FITT Ford Challenges by MCH

@Motor City Hami

Toe -0.75/-0.95

Wow, You weren't kidding. That's bucket loads of toe right there.

I have a question about the transmission - Does it change if you install it first, before all the power upgrades? Because that's the way I did mine. I had no idea it changed if it does.

@biffa3 You can read this discussion from the Hot Hatch Challenge when it was discovered that the fixed ratio trans numbers changed.
We had tested this during the Hot Hatch, and I was surprised it happened too, but yes, when adding parts, the non-adjustable transmissions will be different according to when it was installed.
This is my post of evidence.
 
We had tested this during the Hot Hatch, and I was surprised it happened too, but yes, when adding parts, the non-adjustable transmissions will be different according to when it was installed.
This is my post of evidence.

Hmm, In that case I may need to edit my post. Need to see how the new transmission fares on the track.
 
Ford Mustang Boss 302 2013


550 PP
566 HP
1,344 KG
54:46 weight distribution
2.37 power to weight

Tires: sports hard

Suspension: Fully customized

Ride Height 95/90
Spring Rate 6.50/7.25
Damper Compression 5/4
Damper Extension 5/4
Anti Roll Bar 4/4
Camber 0/0
Toe Angle -0.04/+0.09

Racing Brakes 7/6



Transmission
FG 5.000
Max Speed 124 MPH

1st 3.094
2nd 2.395
3rd 1.910
4th 1.567
5th 1.323
6th 1.151
FG 3.375

Drivetrain: Fully Customized

/7
/10
/12

Triple Plate Clutch
Carbon Drive Shaft

Power:

Power Limiter 100%
Stage 1 engine tuning
Racing exhaust
Catalytic Converter: Sports
Intake tuning

Body

Ballast 25kg
Ballast position 41

Stage 3 weight reduction
Carbon Hood (body color)
window weight reduction
sport soft are allowed, just fyi.
 
Hmm, In that case I may need to edit my post. Need to see how the new transmission fares on the track.

After the findings in the Hot Hatch competition I always install power parts before transmission, and I did for yours. Do we think it makes that much difference?
 
I also test both cars and I run how many laps with @CyKosis1973 online but at last I think I will go for the 2006 , and I'm not sure that I did a good tune because I was running 1:02.xxx and I get two laps down to 1:01.4xx , Sorry for my late but tune it will be post in 5 hrs after I'm back home from work ,thanks Sir

ND

It is ok. The deadline is tonight anyway. You have time.

@Motor City Hami

Toe -0.75/-0.95

Wow, You weren't kidding. That's bucket loads of toe right there.

I usually have fear of going too high on those settings, but it just kept working so I kept raising the number.
 
After the findings in the Hot Hatch competition I always install power parts before transmission, and I did for yours. Do we think it makes that much difference?

In the case for my car, I think it does. I just tested it. The new transmission makes the car more wheel-spiny and harder to drive at least in automatic trim. I just didn't know about the transmission thing when I said my car was done. If allowed I would much prefer to keep my old transmission. I don't think normally it would make a difference, but it does when the car is tuned in accordance to prior settings.

@Motor City Hami What do you say?
 
In the case for my car, I think it does. I just tested it. The new transmission makes the car more wheel-spiny and harder to drive at least in automatic trim. I just didn't know about the transmission thing when I said my car was done. If allowed I would much prefer to keep my old transmission

@Motor City Hami What do you say?


Deadline is tonight so you have time to make changes. You'll need to list the order to install the parts ( and you should probably bold not to install power parts first) and it might be a good idea to list the gear ratios too.
 
Deadline is tonight so you have time to make changes. You'll need to list the order to install the parts ( and you should probably bold not to install power parts first) and it might be a good idea to list the gear ratios too.

