Kaz finally listened to this car forums

[Tenacious D]

(said lots of stuff)

Hey guy, if you really are so prescient, you should go apply to IGN as a gaming journo and see if you can raise their standards some, as I agree, they aren't the go-to for gaming info anymore. But are you going to accuse Eurogamer of the same boot-licking attitude? And basically the entire gaming news industry? I don't think so. I think you're just forcing your views on the gaming world like some do here.

It seems like almost no one here realizes that bloggers will tear everyone from the Pope on down a new one. Now, articles have analyzed Gran Turismo inside and out, and they ask about the sounds, almost always the first issue, will they be improving. Damage, will it finally be somewhat up to next gen standards. And yes, will Standard content be returning. They will gently nudge Kazunori about things they see lacking in the game. But in all these articles I've read, no one has asked Kaz, "Don't you feel that the Standard cars and tracks bring the quality of Gran Turismo down, at least somewhat?" Never happens.

I guess you missed how it has been discussed that boards devoted to certain games attract a good deal of both devoted fans and hardcore gamers, especially racing sims. And the attitude of the hardcore run from technically critical to downright mean spirited at times. Out in the wild, no, not so much.

Now, you might like the environment here, seeing how many GT memes can be posed in one thread about what a disaster the series has become, and whether or not PD will end up bankrupting SONY CE. To me, this seems to be a bit heavy handed, and it has driven a number of people away, such as our own amar212 as I mentioned, and we have to now count on members of NeoGAF to promptly inform us of any juicy news, as he is one of the best sources we have.

Ya know, it's one thing to want to see a Gran Turismo made just for you, and explaining in great detail just what that is. It's another to keep repeating endlessly every flaw of GT6 like it will give everyone AIDS, or faux worries that GT has become the asteroid that's going to kill everyone in Polyphony Digital. It's not only beyond overstated, it's only impressing the same culprits who like each other's posts, and it's not all that many people, if you take the time to notice.

GT7 will come out one of these months, and the gaming public at large will react. But I wouldn't bet that people will be as critical of it as you are, or even me. They seem to be much easier to please than certain characters from around here.

 

[ImaRobot]

Ya know, it's one thing to want to see a Gran Turismo made just for you, and explaining in great detail just what that is. It's another to keep repeating endlessly every flaw of GT6 like it will give everyone AIDS, or faux worries that GT has become the asteroid that's going to kill everyone in Polyphony Digital. It's not only beyond overstated, it's only impressing the same culprits who like each other's posts, and it's not all that many people, if you take the time to notice.

I'm really not seeing a difference between what you're labeling him as, as you are the same, just on the opposite side of the spectrum. I find it odd how you would even bring up something like that, considering the amount of times you have done, and still do, the exact same thing.

Is there really a reason to get on him like that, other then to try to bring him down? Or are you blind to your own doings?

 

[TJC_69]

Hey guy, if you really are so prescient, you should go apply to IGN as a gaming journo and see if you can raise their standards some, as I agree, they aren't the go-to for gaming info anymore. But are you going to accuse Eurogamer of the same boot-licking attitude? And basically the entire gaming news industry? I don't think so. I think you're just forcing your views on the gaming world like some do here.

No thanks. I'm not interested in becoming a cog in their greed machine. What I replied was valid and concise. My point being that the GTP community should be the 'go to' for how Gran Turismo is perceived in all its good and bad points. And not the review sites you mention, as the feedback from here is always straight to the point. For example; would any of your gaming sites point out the online problems with Gran Turismo 6? Or will you always be more inclined to learn about that from GTP users?

Additionally, feel free to point out with facts about how i'm 'forcing my views on the gaming world'. What have I said that is false in this regard exactly?

It seems like almost no one here realizes that bloggers will tear everyone from the Pope on down a new one. Now, articles have analyzed Gran Turismo inside and out, and they ask about the sounds, almost always the first issue, will they be improving. Damage, will it finally be somewhat up to next gen standards. And yes, will Standard content be returning. They will gently nudge Kazunori about things they see lacking in the game. But in all these articles I've read, no one has asked Kaz, "Don't you feel that the Standard cars and tracks bring the quality of Gran Turismo down, at least somewhat?" Never happens.

Again you are showing lack of understanding here in regard to how Kaz and PD give interviews. If you look back at GTP news articles, or even just ask any of the moderator team from GTP that have actually interviewed Kaz in person for that matter, you can see that questions are submitted to PD before the actual interview for approval beforehand. (Maybe ask Famine about it?) Which would explain why such question would never be posed in the first place yes?

I guess you missed how it has been discussed that boards devoted to certain games attract a good deal of both devoted fans and hardcore gamers, especially racing sims. And the attitude of the hardcore run from technically critical to downright mean spirited at times. Out in the wild, no, not so much.

I regard myself as an experienced gamer. Been gaming now for 27 years or so, since I was 8 years old in fact. To be critical of Gran Turismo is not mean spirited, it shows that gamers are not willing to accept broken promises from a franchise that they have grown up with, and i'd suggest that any mean spirited attitudes you could be perceiving is merely forum frustration playing out through lack of GT news perhaps?

Now, you might like the environment here, seeing how many GT memes can be posed in one thread about what a disaster the series has become, and whether or not PD will end up bankrupting SONY CE. To me, this seems to be a bit heavy handed, and it has driven a number of people away, such as our own amar212 as I mentioned, and we have to now count on members of NeoGAF to promptly inform us of any juicy news, as he is one of the best sources we have.

