's pit stops and pointed out that whilst they were quick, there were teething problems. One of which being the wheel gun man raising his hand to indicate the nut was on before it was actually on. They also said that this would cost the team one day....

Jenson had a solid 5th in a struggling car if not for another issue with the McLaren not due to the driver.
 
Skipped 2 sessions at Uni to watch this,Surprised people say it was an entertaining race,It was anything but imo,.That Seb Mark battle was fantastic along side the Lewis Nico one ,but those lasted for what 4-5 laps,only exctiment came from The Hulk who was brilliant and constant fights from 5th to 10th.

Stunning Start from Mark Webber,Good drive by Massa to recover.Oh and more entertainment came during the pitstops .

I do understand abit why ALonso did not pit ,but kind of a daft choice there.

All 3 podium finishers were upset sums it all up.
 
I was just thinking, after reading several posts here and elsewhere...

People are mad because Vettel disobeyed team orders and consequently passed Webber, but at the same time are mad that Rosberg obeyed team orders by not passing Hamilton. So, in one instance a driver is criticized for disobeying orders and in another it's because a driver obeyed team orders. Clearly, it depends on how folks feel about the driver in question. It's popular to hate Hamilton so the cool kids wanted him passed by Rosberg, but it's popular to hate Vettel winning so the cool kids wanted him not to pass.

👍
This has always been the case. I remember 2010 when all the Alonso haters would not shut up about his bid for the tittle being invalid if he were to win. Those same people would not say the same now about what happened today. It is understandable though, we all prefer certain teams and drivers and we try to defend them when these incidents occur.
 
There have always been team orders in F1. To think this is a recent occurrence is quite ignorant of the sport's history.

And as far as the tires go, I am happy with any situation as long as the rules are the same for everyone. When we had perfect tires, people were complaining about them being able to last the whole race (Vettel in monza 2010). Now we get people complaining about them degrading. The truth is that no matter the regulations, someone is going to disagree with them. The thing that we should be worried about is DRS.

I know there have been for a long time, Im just saying I dislike it. Dont assume.

Having the field race hard against each other instead of getting pegged back and told to hold position is the much better proposition like it or not.
 
Alonso didn't pit as he wanted his stop to coincide with a switch to slicks, little did he know just how damaged his wing was. He thought there was no point pitting for inters (of which he had no new sets) and then 5 laps later for dry tyres. That is around 30 seconds lost already for the new wing stop.
 
I was just thinking, after reading several posts here and elsewhere...

People are mad because Vettel disobeyed team orders and consequently passed Webber, but at the same time are mad that Rosberg obeyed team orders by not passing Hamilton. So, in one instance a driver is criticized for disobeying orders and in another it's because a driver obeyed team orders. Clearly, it depends on how folks feel about the driver in question. It's popular to hate Hamilton so the cool kids wanted him passed by Rosberg, but it's popular to hate Vettel winning so the cool kids wanted him not to pass.

For me personally I'm not hating on Vettel. And I also think the cases for RBR and Mercedes were completely different.

The 1-2 was in the bag for RBR for a long time, so both drivers could simply save their tyres and most importantly their engines for the next upcoming races. But for some reason Vettel felt the need to prove the world once again he is the fastest driver, and pushed the car to its limits to get the win. I think he's just being greedy. Your drivers are 1-2, you tell both of them through the radio to just save fuel, engine and tyres and bring it home. Suddenly one of your drivers chooses to completely ignore what you just asked of him, and leap-frogs your other driver for the victory. Sure, it didn't matter in the end who crossed the finish line first. But Vettel pretty much gave an impression of "Hey Christian, I gave you your 3 WDC's. I don't really give a damn about what you ask of me, just give me my win!" It's just Vettel starting to put himself as someone larger than the team. And no matter how much succes you have with a team, there's still people you need to obey. Note also that I'm not justifying Mark's choice of ignoring what his team asked of him in 2011. But neither did I really like Vettel ruining his car, and then just freely getting his parts off of Webber's car in 2010.

In Mercedes' case, Hamilton was trying his best to save his tyres and fuel. Because of his driving style, he is always going to use more fuel and tyre than others do. I mean, his last stint was a 14-lap stint on tyres that had already seen some mileage. Rosberg, on the other hand, did not had to apply the same passive driving and was therefore the faster Mercedes of the two during his last stint. During the last few laps, I bet Rosberg was able to post a lot quicker times than Hamilton could. In fact, I think Hamilton had to save fuel and tyres so much during the last lap that he probably could barely resist to a move from Rosberg at all. And yet Brawn denied Rosberg his move. But why? Hamilton was so much slower that he could not put up a fight anyway, so why not give Rosberg the chance of a podium? I think it's just a classic Brawn-case of "Nope, sorry kid, you're number two in here." Rosberg is way too kind of a kid to be driving under Brawn, but sadly I think Mercedes is going to be his only chance of being at a top-team. He's already been in F1 since 2006, and yet he hasn't had a single car in which I feel he could really go for it. He more than deserved a podium finish today, even Hamilton admitted it, but seems Brawn thinks otherwise.