Here are the two ratio sheets for reference

Tran - Old (No Power upgrades installed)
1 - 2.777
2 - 1.917
3 - 1.420
4 - 1.102
5 - 0.895
6 - 0.761
FN - 4.062


Tran - New (After Stage 2 and Exhaust upgrade)

2.896
1.999
1.481
1.149
0.933
0.793
4.062

I'll make the edit as long as @Motor City Hami says its okay.
 
Here are the two ratio sheets for reference

Tran - Old (No Power upgrades installed)
1 - 2.777
2 - 1.917
3 - 1.420
4 - 1.102
5 - 0.895
6 - 0.761
FN - 4.062


Tran - New (After Stage 2 and Exhaust upgrade)

2.896
1.999
1.481
1.149
0.933
0.793
4.062

I'll make the edit as long as @Motor City Hami says its okay.
I think as long as you clearly state the method you used to reach the settings in the tune notes then you're fine. There is no rule saying that all cars must have transmissions reset, its more just a common practice to prevent confusion
 
In the case for my car, I think it does. I just tested it. The new transmission makes the car more wheel-spiny and harder to drive at least in automatic trim.
I tested your car the other day, and I did the transmission at the end...force of habit like @biffa3 stated. You say you did yours in automatic? I found that it loved to bounce of the rev limiter...really loved it! It helped with being able to stand on the gas on the left hander coming out of the tight turns, but hurt it in other areas. I thought me driving it in auto was the issue...maybe the transmission setting is a huge difference...:confused:
 
I tested your car the other day, and I did the transmission at the end...force of habit like @biffa3 stated. You say you did yours in automatic? I found that it loved to bounce of the rev limiter...really loved it! It helped with being able to stand on the gas on the left hander coming out of the tight turns, but hurt it in other areas. I thought me driving it in auto was the issue...maybe the transmission setting is a huge difference...:confused:

I've always tested and tuned with an automatic - shame on me :lol:

It bounces off 2nd gear regardless of the old or new settings. The only difference is with the new transmission settings it understeers more cause it shifts into 3rd sooner (More power where I wasn't used to having it) . I wouldn't say the difference in laptime is huge, but it's much easier to drive and go fast using the old settings (Tranny before power upgrades).

Edit: I added my fast lap below.
 
I've always tested and tuned with an automatic - shame on me :lol:

It bounces off 2nd gear regardless of the old or new settings. The only difference is with the new transmission settings it understeers more cause it shifts into 3rd sooner (More power where I wasn't used to having it) . I wouldn't say the difference in laptime is huge, but it's much easier to drive and go fast using the old settings (Tranny before power upgrades).

Edit: I added my fast lap below.

Fair play to you, you've got far better throttle control than I do...I'm always lighting up the tires till they are red on accel!
 
Fair play to you, you've got far better throttle control than I do...I'm always lighting up the tires till they are red on accel!

The only thing I can suggest is not to use the fun pedal when your front tires are on the red and white curbs. Those things have like no grip. I use the sticks for throttle/brakes/steering
 
I'll make the edit as long as @Motor City Hami says its okay.

You still have time to make changes. The transmissions will need to be reset prior to each test drive.


I think as long as you clearly state the method you used to reach the settings in the tune notes then you're fine. There is no rule saying that all cars must have transmissions reset, its more just a common practice to prevent confusion

Do I really need to add a rule for this? I can. It would be unfair to exploit the system like that. His car would not have wheel spin after curbs and everyone else would.
 
I've always tested and tuned with an automatic - shame on me :lol:

It bounces off 2nd gear regardless of the old or new settings. The only difference is with the new transmission settings it understeers more cause it shifts into 3rd sooner (More power where I wasn't used to having it) . I wouldn't say the difference in laptime is huge, but it's much easier to drive and go fast using the old settings (Tranny before power upgrades).
Fantastic throttle control there, I see my issue with driving, I don't make the tires talk enough.