Yes I like GTP. No, it's not because of GT memes. It's because of the truthful feedback of the community, as i've aforementioned already. Additionally, the NeoGaf guys know just the same as what we do. Some are still clinging to the course maker in a pathetic , hopeless plight, I feel bad for them actually. And Amar just drops the 'Soon' word in the 'Moon Rover The Castle' thread there, then can't be arsed answering any valid questions from anyone asking what he means. Let me know if you haven't read this already and you want a link.

Ya know, it's one thing to want to see a Gran Turismo made just for you, and explaining in great detail just what that is. It's another to keep repeating endlessly every flaw of GT6 like it will give everyone AIDS, or faux worries that GT has become the asteroid that's going to kill everyone in Polyphony Digital. It's not only beyond overstated, it's only impressing the same culprits who like each other's posts, and it's not all that many people, if you take the time to notice.

You're comparing pointing out any flaws that GT has to AIDS? Erm, ok then. Have you not actually, even just once, ever considered that post likes are a representative of what people are in agreement with? (IE - Tenacious D Says - GT6 is amazing and perfect. 0 likes. Joe Smith Says - You're wrong Tenacious D because it has flaws such as blah blah. 5 likes).

GT7 will come out one of these months, and the gaming public at large will react. But I wouldn't bet that people will be as critical of it as you are, or even me. They seem to be much easier to please than certain characters from around here.

Months? Nope. Years? Probably. Yes, the GTP crowd will always always always tell you how the game really is. The hive mind is more truthful, and always will be more so than one member or so with fingers in their ears not wanting to hear a bad word against a GT game. I'll always be critical of any purchase I make, this is my balanced view. My very right as an individual.

Lastly -

TJC_69 Said
Lots of valid stuff. Addressed all of Tenacious Ds points

👍

 

[TrevorPhilips]

Now, you might like the environment here, seeing how many GT memes can be posed in one thread about what a disaster the series has become, and whether or not PD will end up bankrupting SONY CE. To me, this seems to be a bit heavy handed, and it has driven a number of people away, such as our own amar212 as I mentioned, and we have to now count on members of NeoGAF to promptly inform us of any juicy news, as he is one of the best sources we have.

When we do get news of GT7 in the future, I don't know if I'll be posting much here either tbh. I might just stick to GAF. Things may change of course, when news drops and more people return to genuinely discuss the game. As of right now though the atmosphere here is toxic. There are a few people in this section spending an unhealthy amount of time of their lives, time they will never get back by the way, telling others why a game they have never seen will be atrociously poor.

It's sad... Sad to see the mentality of these few people who are apparently in a place I would never want to be. A place where they spend their valuable time "debating" a game they despise so much they just have to tell people on a daily basis in every thread they can, regardless of the subject, how bad it's going to be. If I lose interest in a game or the direction I think a game is going, I say what I feel, and I move along. Happened to GT5, GT6, FM5 and FM6. A good chance it could happen in GT7 too. Maybe it's just me but repeating myself on a daily basis seems bat **** crazy at best.

I just don't see the point. What would it achieve? What is the benefit to them? If the game comes out and it's rubbish, the best they get out of it is "I told you so! Everyday on multiple occasions, I told you so!"... Forgive me if I'm missing something here, but that's A LOT of hard work just for such little pay off. You actually only need one post for that and if the time arises, quote yourself and bask in your Nostradamus-esque glory.

It's like the psychotic people you see in city centres who scream at cars and hold signs saying the world's going to end. Not many people pay attention, the rest just think you're annoying and yeah, they will be right one day... But you can't help but pity them.

Anyway, hope to see Mr. D you when news drops, good or bad. Until then though, I'll just go about my daily business.

 

[jergto]

If Kaz is reading this he just needs to retire. Or Sony should stop funding the boring ass game. What can I say, I'm a sucker, I have every iteration of GT, I even have a JPN version of GT5 prologue. But they never get play, I put in more time in Horizon 2 and I'm not even a fan of arcade racing! But the engine sounds and cruising around is awesome. I plan on getting FM6 and buying the Porsche pack.

Guys, look forward to T10's FM6. I hope some of you give it a chance like I did back in 2009 when I was watching people play FM3 on justintv (now twitch). In 2011 I made the jump. Sadly I still look back at GT series and realize what a disappoint the series really has become.

One thing I do miss are the original GT tracks and thats about it!

 

[TJC_69]

When we do get news of GT7 in the future, I don't know if I'll be posting much here either tbh. I might just stick to GAF. Things may change of course, when news drops and more people return to genuinely discuss the game. As of right now though the atmosphere here is toxic. There are a few people in this section spending an unhealthy amount of time of their lives, time they will never get back by the way, telling others why a game they have never seen will be atrociously poor.

It's sad... Sad to see the mentality of these few people who are apparently in a place I would never want to be. A place where they spend their valuable time "debating" a game they despise so much they just have to tell people on a daily basis in every thread they can, regardless of the subject, how bad it's going to be. If I lose interest in a game or the direction I think a game is going, I say what I feel, and I move along. Happened to GT5, GT6, FM5 and FM6. A good chance it could happen in GT7 too. Maybe it's just me but repeating myself on a daily basis seems bat **** crazy at best.

I just don't see the point. What would it achieve? What is the benefit to them? If the game comes out and it's rubbish, the best they get out of it is "I told you so! Everyday on multiple occasions, I told you so!"... Forgive me if I'm missing something here, but that's A LOT of hard work just for such little pay off. You actually only need one post for that and if the time arises, quote yourself and bask in your Nostradamus-esque glory.