I really hope Mercedes can keep this form up. But let's not forget Rosberg won here at Sepang last year, and a few races later they were absolutely nowhere for the remainder of the season.
 
I might be wrong but recently (before the race) I thought the SkyF1 team analysed one of McLaren's pit stops and pointed out that whilst they were quick, there were teething problems. One of which being the wheel gun man raising his hand to indicate the nut was on before it was actually on. They also said that this would cost the team one day....

Jenson had a solid 5th in a struggling car if not for another issue with the McLaren not due to the driver.

Yep, It's kind of a shame, the team has, and has had so much potential (especially when Lewis was with them), but time and time again the team makes stupid little mistakes that cost them big time.

They could have easily won the drivers and constructors championships last year if it weren't for these kind of incidents.
 
Why would Lewis be upset at all ?

From his interview I think it was because he spent a lot of the race in fuel conservation mode, so couldn't really push up to the Red Bulls and achieve the maximum position he could. Plus he sounded a bit bummed out because of the situation with Rosberg, they are fairly good friends so I doubt it was nice for him with the team denying Rosberg a podium when it was basically because of him.

He still drove well though, that Mercedes isn't half as bad as most thought it would be. He may even be in with a shout of the championship.
 
It was a really bad day for Force India as well...and Lotus compared to last Sunday..
 
From his interview I think it was because he spent a lot of the race in fuel conservation mode, so couldn't really push up to the Red Bulls and achieve the maximum position he could. Plus he sounded a bit bummed out because of the situation with Rosberg, they are fairly good friends so I doubt it was nice for him with the team denying Rosberg a podium when it was basically because of him.

He still drove well though, that Mercedes isn't half as bad as most thought it would be. He may even be in with a shout of the championship.

Oh yeah I didnt think of things that way, I didnt watch podium nor interview I had to go out right after the GP.

I dont think he got a shot at the championship, I hope he's gonna prove me wrong tho ^^ Mercedes werent able to keep up with the upgrade pace of RBR, ferrari, Mclaren and Lotus last year so that's why I doubt it. And if Vettel is already that strong he's probably gonna be hard to beat.
 
Pleased for Mercedes, great pit stops too.

I think Vettel knows he did wrong, its bad for the fans but the race was done and decided, Mark earned that one and went into saving mode.
 
How is it being 'trolled'? He went against a team agreement and screwed over his team-mate. His reputation is permanently damaged and the rest of the team are angry at him, nobody wins.

Screw that team agreements and what not. Vettel saw an opening and he took it. If Webber wanted that win then he shouldn't have let Vettel have that opening in the first place.

And what does Vettel care about reputation? As far as he's concerned he's the guy that brought RBR 3 championships. Webber just got punked by a better driver at the end of the day.
 
Why would Lewis be upset at all ?

Him and Nico are best buds,even he said he didn't deserve the podium.

Oh and Mclaren really need to improve,Jensen drove well,Perez needs to improve massivly .
 
I know there have been for a long time, Im just saying I dislike it. Dont assume.

Having the field race hard against each other instead of getting pegged back and told to hold position is the much better proposition like it or not.

In a perfect world, yes, I agree with you. Put yourself in the shoes of the team bosses though.

This only happens because there are two championships being fought for at the same time. The teams obviously care about the constructors tittle and the drivers for their own, naturally. Try to think how different things would be if one of those were removed. If we removed the WDC, team orders would be completely understandable and expected. If the WCC was removed, F1 would work more like the way Prototype teams operate at le mans where there are different squads for each manufacturer. Not to mention there probably would not be any teams staying in the sport if there was no tittle for them. That is the one that brings in the money for the teams anyway. A driver's tittle is nice to have, but it does not pay the bills in Formula 1.

In my opinion, the WDC does not mean much anyway (in F1). It's more a representation of which car and driver combination was best for that year. You rarely see a driver with an inferior car win a tittle. Also you have situations like we have right now, where Vettel, Button, Hamilton, Raikkonen and Alonso all have won a championship and a very good argument could be made about each one of these guys being the best on the grid. Gilles Villenueve never won and is considered to be one of the best ever by many people. If the WDC is not a good representation of who is the best, what is the point anyway? I am a Ferrari in the end and would like to see them win constructors. I don't care which of their divers gets the tittle or if neither of them do to be honest. A great diver is a great driver even if he never wins a tittle.
 
I'm not going to get into it all because it's all rather silly but I think the tensions are great for the sporting spectacle. It's like someone said earlier, it's getting to be like Neal & Plato and when things aren't always exciting on track a bit of tension is great. Shame the next race is three weeks away.
 
This is taking away from all the other things that happened in the race.
Ferrari messed up and their pace seemed to be off
Lotus was also off the pace
Both Force India cars are out of the race due to wheel nuts I presume? Were they faulty?
Mclaren still having reliability issues to add to their lack of pace.
 
Putting all the negatives aside. I'm just glad that Massa seems to be getting back to his old ways again. A huge improvement compared to last year.
 
Back