GT Series could learn from Forza

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eSZee
Can you expand of how Kaz being a "pro" driver makes GT a better game and forza a worse game cause they have no pro driver on staff? Can you show me how GT has gained anything from Kaz being a "pro"?
tHanks...
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You have to remember that Gran Turismo might not have even existed without Ayrton Senna, as Kazunori has mentioned in a recent interview. I'll agree with your point that Kazunori is more of a gentleman racer, but what of the GT Academy graduates? They compete in a variety of different class race events & win. & I never at one point said Forza was a worse game. But when T10 doesn't have any program like GT Academy, it makes me think that they don't want to take the game from the living room to the track. I'll also agree with the point that Forza developers do communicate with their consumers better than Gran Turismo, but Kazunori is learning from his consumers too. He has stated that the hack in GT5 has given him a better idea on what the players want. This is why we have removable spoilers in GT6. He has also acknowledged the complaints with engine sounds & AI & has improved them over GT5. Just because Kazunori or anyone else doesn't participate in online lobbies

, doesn't mean they aren't hearing the feedback from the consumers.
 
Carnageo
They can learn from each other but genuinely Forza 5 could learn a lot more from Gran Turismo 6. One example being improving the Car / Track Roster when releasing sequels.
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We could see a similar thing happen to GT7, especially if its coming in 2014
 
It would be a silly thing to try and make GT like Forza and vice versa.

However each could learn and improve still keeping there structure and game style
 
MeanElf
Amen - and I hope they keep their individuality too. I never understood why people would want one game to become another, that's surely not why people got into those games in the first place...
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Possibly because, so far as I can tell, most people aren't suggesting GT become Forza. The suggestion is to pinch ideas from the series, and frankly, I don't see the harm in that. Other games did online racing before GT - did it lose it's individuality because of that? Other games had 90% of the cars that were added in GT6 over GT5 - did that make it less GT?

It'd be a very unfortunate situation for PD if they had to intentionally ignore fan-requested features simply because another company already has them in their game:

Kaz: "The fans really are clamoring for a livery editor, can we do anything about that?"
Staff: "Sorry boss, but [insert game] added that feature before us. We can't have the same features as another game, lest we become a clone!"
Kaz: "Well then, what part of the market can we corner?"
Staff: "Astronomy."

;)

In all seriousness, I think both games can learn from each other, as both companies are quite obviously passionate about the automobile. GT could pick up the more in-depth tuning, both in available parts and actual settings, in addition to the afore-mentioned livery editor, storefront, auction house, et al. More widespread leaderboards would be nice, hoppers online as well as the current room approach, a Rivals-style feature, and car clubs all were welcome features in FM4. A car list that better resembles the word "balanced" would be nice, too - oh, and proper standing starts. I like Forza's approach to split time displays, as well. On the other hand, Forza should feel the need to include variable time on tracks, and potentially weather. Their car list has few holes, though a bit more love to the basement level (I'm talking kei-car types) wouldn't hurt - they've dipped their toes in the water with the original Beetle and Mini, but a Cappy wouldn't hurt. You could make the argument rallying needs to be added, but it's butchered so badly in GT that I question that, and I never tried it in Horizon. Forza's Photomode isn't nearly as detailed as GT's. Qualifying, to my knowledge, has never been in Forza - so they'd have to copy older GT's for that idea. GT has Free Run in online rooms - I really miss the ability to cruise in Forza rooms, especially as their customization options tend to lead to more people have "fun" cars that would suit that setting.
 
SlipZtrEm
...It'd be a very unfortunate situation for PD if they had to intentionally ignore fan-requested features simply because another company already has them in their game:

Kaz: "The fans really are clamoring for a livery editor, can we do anything about that?"
Staff: "Sorry boss, but [insert game] added that feature before us. We can't have the same features as another game, lest we become a clone!"
Kaz: "Well then, what part of the market can we corner?"
Staff: "Astronomy."

;)
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Well, I wasn't really thinking of individuality through to that level of originality :) Sure a game can have features that other games have, it would be a dull gaming world otherwise - I was talking more about the way any particular feature is implemented...that is where I think each game company's individuality is kept alive.
 
SlipZtrEm
Kaz: "The fans really are clamoring for a livery editor, can we do anything about that?"
Staff: "Sorry boss, but [insert game] added that feature before us. We can't have the same features as another game, lest we become a clone!"
Kaz: "Well then, what part of the market can we corner?"
Staff: "Astronomy."

;)
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Quality, had a giggle at that, cheers.
 