It's like the psychotic people you see in city centres who scream at cars and hold signs saying the world's going to end. Not many people pay attention, the rest just think you're annoying and yeah, they will be right one day... But you can't help but pity them.

Anyway, hope to see Mr. D you when news drops, good or bad. Until then though, I'll just go about my daily business.

You do realise that the guy you're quoting spends more time than most doing the EXACT same thing but in reverse right? So, by proxy, your insult to the members of the GTP community actually rigorously applies to him. And he liked your post.

Gotta love the irony

 

[Tenacious D]

I'm really not seeing a difference between what you're labeling him as, as you are the same, just on the opposite side of the spectrum.

I find it odd that you would find it odd that a person would like a certain game, join a site devoted to said game, and post about how he likes said game. A lot? Why not, does that seem out of the ordinary to you? Or do you think it would be normal for someone to join an Italian cuisine site who didn't really care for Italian food, but loved Chinese?

My point being that the GTP community should be the 'go to' for how Gran Turismo is perceived in all its good and bad points. And not the review sites you mention, as the feedback from here is always straight to the point.

Well, but that's the rub. See, this place is full of people with chips on their shoulders the size of surfboards and battle axes to grind. Let me give you an example of how this place gets "straight to the point."

I don't know guys, I'm not confident AT ALL (about car sounds). After buying a PS4 a week ago and playing Driveclub for those 7 days, I hear GT and I want to punch Kaz in the face.... even if he was some kind of hero for me a while ago....

Now, is this what you consider a post made to spark dialog for the exchange of ideas?

The problem is that these kinds of posts are fairly common here, and this is one that survived the sweep up by the mods, maybe because it was more sarcastic than disturbing.

How about people who once discussed openly how they like the Standard cars rarely talk about them anymore? Is it because the subject has been settled amicably? Or because a certain vocal crowd here makes sure that anyone who DARES post favorably about them is either blind and/or so wimpy they will accept any old garbage? Shoot, there's a long dead thread devoted to Photo Mode pics of Standard Cars, and they looked good too, but then the war against them began and after it dried up quickly. Is this what you would describe as an environment conducive to sharing views and thoughts about Gran Turismo?

Catch sight of the post above jergto's yet? Oh wait, you did, even commented on it.

Again you are showing lack of understanding here in regard to how Kaz and PD give interviews. If you look back at GTP news articles, or even just ask any of the moderator team from GTP that have actually interviewed Kaz in person for that matter, you can see that questions are submitted to PD before the actual interview for approval beforehand. (Maybe ask Famine about it?) Which would explain why such question would never be posed in the first place yes?

Orly? So... they can question whether sounds will improve, or the bot A.I. will improve, or damage of any serious sort will finally show up in Gran Turismo? But not broach the subject of whether Standard cars and tracks will see improvement? Pardon me if I skeptic at you.

Finally...

Lots of valid stuff. Addressed all of Tenacious Ds points

👍

Whatever helps you post at night, pal.

Look, I'm aware of how things work around here. You're not one of the cool in-people unless you're highly critical of Gran Turismo, or at least GT5 and 6. If you do happen to like Gran Turismo, you had better not have anything to say but glowing praise about other games. That's why I have banished myself from the Forza section. You can't say anything but the car models are paaarfect. You can't say that outsourcing is anything but a magic wand that solves all issues. Dare to even suggest that Microsoft isn't a good company to be involved in the gaming market, and someone will unload. They're even more fiercely devoted than fans at the official Forza forums, where Che Chou once ran the house. At least there, some of us could say that we thought the car sounds in Forza 4 were overblown. Here? Such talk is treasonous.

What do you want? I don't have a clue. Maybe that Polyphony dies so that SONY can buy Turn 10, Simply Mad or Kunos to make a "true" racing game. Why are you here? Not a clue there either. I haven't dug back through your post history much, but I'm hard pressed to find much good at all about Gran Turismo. I'm clueless as to what you even like. Assetto Corsa? P CARS? rFactor 2? iRacing?

Me? You know what I like. I like Gran Turismo. If you've read much of my posts of yore, you know I like Live For Speed. I like GTR. I like Assetto Corsa, somewhat. I currently dig the heck out of RaceRoom and even though I post positively and negatively about the unfinished game and its pricing model at the forums, I seem to be rather popular there. I even like Forza - it's a Gran Turismo clone, after all. And I don't consider it to be schitzophrenic to like GT6, or irrational to say that there are elements of racing sim in the car behavior. I say so, because I find it to be true. Look, even Lawndart, who likes iRacing and races a Miata in real life, says that Gran Turismo just has something wholesome and tangibly real in there when you race a car, even as it's not the best racing simulation on the market. Yes, he wants it to be more like AC, RaceRoom and iRacing without the floatiness. I do too. But there isn't anything contradictory in loving Gran Turismo and wanting to see it improve.

But what baffles me about this place is the point of Trevor's entire post. What's the point of posting ill will and grudges day in and day out? Has Gran Turismo and Kazunori offended you guys that much? Really??

You may think Trevor and I are blithering idiots. Fine with me.

 

[TJC_69]

I find it odd that you would find it odd that a person would like a certain game, join a site devoted to said game, and post about how he likes said game. A lot? Why not, does that seem out of the ordinary to you? Or do you think it would be normal for someone to join an Italian cuisine site who didn't really care for Italian food, but loved Chinese?

Seeing as this is about me in a roundabout way also, let me answer this for you. I joined in 2011 during my hardcore GT5 days. I've played GT since GT 1, even participated in a race series here on GTP. What you still don't understand is that you can love a race game, see its flaws, and own a GTP account. Mysteriously, I can do all 3 simultaneously.

