Owen.C93
Ignore what Dawkins said. People do bad things and sometimes certain people are genetically more likely to be bad people.
Atheists have morals because they are good people, not because they are threatened with unimaginable pain for eternity in the afterlife.
I'm not going to ignore what Dawkins said, because it seems to me that it makes sense in the atheist viewpoint. If everything's just by 'chance', 'probability' or 'accident', then I cannot see how we could classify absolute 'wrong' and absolute 'right'.
And I know the majority of atheists are nice people. I'm not saying that you can't be good without believing in God. I know both good and bad atheists, and both good and bad Christians.
What I am saying however is that unless there is an absolute moral law, we can't say what's 'good' and 'bad' - it would just be a matter of opinion.
I believe that there is an absolute moral law, and it is given by an absolute law giver (namely God).
Azuremen
You can't understand it because you refuse to acknowledge that morality isn't tied to religion, nor are the concepts of Good and Evil.
I believe that morality is in an absolute moral law. I accept that the concept of good and evil are not tied to religion, but what I don't understand is how we could differentiate between the two without an absolute moral law.
I know that we all have a sense of morality, and as I have said above I know that wether you are a good person or not isn't linked to whatever faith or lack of belief you have.
Azuremen
I do not believe in an afterlife, nor much of any religious notions. I have no need for "justice" after death, and honestly, feeling that something like "justice" is needed in the beyond just sounds like someone wanting vengeance. Punishing someone in the beyond would not undo what they did, nor would it honestly make anyone feel better about it. But you'll argue "people want justice and they do feel better when it is delivered," but I find that rather selfish anyhow.
I'm not really sure what you mean here. There is a fine line between justice and vengeance. Justice, to my understanding is trying to get fairness. When we understand that that the Christian afterlife is not finite like the state in which we currently inhabit, we see that many of our original thoughts change.
And at the heart of the Christian faith you will find forgiveness. Pride and hate are evil in the Christian view.
And before we get any further I honestly don't have a proper stance of my views of the afterlife as of yet. Many atheists get angry when a Christian explains the concepts of the afterlife - particularly hell. I honestly don't know enough as of yet.
Azuremen
People choose what they want and what they feel they need. Most injustice arises from people thinking they need something they do not - it is all internal, suffering and ill will. Well, excusing those that have psychological issues that do not see the wrong in killing another but that is a different topic. You want a world in which balance is brought after death, but do you need this? No, but it makes you feel better, along with the idea that you'll be rewarded for "good" deeds in your life. Hardly altruistic, at the least. Really more of way to bribe people into behaving, kind like telling a kid they can have a cookie if they do their chores. Just more human ambition, which really is the cause of many people's own suffering.
I think you are looking at this as if people were brought into the Christian faith through fear. I find this totally false (at least in my case). The second thing is that I think you are looking at this as if Christians wouldn't be good people if they discontinued their belief (for the 'Christians' that are good anyway). I see that false (at least in my case). Before I became a Christian, I didn't go around vandalising and kicking cats and stuff. I had an instinct of right and wrong, and I did keep to it usually (obviously no one is perfect).
Even more, I think you are looking at this as if Christianity was some sort of false sense of comfort which drew people in. I find that also wrong (at least in my case). Being a early Christian (which I still am), I can tell you that it is very hard. It's a big change to your overall lifestyle. You even have to get rid of bad pieces of your personality.
Azuremen
Certainly, if there is a God, he doesn't much care anyhow. People mention the Holocaust in here as a point of what Evil is. It was a truly horrible event, on the largest scale. We do not need a religion to tell us this; it goes against most all of human nature - murdering millions of people. But why would God allow this if he was just, and how would punishing the men responsible some how "fix" the tragedy? But even more tragic is the idea that because those that died were Jewish, they won't be saved by the Christian God anyhow, as they did not believe in Christ. And this is why I don't see how Religion somehow makes things "Right" and "Wrong" when it can allow such absurdity.
I can't talk for other religions, I can only talk for my own.
There is a difference between God allowing something to happen and God approving of something.
God does not 'pull strings' as if we were puppets, he gives us free will. God is just. He didn't cause the holocaust, it was evil men who caused it.