Fair play to you, you've got far better throttle control than I do...I'm always lighting up the tires till they are red on accel!
Same here! Need to stop that habit, slows us down...

what colour are they supposed to be? I thought they only came in red :confused:
yes yes they do, Blue, white, yellow and orange. :lol:
 
You still have time to make changes. The transmissions will need to be reset prior to each test drive.




Do I really need to add a rule for this? I can. It would be unfair to exploit the system like that. His car would not have wheel spin after curbs and everyone else would.

A bit confused as to what I have to do. Can I leave the old tranny on, or must I use the new (Install after Power Upgrades). I plead ignorance to the whole thing as I genuinely had no idea, I didn't mean to use a potential exploit :D. If it's the new, I'll get tuning tonight to make adjustments to accommodate the new power curve.
 
Just a couple of heads up.

@Otaliema has +1 rims listed in his tune post

@xande1959 also has +1 rims listed, as well as a custom transmission. I also can't get the numbers to add up. The weight of his car states 1206kg, but you get this with 35kg ballast, not 50kg with windows and hood added. Can you double check.
 
A bit confused as to what I have to do. Can I leave the old tranny on, or must I use the new (Install after Power Upgrades). I plead ignorance to the whole thing as I genuinely had no idea, I didn't mean to use a potential exploit :D. If it's the new, I'll get tuning tonight to make adjustments to accommodate the new power curve.
You need to use the reset transmission.
Don't worry it won't affect most of your tune just have to cure the new understeer it has now, It just change your power parts to ones that don't upgrade the rpm isometric and intake and turbos are your choices
 
You need to use the reset transmission.
Don't worry it won't affect most of your tune just have to cure the new understeer it has now, It just change your power parts to ones that don't upgrade the rpm isometric and intake and turbos are your choices

Will do. I'll play around with some power upgrades.
 
They come in pints?

The only thing I can suggest is not to use the fun pedal when your front tires are on the red and white curbs. Those things have like no grip. I use the sticks for throttle/brakes/steering

Hmmmm...
This is opposite of the way it used behave. Praiano mentioned that rumble strips had far more grip than they should, more even than the tarmac. I found that to be true every time I hit the rumble strips at The Ring. My inside wheels would suddenly have more grip when I hit the inside strips and disturb the car in a massive way. Good to hear it's fixed. I've avoided the curbs lately and spent most of my time on Sierra.
 
They come in pints?



Hmmmm...
This is opposite of the way it used behave. Praiano mentioned that rumble strips had far more grip than they should, more even than the tarmac. I found that to be true every time I hit the rumble strips at The Ring. My inside wheels would suddenly have more grip when I hit the inside strips and disturb the car in a massive way. Good to hear it's fixed. I've avoided the curbs lately and spent most of my time on Sierra.

These are high curbs. The cars can bounce a little after hitting them causing wheel spin.
 
24eqk5t.jpg


Ford Focus '13
PP: 450
Tyres: Comfort Soft
RH F: 105
RH R: 85
Spring F: 9.25
Spring R: 9.60
Comp F: 6
Ext F: 10
Comp R: 10
Ext R: 6
ARB F: 7
ARB R: 7
Camber F: 2.8
Camber R: 0.8
Toe F: -0.25
Toe R: -0.25
Brake F: 4
Brake R: 6
Int: 12
Accel: 55
Brake: 9
Ballast: 27
Position: 50
: Brakes
: Suspension
: Six-Speed Transmission
: Weight 3
: Carbon Bonnet
: Sprots ECU
: 97.7% Limiter
: Diff
: Triple Plate Clutch
: 266BHP
: 1225kg
: 53/47
Controller Sensitivity: 1
ABS: 1

Good luck, you'll need it...