So, now that's cleared up. What's an ' Official Gran Turismo Martyr' exactly? As your sig says you are one?

Well, but that's the rub. See, this place is full of people with chips on their shoulders the size of surfboards and battle axes to grind. Let me give you an example of how this place gets "straight to the point."

Now, is this what you consider a post made to spark dialog for the exchange of ideas?

The problem is that these kinds of posts are fairly common here, and this is one that survived the sweep up by the mods, maybe because it was more sarcastic than disturbing.

I would say that you've been looking for a controversial post on GTP to back up your train of thought. Are you saying that everyone on GTP posts like this? One weak example does not have me convinced.

Additionally, you haven't thought that people are sick of standard cars now? That the whole standard cars business was a timesaving idea for PD to bring all the other cars from PS2 to PS3? And that doing the exact same thing from PS3 to PS4 renders the community more than somewhat disappointed at PD?

Orly? So... they can question whether sounds will improve, or the bot A.I. will improve, or damage of any serious sort will finally show up in Gran Turismo? But not broach the subject of whether Standard cars and tracks will see improvement? Pardon me if I skeptic at you.

Please use English words. Not only is this in your AUP to begin with, you wouldn't understand my local dialect textspeak if I typed it here. Again, ask @Famine or @Jordan if what I have said is correct about whether or not questions are submitted beforehand before choosing to ignore what is stated, just to please your head in the sand viewpoint.

Finally...


Whatever helps you post at night, pal.

Look, I'm aware of how things work around here. You're not one of the cool in-people unless you're highly critical of Gran Turismo, or at least GT5 and 6. If you do happen to like Gran Turismo, you had better not have anything to say but glowing praise about other games. That's why I have banished myself from the Forza section. You can't say anything but the car models are paaarfect. You can't say that outsourcing is anything but a magic wand that solves all issues. Dare to even suggest that Microsoft isn't a good company to be involved in the gaming market, and someone will unload. They're even more fiercely devoted than fans at the official Forza forums, where Che Chou once ran the house. At least there, some of us could say that we thought the car sounds in Forza 4 were overblown. Here? Such talk is treasonous.

What do you want? I don't have a clue. Maybe that Polyphony dies so that SONY can buy Turn 10, Simply Mad or Kunos to make a "true" racing game. Why are you here? Not a clue there either. I haven't dug back through your post history much, but I'm hard pressed to find much good at all about Gran Turismo. I'm clueless as to what you even like. Assetto Corsa? P CARS? rFactor 2? iRacing?

Me? You know what I like. I like Gran Turismo. If you've read much of my posts of yore, you know I like Live For Speed. I like GTR. I like Assetto Corsa, somewhat. I currently dig the heck out of RaceRoom and even though I post positively and negatively about the unfinished game and its pricing model, I seem to be rather popular there. I even like Forza - it's a Gran Turismo clone, after all. And I don't consider it to be schitzophrenic to like GT6, or irrational to say that there are elements of racing sim in the car behavior. I say so, because I find it to be true. Look, even Lawndart, who likes iRacing and races a Miata in real life, says that Gran Turismo just has something wholesome and tangibly real in there when you race a car, even as it's not the best racing simulation on the market. Yes, he wants it to be more like AC, RaceRoom and iRacing without the floatiness. I do too. But there isn't anything contradictory in loving Gran Turismo and wanting to see it improve.

But what baffles me is the point of Trevor's entire post. What's the point of posting ill will and grudges day in and day out? Has Gran Turismo and Kazunori offended you guys that much? Really??

You may think Trevor and I are blithering idiots. Fine with me.

Incorrect. But I guess a 'martyr of Gran Turismo' has to justify to oneself and self reassure somehow.

 

[synon]

Or Sony should stop funding the boring ass game.

Even if you dislike a game, why would you care if it is sold or not? Lots of people do enjoy GT, why stop them being able to play it?

 

[jergto]

Even if you dislike a game, why would you care if it is sold or not? Lots of people do enjoy GT, why stop them being able to play it?

Then they'll just have to enjoy another game. 💡

In a perfect world we would see GT tracks in Forza. That would be bad ass.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I find it odd that you would find it odd that a person would like a certain game, join a site devoted to said game, and post about how he likes said game. A lot? Why not, does that seem out of the ordinary to you? Or do you think it would be normal for someone to join an Italian cuisine site who didn't really care for Italian food, but loved Chinese?

@ImaRobot quote the parts of your post he was directly referring to and they fit you to a tee. No need to move the imaginary goal posts with an irrelevant analogy, he laid it all out of you.

Well, but that's the rub. See, this place is full of people with chips on their shoulders the size of surfboards and battle axes to grind. Let me give you an example of how this place gets "straight to the point."

Or it's full of people that have deep ties to the series and are expressing their unhappiness in the direction that it's going in a way that offends you, but which most of us find pretty normal. I'm used to having heated discussions with friends over just about anything, and forgetting all about it within minutes and moving on to the next thing. Perhaps this is not a familiar experience to you.

Now, is this what you consider a post made to spark dialog for the exchange of ideas?

No, I think most of us consider it a joke because we don't comb through posts looking to be offended.

How about people who once discussed openly how they like the Standard cars rarely talk about them anymore? Is it because the subject has been settled amicably? Or because a certain vocal crowd here makes sure that anyone who DARES post favorably about them is either blind and/or so wimpy they will accept any old garbage? Shoot, there's a long dead thread devoted to Photo Mode pics of Standard Cars, and they looked good too, but then the war against them began and after it dried up quickly. Is this what you would describe as an environment conducive to sharing views and thoughts about Gran Turismo?