Tenacious D
Just to reiterate, the reason I want a Livery Editor is because every pro race driver has their own custom livery in real life. Many other racing games give you this opportunity, and with Gran Turismo being structured in Kaz's words to make these cars your cars, this is the one thing lacking to take it to that ultimate level. To walk in the footsteps of people like Colin McRae, Ayrton Senna, and now Lucas Ordoñez and Nick McMillen, who get their own cars with their own liveries.:D
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Allowed those taking part in the MSA recognised BTCC and Endurance races to create their own style race livery, which was cool and looked better still when shown as a series on Motors TV on the Sky and Virgin channels.
 
I keep reading ''Improved AI'' or ''Improved sound'', I'm yet to see any kind of proof of this. I mean, did these people even play older GT titles or at least GT5? It seems that the most critical users here know a lot more about the games themselves than the fans that defend the series with a passion.
 
PepeMickey
I keep reading ''Improved AI'' or ''Improved sound'', I'm yet to see any kind of proof of this. I mean, did these people even play older GT titles or at least GT5? It seems that the most critical users here know a lot more about the games themselves than the fans that defend the series with a passion.
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There are a handfull of cars that do sounds really good. too bad its only a handfull of the 1200 cars. Unlike the other game.

 
PepeMickey
I keep reading ''Improved AI'' or ''Improved sound'', I'm yet to see any kind of proof of this. I mean, did these people even play older GT titles or at least GT5? It seems that the most critical users here know a lot more about the games themselves than the fans that defend the series with a passion.
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Yeah, the "improved AI" definitely isn't there, except only in a few specific scenarios where the AI actually feels like it's competing against you. An example of this is the GT-R mission race at Silverstone. But that's not really an improvement. It's rubberbanding AI.
 
King1982
There are a handfull of cars that do sounds really good. too bad its only a handfull of the 1200 cars. Unlike the other game.
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This is exactly what I'm talking about, Do you realize that the cars showcased in this video already sounded like that in GT5? All of them actually, except the X1 which sounds different but not better, where's the ''improvement''?
 
Havok_
Autovista is spectacular. With all the detail that is within all of the premium cars in GT6, why this feature or something similar to it was not included in the game is beyond me.

It is ironic though that before Autovista even existed there was a way to interact with the cars in Need for Speed: Porsche Unleashed. (PC) You could open the engine bay, doors, hood, etc. Autovista went above and beyond that, it's certainly a feature that will be well received for GT6 or any future iteration of the GT series.
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I agree that the AutoVista is an exceptional tool. If only PD gave us the option to open hoods, doors, windows and the boot in photomode :(

Amomynous
And DLC... Personally i think DLC should ONLY be what the developers have realised their audience wanted and responding to their requests. There should be absolutely NO pre-determined DLC. Everything should be a fresh idea that they didn't originally think of. Anything else is just a money making scheme and i don't agree with it one bit - It should've been included in the original game if they already had it planned. They're much more likely to be the nice guys if they listen to us and give us what we want, than give us something that we don't really want/need and had already planned on giving us regardless of what we thought of the original production.
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Agree to an extent. GT5 did terribly in attempting to have an organised schedule of releasing DLC's monthly...which was from 'one every two months' to only releasing 4 batches and of course, Forza is more organised.

However, giving away free DLC-in the form of cars not yet released in the real-world as well as the Vision GT project-is something I appreciate PD for doing, as in a way it shows that they're just as inclined to do it for the money as they are doing it for the passion of cats.

Unfortunately, one other thing that they could learn from Forza is to not add the car to the garage upon purchase-as it defeats the purpose of winning races, earning credits and buying the car(s) in the first place (this also applies to the pre-order bonus cars too) :grumpy:
 
King1982
There are a handfull of cars that do sounds really good. too bad its only a handfull of the 1200 cars. Unlike the other game.
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I was thinking about this the other day - given that PD are working on the sounds for a possible future update in GT6, perhaps they are using select car sounds to guage how they are being received by the players and will act accordingly when the update happens.

PepeMickey
This is exactly what I'm talking about, Do you realize that the cars showcased in this video already sounded like that in GT5? All of them actually, except the X1 which sounds different but not better, where's the ''improvement''?
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Once more, it was never said that the sounds would be improved by the launch of GT6 - so logically they'd be the same as GT5. I think the X14 sounds markedly improved, though it's unfair to say it isn't better as the car doesn't actually exist...
 
What I would like GT to learn from FM is their gameplay camera views. I always played both games. Since I always used to have Xbox and Play Station. Now with the next gen I got a PS4 and no Xbox One so I missed out FM5. But anyways I always thought both games in a mix would be the perfect racing game. But as I said I always loved the camera views on Forza expecially chase cam and the rotating around the car to adore it after putting new pretty rims etc.
 
They can both learn from eachother.

GT can learn from Forza on features (career mode, sounds, customization, car list, community, AI), quality assurance processes, customer interaction, and how to make a racing game fun.