{Cy}
 
24eqk5t.jpg


Ford Focus '13
PP: 450
Tyres: Comfort Soft
RH F: 105
RH R: 85
Spring F: 9.25
Spring R: 9.60
Comp F: 6
Ext F: 10
Comp R: 10
Ext R: 6
ARB F: 7
ARB R: 7
Camber F: 2.8
Camber R: 0.8
Toe F: -0.25
Toe R: -0.25
Brake F: 4
Brake R: 6
Int: 12
Accel: 55
Brake: 9
Ballast: 27
Position: 50
: Brakes
: Suspension
: Six-Speed Transmission
: Weight 3
: Carbon Bonnet
: Sprots ECU
: 97.7% Limiter
: Diff
: Triple Plate Clutch
: 266BHP
: 1225kg
: 53/47
Controller Sensitivity: 1
ABS: 1

Good luck, you'll need it...

{Cy}
No need for luck just insanity!
Looks like fun I'll get going on testing in the morning.
@Motor City Hami any particular order you want results posted in?
 
Clueless over The Hill Outlaws
Ford Focus ST '06
Greenish
-------------------------------
hfNkuq.jpg

NO OIL CHANGE
NO ENGINE REBUILD
Date Acquired : 18/09/2014

Aero Kits : Type A
Standard Size Wheels : RAYS 57Xtreme
Car Paint : GT FLUORESCENCE 005-W

Distance Driven = 138,4 Miles
Displacement = 2,521 cc
Performance points = 450PP
Max. Power = 255 BHP/ 5,800 rpm
Max. Torque = 35,9 kgfm / 4,500 rpm
Drivetrain = FF/T
Weight = 1,171 kg
Weight dis = 59:41
Power/weight = 4,59 kg/BHP
Power Limiter = 96,8%

ABS= 1
Force Feedback Max.Torque = 8
Force Feedback Sensitivity = 8
Everything else = off
Tuned with wheel G27
Controller sensitive = 0


Grip. Real
Surface water at race (0)%


Parts :


Suspension Height-Adjustable , Fully-customization
Racing brake Kit
Six-Speed Transmission
LSD kit
Triple plate clutch Kit
Differential Gear Fully customize
Sports Computer
Sports Exhaust
Catalytic Converter: Sports
Body Weight stage 3
Carbon Bonnet (body Colour)
Window Weight Reduction


Tires:


Wheel Inch standard
Paint = GT FLUORESCENCE 005-W
Comfort Soft tires up to Racing Soft tires


Suspension:

Height= 90 / 85
Springs= 6.50 / 7.67
Dampers(c)= 7 / 4
Dampers(e)= 5 / 3
Anti roll bars= 4 / 7
Camber= 1.3 / 1.5
Toe Angle= - 0,75 / - 0,65
Brake= 6 / 9


LSD

Initial Torque 6
Acceleration Sensitivity 20
Braking Sensitivity 12


Ballast= 0 KG @ 50 %



setup the transmission after you buy all the parts .

Sex-Speed non-adjustable Transmission:

Gears:
Top speed 155 mph

1st = 3.108
2nd = 2.172
3rd = 1.621
4th = 1.265
5th = 1.033
6th = 0.883
Final gear 4,000


As always Corner Survive (Slow in / Fast out) 👍


HOPE YOU ENJOY THE RIDE



ND
 
Last edited:
You still have time to make changes. The transmissions will need to be reset prior to each test drive.




Do I really need to add a rule for this? I can. It would be unfair to exploit the system like that. His car would not have wheel spin after curbs and everyone else would.
Up to you really, personally I think it shows ingenuity in the interpretation of the rules and tuning techniques and doesn't break any fixed rules, the caveat being that the reset is a courtesy on the behalf of the tuners to make testers lives easier and this sort of goes against that. I thought about it briefly during tuning but didn't really have the time or the transmission know how to test the effects so I can't say what those effects may be and whether they will be noticeable under testing conditions.

Certainly an interesting idea though and could be worth looking into in the future if left as an allowed option, might only make a few hundredths difference but who knows. As long as the methodology was easy repeatable and easy to follow without incurring too much extra expenditure then it might just add another level to a contest 👍
 
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