No one has any problem with someone liking and wanting standard cars in GT7. But when the discussion turns to whether it's good for the GT series to continue using decade old assets, that's where the disagreement begins. You can't seem to separate the two thoughts and seem to think that you can post whatever opinions you like about the inclusion of standard cars in the next iteration of the game in a discussion forum and have it go unchallenged. For the latest thread on Standard Cars vs. Real Life go HERE and watch the carnage..or lack thereof. Be warned though, it might not fit with your martyr narrative.

Catch sight of the post above jergto's yet? Oh wait, you did, even commented on it.

Yes. He's unhappy with GT and thinking of switching to Forza. So what? Does this offend you? Why do you ask if someone has seen @jergto's post?

Orly? So... they can question whether sounds will improve, or the bot A.I. will improve, or damage of any serious sort will finally show up in Gran Turismo? But not broach the subject of whether Standard cars and tracks will see improvement? Pardon me if I skeptic at you.

Don't know what orly means.

Look, I'm aware of how things work around here. You're not one of the cool in-people unless you're highly critical of Gran Turismo, or at least GT5 and 6. If you do happen to like Gran Turismo, you had better not have anything to say but glowing praise about other games. That's why I have banished myself from the Forza section. You can't say anything but the car models are paaarfect. You can't say that outsourcing is anything but a magic wand that solves all issues. Dare to even suggest that Microsoft isn't a good company to be involved in the gaming market, and someone will unload. They're even more fiercely devoted than fans at the official Forza forums, where Che Chou once ran the house. At least there, some of us could say that we thought the car sounds in Forza 4 were overblown. Here? Such talk is treasonous.

This is the usual, "I tried to put forth my uninformed opinions and many people disagreed with me often using logic and facts and links to relevant information to prove their point, I didn't understand it, so now I'm going to run off to a corner and be a martyr", post.

What do you want? I don't have a clue. Maybe that Polyphony dies so that SONY can buy Turn 10, Simply Mad or Kunos to make a "true" racing game. Why are you here? Not a clue there either. I haven't dug back through your post history much, but I'm hard pressed to find much good at all about Gran Turismo. I'm clueless as to what you even like. Assetto Corsa? P CARS? rFactor 2? iRacing?

What people want has been well documented in thousands of posts, not hard to find. We all gathered together for a few months and discussed and debated the future of the series. We made up some well crafted posts and thousands, perhaps tens of thousands of votes were cast, when we mistakenly thought Kaz was going to grace us with his presence. Remember that? He really got us that time. Fool me once shame on you...fool me twice...you know. Read through that forum if you can find it, all your answers are there.

Me? You know what I like. I like Gran Turismo. If you've read much of my posts of yore, you know I like Live For Speed. I like GTR. I like Assetto Corsa, somewhat. I currently dig the heck out of RaceRoom and even though I post positively and negatively about the unfinished game and its pricing model at the forums, I seem to be rather popular there. I even like Forza - it's a Gran Turismo clone, after all. And I don't consider it to be schitzophrenic to like GT6, or irrational to say that there are elements of racing sim in the car behavior. I say so, because I find it to be true. Look, even Lawndart, who likes iRacing and races a Miata in real life, says that Gran Turismo just has something wholesome and tangibly real in there when you race a car, even as it's not the best racing simulation on the market. Yes, he wants it to be more like AC, RaceRoom and iRacing without the floatiness. I do too. But there isn't anything contradictory in loving Gran Turismo and wanting to see it improve.

There isn't anything contradictory about disliking Gran Turismo at this point and wanting to see it improve either. See what I did there? Perhaps you should learn that. I'm curious as well, seems to me the only similarities between Forza and GT are the same as every other driving game - cars and tracks. The sound approach is different, the physics are handled differently, the customization is far superior in Forza, drivatars, loads of DLC, game every 2 years etc. I see a ton of differences and nothing that signifies a clone. If Forza is a "clone" of GT, where exactly has Forza copied GT, which is what cloning implies? What are the similarities between the two that aren't common similarities of most racing games?

But what baffles me about this place is the point of Trevor's entire post. What's the point of posting ill will and grudges day in and day out? Has Gran Turismo and Kazunori offended you guys that much? Really??

I think the point of his post is, paraphrasing of course, "If you don't like Gran Turismo, don't post in the GT section of the forums". Sums it up pretty nicely IMO. Good luck with that.

You may think Trevor and I are blithering idiots. Fine with me.

A little extreme but fits right in with the whole martyr theme.

 

[TrevorPhilips]

You do realise that the guy you're quoting spends more time than most doing the EXACT same thing but in reverse right? So, by proxy, your insult to the members of the GTP community actually rigorously applies to him. And he liked your post.

Gotta love the irony

I did not know that to be honest. So you are telling me all the derailments here are the cause of one man's efforts elsewhere? If so that is even more petty than I originally envisaged. You all need to grow up as far as I am concerned.

I think the point of his post is, paraphrasing of course, "If you don't like Gran Turismo, don't post in the GT section of the forums". Sums it up pretty nicely IMO. Good luck with that.

Nope, more like why waste your life discussing the same points over and over again to little or no personal gain. For a game you have little to no interest in playing. For a game you have little or no knowledge of at this point in time. But that's just my opinion, who am I to tell you how to spend your life. If, when the end does inevitably come, and you start to contemplate how things went in that relatively short existence , you might sum up whether or not this time was spent well here.

