New videos from the Nürburgring (Read the 1st post!)

  • Thread starter Thread starter G.T.Ace
  • 714 comments
  • 74,051 views
Smooth shadows is just not possible in a game right now. You need real time ray tracing to do it!
 
I don't know why people expect the PS3 to do everthing it simply can't. Despite Sony saying it only does everything, their lying.
 
We cant play this demo what a sad ..
 
Max_DC
First of all I don't want to hijack this thread with this tree topic - after all certainly not my or our biggest problem.

I also don't think that PD should try to reach tree perfection - I just don't want to look the trees right next to the track like this :

A little more 3-dimensional and like in Shift animated ( wind etc ). Organic, lifelike, not looking like a 2-bitmap-cross from 1998 in highdef.
Click to expand...

The problem is priority and choose which elements are more important and which are trivial or less important.
Don't get me wrong, the trees in the other game-pics you showed do look nicer perhaps but look at the other aspects in the same pics.
The interior and car models are far less detailed or even accurate than anything PD showed us recently and the GT5 Nurburgring shot isn't even near the perspective or angle you would see those trees in-game whilst driving.
I'd rather have 2D trees and a spectacular looking game than a mediocre looking one which happens to have 3D trees.
In an ideal world we could have both, but the current-gen console limitations as well as other aspects ( time, effort, etc. ) makes that a game developer has to choose which aspects he wishes to accentuate.
And PD makes a better judgement IMO than those developers which games you chose to demonstrate.
 
CoolColJ
Smooth shadows is just not possible in a game right now. You need real time ray tracing to do it!
Click to expand...

Ray tracing is for hard shadows only ;)
The resolution of the shadow maps has to become higher, or other techniques should be used.
 
Bram Turismo
I think that's just due to the shadows being in motion. If you look at the environment and the shadows on the track it's not sharp either, but that's because it's all in motion. PD has put so much effort into the graphics, I highly doubt anything will be jagged when the final product will be released.
Click to expand...

When playing the game they will be just as visible. That "moire" effect I think is one of the things "Kotaku" complained about being a bit annoying when they played the game in 3D at CES back in Jan.
The 3D effect was, for lack of a better word, tastefully done, offering a sense of depth to the road ahead without much in the way of technical gimmickry. But it did have a drawback, as objects far in the distance and shadows cast on the car's interior introduced a more noticeable moiré pattern effect when viewed in 3D.

My concern is if it will become distracting or not. If so it then can make players not use cockpit view and if we dont use that then do we loose out on head tracking?
On a positive note I agree these videos show a game thats now improved graphically by quite a bit it seems over GT5P.
 
Last edited:
Man, that old version of the ring could have easily been put in a Prologue update :(
 
Spagetti69
I don't know why people expect the PS3 to do everthing it simply can't. Despite Sony saying it only does everything, their lying.
Click to expand...

Exactly, people shouldn't take that 'slogan' literally, the PS3 cannot make tea for example and was never intended to be able to.;)

As long as we get a good amount of Nurburgring 24hr/VLN series cars to go with these tracks, decent day/night changes and pit stops etc. I'll be happy. I personally couldn't give a damn about the quality of trees, if your racing at the Nurburgring (particularly a 24hr race) the last thing you should be looking are the trees anyway.

I myself am very impressed with these videos and not because i'm in a Nurburgring 24hrs mood (although the 24hr track and crowd are awesome!), I think visually the game looks great and significantly better than GT5P.👍
 
Tommi2000

As long as we get a good amount of Nurburgring 24hr/VLN series cars to go with these tracks, decent day/night changes and pit stops etc. I'll be happy. I personally couldn't give a damn about the quality of trees, if your racing at the Nurburgring (particularly a 24hr race) the last thing you should be looking are the trees anyway.
Click to expand...

Well said.

You guys better shut up about the trees, the last thing we all want is GT5 not getting released this year. After all, trees aren't exactly going to affect your performance are they?
 
Tommi2000
Exactly, people shouldn't take that 'slogan' literally, the PS3 cannot make tea for example and was never intended to be able to.;)
Click to expand...

It always bothered me you can't make a decent cup of tea using the PS3 although coffee-making is a possibilty strangely enough, as well as grilling a steak or frying an egg.;)

ps3grill.jpg


Maybe the version I own is a limited edition though......:D
 
Max_DC
First of all I don't want to hijack this thread with this tree topic - after all certainly not my or our biggest problem.

I also don't think that PD should try to reach tree perfection - I just don't want to look the trees right next to the track like this :

But a little bit like this :

A little more 3-dimensional and like in Shift animated ( wind etc ). Organic, lifelike, not looking like a 2-bitmap-cross from 1998 in highdef.
Click to expand...
I'm confused, you're complainng about lower detail cardboard cut out trees and then saying they should be more like Forza 3's lower detail cardboard cut out trees. And you can clearly tell in Forza 3 that's all they are. The trees in the TDU pic look best but TDU uses far less graphical effects, the car models are only 10k polys as opposed to 300-400k. The trees in GT5 look good enough, they might spoil the occasion photomode shot, but they do in Forza 3 too. It's really not a big deal and if that's your benchmark for immersion then go and find another game. I can't compare to Shifts, but again Shift is an all together lower detail and poly game, so it might well have better looking trees. But Forza 3's arn't very good, they don't bother me but I always have to alter my camera angles if I'm taking a photo to minimise how visually obviouse they're cardboard cross overs. It's no big deal though and I don't see why it will be in GT5. The environment as a whole looks fantastic.
 