Forza can learn from GT on how to thrive on non-existing features and irrelevant hypes (e.g. adaptive tesselation vs driving avatars).
 
If this talk would be 1 or 2 years back I'd wrote a thing or two that GT can learn from FM4 , but now ? FM5 shouldn't drop so many features from FM4 > community , quality assurance,customer interaction ... they're all GONE with ONE. Sadly. So what can GT now learn from FM ? Give us Tokens™,Drivatard™,half assed Autivista™, prebakedlighting™, excessive sunflare™, overwaxed™ cars, Thrustmaster for 400€,console for 500€.Well yeah . I see it comming.
 
MeanElf
I was thinking about this the other day - given that PD are working on the sounds for a possible future update in GT6, perhaps they are using select car sounds to guage how they are being received by the players and will act accordingly when the update happens.
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PD monitoring the community and responding to feedback?

h5870E2B2
 
Here's one

A reason to buy a next-gen console on launch day. despite the teething problems with FM5. It's really good that they put some effort into that. Sucks that I don't have a reason to buy a PS4 right now as a simulation enthusiast. PD could have done it, they just chose not to. Even a prologue would tip the boat.
 
Imari
PD monitoring the community and responding to feedback?
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C'mon, they clearly do monitor - it's been alluded to several times - but you knew that.

As for responding, things like sounds have been noted from player feedback and that's not the only thing which they have accepted that needs work. May not be to your taste what the concede to, but you can't deny they are actively listening and acting where they feel it is in the game's interest, or feasible in conjunction with what they have planned.
 
Farseer
Can we ever go a day without hearing about this crappy series? Damn.
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Cute. Just like the rest of your Forza bashing posts. I guess trolling habits need longer than 4 years to die. :rolleyes:
 
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MeanElf
C'mon, they clearly do monitor - it's been alluded to several times - but you knew that.

As for responding, things like sounds have been noted from player feedback and that's not the only thing which they have accepted that needs work. May not be to your taste what the concede to, but you can't deny they are actively listening and acting where they feel it is in the game's interest, or feasible in conjunction with what they have planned.
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Got any more examples? Anyone with ears could tell that the sounds need work. PD should have known that better than anyone. If they need the community to tell them that the sounds need work then we're all ****ed.

I'm not entirely sure that they monitor in the sense that they go out and look for the information. I think they monitor their own players (because they'd be stupid not to) and they can't avoid questions from reporters standing right in front of them, but I severely doubt they actually spend time on community sites and the like. I haven't seen any evidence of it.
 
Adjusting tirepressure... Since its essential for a car's handling... Realy was hoping to see that in gt6 After i've Heard of them working with Yokohama... Details in what Tuning does to your car (rollcage ads weight, Racing exhaust reducing it) They are so good in these "atention to detail things"(thinking of Tracks in general, Position of stars in the nightsky) but miss other things that matter IMO... Still Love the Game! Forza is a Great Series too... Played both of them since their First part... But in the end of the Day I allways ended up playing gt after career Mode in both were done
 


This video makes me really want to play Forza 5.

GT have anything: tons of cars, tons of tracks, bunch of lessons, coffee breaks, photo-modes, oil changes and you can even...driving on moon. BUT

it doesn't have very very basic (in racing-learning terms) - competitive A.I to you actually enjoy it...You don't need to extract every bit of awareness from yourself because even if you loosing you can slam someone or drive into a wall in that city circuit to win.

The thing I learned from Dark Souls that harder the challenge - more satisfaction you will feel.


Another thing is damage.

I remember my first days with Forza 2. Hardest thing was driving oval track...Because if you lost is at those speed thats it. Thats ****ing it! No rewind, no ********. And I was like "Woooow! IT WAS AMAZING!" :D

Another moment that I doing a 60 laps of mugello and crashed it on last lap...It was like a second and that's it. All over. No second chance. No ****ing ********. And you know what I LOVED IT!!!

Now I understand frustration that real drivers feel after a crash (I don't talk about fear or sad consequences!!!) but all games, even Forza right now is trying to kill the frustration. And it's wrong path IMHO. Because it's justified frustration.

Now bad A.I. is my main point against GT. It's good for a car collection or hot-lapping but to me it's empty on track. Even my imagination (of a good and clean driver) cannot help.

P.S: I'm talking only about offline, because because in my city online lags like hell and leads to many problems for other internet users in my house.
 
Imari
...I'm not entirely sure that they monitor in the sense that they go out and look for the information...but I severely doubt they actually spend time on community sites and the like. I haven't seen any evidence of it.
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It has been mentioned several times that they do this - what I was talking about though, is the reporting tool they have on the PS3 where they can view stuff like totals and trends for vehicle usage, or anything else they fancy.

I appreciate that type of tool has no real use when it comes to things like sounds - that's where the feedback on forums comes in.
 

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