Like I said it is okay to not like something and make your point known, that's perfectly fine, whether it's here or anywhere for that matter and I welcome that. But to do it day in day out, again and again is sheer madness in my eyes.

Albert Einstein summed it up pretty well.. "Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results" From the outside looking in I think that sums up all of your efforts here. Whether it be here, the Forza section, or anywhere else this personal grudge match spills over to.

I have one very simple question Johnny... Why?

A little extreme but fits right in with the whole martyr theme.

I am no martyr nor am I an idiot.

 

[TJC_69]

I did not know that to be honest. So you are telling me all the derailments here are the cause of one man's efforts elsewhere? If so that is even more petty than I originally envisaged. You all need to grow up as far as I am concerned.

Well the thread is only a mere 4 pages long. I would've assumed you would've at least of had a quick read through if you were interested in validly contributing.

But as we are "sad, psychotic, and we all need to grow up, are wasting our valuable time on earth" etc, then I guess you are in association by commenting on the thread also? Or is it edgy in the rhetoric to say as much without providing any evidence to back up such perceived GTP community targeted flame bait?

Look at where everyone here, aside from a minority in some cases, show logic and reasoning in their replies. Then come back and repeat the same.

Furthermore, you said you were off to NeoGaf? Will time spent there not cause a conflicting paradigm with your mantra of people wasting their lives discussing the same points etc?

Hmmm.

 

[TrevorPhilips]

I've said what I feel I needed to say. You have misinterpreted a lot of it, intentionally or not I don't know and also don't care. I have no wish to repeat myself and I have nothing to add other than the GTP community consists of A HELL OF A LOT more than the very few I'm talking about. I have no problem with any of them, It's good to hear their opinions and partake in their discussions.

 

[TJC_69]

I've said what I feel I needed to say. You have misinterpreted a lot of it, intentionally or not I don't know and also don't care. I have no wish to repeat myself and I have nothing to add other than the GTP community consists of A HELL OF A LOT more than the very few I'm talking about. I have no problem with any of them, It's good to hear their opinions and partake in their discussions.

So just flame baiting, throwing insults to those who are wishing to debate GT7 then. NeoGaf will be lucky to have you. Moving on.

 

[Tornado]

You're not one of the cool in-people unless you're highly critical of Gran Turismo, or at least GT5 and 6. If you do happen to like Gran Turismo, you had better not have anything to say but glowing praise about other games.

This is a patently strange claim for you to make, since you've been directly shown examples of people chewing out Turn 10 and Forza and Microsoft for various things about specific Forza titles after you've spouted the "people are only allowed to complain about GT" garbage in the past, and yet none of the exchanges you were shown resulted in McLaren butting in out of the blue to call everyone some name and complain about double standards and say people should go back to the GT section instead.
I can easily dig up posts regarding Forza 5 where people were complaining about how the low initial car count and especially the initial DLC for Forza 5 were ridiculous since the circumstances surrounding both were so suspicious. I can easily dig up posts of people complaining about Microsoft's policies regarding accessory compatibility and the apparent resulting money gouging for the Xbone. I can easily dig up posts regarding Forza 5 where people are calling out Turn 10 statements about the development of Forza 5 because they didn't actually mesh with the reality of the released game. Are you similarly asserting that for every one of those Turn 10-critical posts I'll be able to find a post where McLaren (or anyone, really) marched into the thread just to tell those people to stop whining and go post somewhere else or whatever? Because they certainly do exist (I remember one laughable one telling people that they shouldn't be allowed to use their 360 wheels anymore, because they are so obsolete they simply can't function well enough to do what Xbone developers will theoretically want to do with racing games), but according to the insinuations you're constantly making they should be near universal, with even the staff getting in on telling people essentially to shut up when they criticize the mighty ¥urn 10, Micro$oft and ForƵa series.



In fact, I'd say that while I don't frequently post in this subforum, I almost always watch it; and with one notable exception (who regularly gets chewed out it anyway, so the regulars of this forum probably know whom I'm referring to), no one in this subforum seems to have the finely honed Turn 10 equivalent to the "PD Sense" that you and (to a far greater extent) our dearly departed Zer0 went out of their way to bring to bear at any given opportunity right up to the point where the argument went bad for you (at which point you only then claimed that you had better things to do than argue about something you brought up because everyone is against you anyway).

I wonder how many times you're going to insist this line of horse:censored: you keep trying to suicide-by-cop yourself over is true before you realize that people aren't going to start believing it. People can be and are critical of whatever Turn 10 happen to be doing whenever they show something. It isn't even remotely difficult to find examples of people being such; so perhaps some inner reflection is necessary on your part to understand why people respond that way to you when you wade into a subforum for a game you obviously have no interest in just to spout arguments so illogical that Johnnie Chochrane would have had you on OJ's defense team; or why people respond to you when people are attempting to debate something and you wade into a thread with a non-sequitor about Forza and how it isn't really any better at doing some other thing so complaints about what the thread were actually about are invalid.

You can't say anything but the car models are paaarfect.

And that's a lie that you know is a lie.

You can't say that outsourcing is anything but a magic wand that solves all issues.

More people on this forum actually say that outsourcing inherently causes quality problems than the imaginary majority sentiment that outsourcing is the easy solution to everything. Both things are untrue, by the way.

It would also help if your personal posts on that issue weren't occasionally undercut with stuff like this:

By the way, Vietnam isn't the first country I'd think of to find ace modeling staff.

Dare to even suggest that Microsoft isn't a good company to be involved in the gaming market, and someone will unload.

That's because you don't "suggest that Microsoft isn't a good company to be involved in the gaming market". You say "Micro$oft" as if that is a point in and of itself then throw around words like "monopoly" and talk about poor broke Sony who can't afford to compete. You've done it so many times that you were even banned for it.

At least there, some of us could say that we thought the car sounds in Forza 4 were overblown. Here? Such talk is treasonous.

Are you really that dumb? With how easy it is to search for keywords on this forum, why do you insist on completely fabricating arguments when it's so easy to look up the way you've actually criticized Forza sounds before and the responses you got in return?



You "banished yourself from the Forza section" because even you realized that posting hypocritical logical black holes about how you're the only one who knows how this forum works and pretending it is a ploy for Devil's Advocacy isn't going to fly when the people you're talking nonsense at know you're full of 🤬. At least in this forum you're given the benefit of the doubt because not everyone has actually played the game's you're pretending to be knowledgeable about; which is incidentally also transparently why you immediately retreat from a thread and wait a week or so to throw a tantrum in different one instead whenever you're called on something. We're all lucky that Zer0 didn't have your sense of self-preservation when he did the same thing.

 

[TrevorPhilips]

Okay, this might be just for you TJC, but for anybody else struggling to comprehend my posts...

Well the thread is only a mere 4 pages long. I would've assumed you would've at least of had a quick read through if you were interested in validly contributing.

"Here" means GT Planet Forums, more specifically, but not exclusive to, the sub forum we are now in. I feel your whole post is based off of that misinterpretation but I shall continue none the less.

But as we are "sad, psychotic, and we all need to grow up, are wasting our valuable time on earth" etc, then I guess you are in association by commenting on the thread also? Or is it edgy in the rhetoric to say as much without providing any evidence to back up such perceived GTP community targeted flame bait?

I stated my feelings above on the GT community in the last post above. The extremely vast majority are good people who share an enthusiastic passion for racing games. Don't try and say I am targeting the community when anybody with any sort of reading comprehension can see that is definitely not the case.

Look at where everyone here, aside from a minority in some cases, show logic and reasoning in their replies. Then come back and repeat the same.

See top sentence. But to add to that, I have no trouble with a reasoned, healthy, debate, I've stated that above too. Good or bad everybody has a right to their opinion and also have a right to defend it as long as they like. But there is a line to that I feel and I think a few people have wayyyy crossed that line into unhealthy territories in my opinion. Hence my statements in earlier posts on mentality and sanity. There are no winners in the games they are playing.

Good points go unnoticed or lost in the sea of repetition by these few. Ideas get shot down as casualties of this war of personal grudges or general dislike of the opposing game (which in truth is not opposing in any way shape or form if youo are a motor racing/car fan). I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of people have started typing a post, anticipated the responses, and thought better of it. I know I have.

Furthermore, you said you were off to NeoGaf? Will time spent there not cause a conflicting paradigm with your mantra of people wasting their lives discussing the same points etc?

No. Not at all. Try to pull this kind of **** that the few members are exercising here (on this board, not thread like you have misinterpreted in the past), Your stay will be short lived. There is a truly massive difference between arguing or defending your stance, and just repeating yourself at any and every opportunity, in any or every thread, regardless of the starting subject.

So just flame baiting, throwing insults to those who are wishing to debate GT7 then. NeoGaf will be lucky to have you. Moving on.

I asked a question. That question is yet to be answered. I'll take an answer here or via PM. I'd like to understand the psyche of what is going on here now to be honest. Maybe that answer will change my views on how I see it. Maybe it will cement them, who knows.

Rant? Yes, flame bait? Most definitely not. Anyway I can't make my views any clearer for you now and I am way, way off topic but I felt I needed to say this somewhere and here is as good as any. Carry on with PM's if you like?

Lastly, I'd like to apologise to anyone else who has misinterpreted and feels offended by my posts but I'd hazard a guess most people understand where I'm coming from and what I'm getting at.

 

[jergto]

Its simple really, while I still check from time to time what the next GT is all about, I have been playing Forza and love it. If there is a game that beats Forza then I will jump. I'm not loyal to a console, but I do have a game preference. I used to defend the GT series, but its stupid and I was young then, I'm hitting 31 next month and feel all the wiser. I have a coworker that placed in the top 20 during the first iteration of GT academy, he prefers the Forza series but prefers Assetto Corsa over both for rig driving. Had he made the driving portion I believe he would have dominated. The guy can drive in games & in real life. The guy races on unbeatable setting. The best I could muster is hard/very skilled setting. Thats 2 or maybe 3 levels lower than the highest which is unbeatable, dirty driving AI.

To me sticking to one racing game is like sticking to one car or one brand. Really stupid when you miss out on other cars. I'm coming from a '13 Mustang GT and have a v10 snake in the pipeline, winter 2016 at the latest. If you want to stick to one brand thats your prerogative, but imo everyone needs to try a little variety every now and then.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Ya know, it's one thing to want to see a Gran Turismo made just for you, and explaining in great detail just what that is. It's another to keep repeating endlessly every flaw of GT6 like it will give everyone AIDS, or faux worries that GT has become the asteroid that's going to kill everyone in Polyphony Digital.

It's not quite Godwin's Law, but it's close. Are you seriously heading down that path?

I find it curious you'd put any value in a post's Likes total whatsoever. Even more curious, that you would then dismiss posts with small amounts of likes on the grounds that it can't be very many people sharing the viewpoint... and then not realize your posts carry less. Surely the irony isn't lost on you.

You can't say anything but the car models are paaarfect.

[citation required]

You can't say that outsourcing is anything but a magic wand that solves all issues.

[citation required]

Some of us could say that we thought the car sounds in Forza 4 were overblown. Here? Such talk is treasonous.

[citation required]

Frankly, the staff are tired of you making baseless accusations about some sort of hidden, unspoken "rules" about the forums. You've been given far more chances than other members when it comes to making unfounded claims, and yet you continue to do so, despite all the warnings. Consider this the last one.

Just in case it isn't abundantly clear: GTPlanet does not require that users must only be positive about any video game series. Nor does it have a requirement that they must only be critical. It does however require users to not post anything misleading or inaccurate. So you will stop doing that now, and this thread derailment will end.

 

[FoRiZon]

Anyone who think GT6 has been punched by harsh criticism didnt notice that PCars got one too for bugs.

So all equal, then.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Anyone who think GT6 has been punched by harsh criticism didnt notice that PCars got one too for bugs.

So all equal, then.

I don't really see harsh criticism on Pcars as often as on GT 6 here, nor the heated discussion that follows, unless maybe my posts about the car setup in Pcars getting attention from some members here or some who have been vocal about the bugs/glitches/crashes like @TT92 or @wowbaggerBR getting heated discussion with member from WMD.

What goes here in GTP won't fly long at Pcars official forums, imagine all the posters here that usually posts negative vibe ( criticism) all the time, do so at Pcars official forums. I would imagine Ian Bell would be using his hammer a lot when he sees certain poster keep posting same dribble in different threads and someone likes the post ( remove him too )

 

[FoRiZon]

I don't really see harsh criticism on Pcars as often as on GT 6 here, nor the heated discussion that follows, unless maybe my posts about the car setup in Pcars getting attention from some members here or some who have been vocal about the bugs/glitches/crashes like @TT92 or @wowbaggerBR getting heated discussion with member from WMD.

What goes here in GTP won't fly long at Pcars official forums, imagine all the posters here that usually posts negative vibe ( criticism) all the time, do so at Pcars official forums. I would imagine Ian Bell would be using his hammer a lot when he sees certain poster keep posting same dribble in different threads and someone likes the post ( remove him too )

Ahahaha.

I have to be fair, though. The real reason why the GT6 is being heard louder is because, firstly, this is GTPlanet, a site mainly, but not only, for Gran Turismo fans. Secondly, PCars are relatively new franchise, while GT has been around for years and for this generation alone has been 8 years.

Ive also heard huge criticism on Forza 5. But T10 quickly responded with bunch of free tracks and then Forza 6. Time will tell if its finally resolved.

 

[NLxAROSA]

I don't really see harsh criticism on Pcars as often as on GT 6 here, nor the heated discussion that follows

That's because in there people don't gett butthurt as if someone insults their mother when a flaw in a computer game is pointed out. Instead they ask for more info so a case can be built, then it's reported to SMS, and then it gets fixed (or an explanation is given as to why something works a certain way). No emotion involved, minus a few exceptions.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

That's because in there people don't gett butthurt as if someone insults their mother when a flaw in a computer game is pointed out. Instead they ask for more info so a case can be built, then it's reported to SMS, and then it gets fixed (or an explanation is given as to why something works a certain way). No emotion involved, minus a few exceptions.

I guess the frustration of PD silence takes it toll on some people I don't get emotionally attached to a game Just have some fun with what I have

Some Pcars players do get very emotional at pcars official forums, it's like the game was thousands of dollars of investments turned sour

 

[Mike_grpA]

That's because in there people don't gett butthurt as if someone insults their mother when a flaw in a computer game is pointed out. Instead they ask for more info so a case can be built, then it's reported to SMS, and then it gets fixed (or an explanation is given as to why something works a certain way). No emotion involved, minus a few exceptions.

I agree with this. The Pcars subforum is a pretty laid back place (though not as laid back as the Driveclub one). Most of the time, if someone has a problem, or criticism, people will talk to them about it and suggest possible workarounds if it's a problem. I guess because it's a new franchise it doesn't have the type of religious following that GT and Forza have. There are a minority in both GT and Forza forums who simply won't allow anything bad to be said about 'their' game. Even if it's not actually bad, but just not their view, they get all offended and chuck a tantrum.

Of course the majority of people on GTP, in all the subforums, can talk like adults and understand criticism and debate, without having a hissy fit. It's only a minority who get all butthurt about someone not liking, or agreeing with them about, their favourite game.

 

[nocturnalgrey]

If Kaz is reading this he just needs to retire. Or Sony should stop funding the boring ass game. What can I say, I'm a sucker, I have every iteration of GT, I even have a JPN version of GT5 prologue. But they never get play, I put in more time in Horizon 2 and I'm not even a fan of arcade racing! But the engine sounds and cruising around is awesome. I plan on getting FM6 and buying the Porsche pack.

Guys, look forward to T10's FM6. I hope some of you give it a chance like I did back in 2009 when I was watching people play FM3 on justintv (now twitch). In 2011 I made the jump. Sadly I still look back at GT series and realize what a disappoint the series really has become.

One thing I do miss are the original GT tracks and thats about it!

Kaz, if you are reading this, do not listen to this post. GT6 was disappointing to a lot of us, but take this as an opportunity to right the ship.

I am looking forward to FM6, but I am already disappointed by the lack of dynamic time and weather. The puddles are way better then I thought they would be, but it will become stale once I memorize the locations of the puddles.