To the guy who posted the pics of Forza and TDU iI think? You have just responded to your own point, look what those other games had to sacrafice in order to have nice trees, is that what you really want GT5 to be like?

God help us all when a screen shot or video of Spa is released ! It'll be Tree-mendous in here ;)
 
Last edited:
Im just a bit dissapointed about the smooth track syndrome.
 
Well if GT5 can add in weather that will be awesome.
I still have a feeling its not being put in though and that will be a shame as Codemasters latest video of their weather system looks to be the best ever devised for a game.
Not sure about their trees, lol but F1 will have night/day and weather...
 
Really hope someone out there ( Nur 24h ) has the intention to drive and supply footage of other cars as well ( McLaren F1 interior view? ) apart from the ones we've already seen many times before.:)

At least if it's even possible to drive the F1, maybe it's just for now only appearing on the grid.
 
Qronicle
Ray tracing is for hard shadows only ;)
The resolution of the shadow maps has to become higher, or other techniques should be used.
Click to expand...

the Sun's shadows are hard! :)

High res shadow maps = lots of memory, something a PS3 doesn't have a lot of


-------

about the trees, do realise there are a ton of em on the Ring, and this track is really long, especially in 24 hour configuration.

anyway I'm impressed by the depth of the new tracks, it just has more feel to it, instead of just being like a railroad track before
 
This is The Best Looking Ring on any console or platform.
Hide your worthless comments yourself.
PD did a good combination between cars and environment.
Both Cars and environment looking same quality.
Engine sounds check
Environment detail check
Physics Check but these vioes was played in Arcade physics.
Damage -Day n Night Cycles - Weather Changes or Weather in Progress \ There are alot Hunting games for Tree lovers.
They look good in motion.
P d had better to remove these spars.They seems unrealistic.When i touch the Tire barriers on the side of the track Sparks will come out.This is real driving simulator right?Make it better PD or remove that you know what is the best. i didnt understand why they put sparks.Maybe for damage system.,I prefer Sparks coming from under the car
We will see it at e3
 
Spagetti69
Im just a bit dissapointed about the smooth track syndrome.
Click to expand...

Have you played the demo then? what did you think of it? Were the physics changed from the Time Trial?

And yeah, the sparks do look pretty naff............. Everything else looks amazing though :)
 
I didnt realise they were played in arcade mode. That's answered some of my questions.
 
No46_TheDoctor
Have you played the demo then? what did you think of it? Were the physics changed from the Time Trial?
Click to expand...

No I watched the video.
 
Hey how many cars are on these last videos?
Hasnt it been a long time since we seen a recent video with 8+ cars?
All the Tokyo and Minimax videos was with 8 wernt they?

I really hope they havnt dropped to 8 cars guys?
 
Last edited:
No46_TheDoctor
To the guy who posted the pics of Forza and TDU iI think? You have just responded to your own point, look what those other games had to sacrafice in order to have nice trees, is that what you really want GT5 to be like?

God hep us all when a screen shot or video of Spa is released ! It'll be Tree-mendous in here ;)
Click to expand...

Spot on sir. I was about to post something similar. Those trees may be 3D but everything else looks so bad and dated compared to GT5. GT may get a thumbs down for 2D trees but I give GT thumbs up for accurate car models, accurate track models, spectacular lighting, spectacular cockpits, extreme level of detail etc ( can't say the same about those other games in the pictures provided ).
 
Last edited:
Yea they look 2D when the view is so high, if you watch the trees in the videos when the car is driving they look just fine.
 
The fact is that the Nurburgring massive tree representation is the most accurate and realistic looking in any game. That's the only I need to know about trees when I play a sim.

Other games show trees more detailed at closeups or pause but often looking very fake and far representative of the real thing, more like generic copy pasted videogame trees created with some sort of automated tree generator.
 
Realistic car models, reflections, lighting, shadows, smooth frame rate > high res trees.
 
I completely agree that the trees are crap, and while that's fine for those further away from the track, creating an illusion of a forest, those right by the track should have freaking trunks and few branches, because when you offset a crossed 2d bitmap(2 polygons) with a car made out of hundreds of thousands of polygons, standing right next to it, it looks bad, really bad. I'm not looking for trees on par with car's detail, but come on, they can do better than 2-polygon trees right by the fence...

p.s. Those sparks are ridiculous too!;)
p.s. These two things are sucky, otherwise, it looks really nice!:)
 
Last edited:
Jantsu92
New vid
Click to expand...


I hope they turn down those sparks... especially because sparks from the outside of your car shouldn't be flying THROUGH it into the cockpit. Everything else I'm happy with.
 
:lol: Can't you just stop talking about trees all the time, it's getting boring and they look much better than in all previous versions so what's the problem?
Same goes for "It's the real driving simulator!", it's a joke ... but then you'd need to understand Japanese humour... want to play a driving simulator ? Buy a PC then, this is Gran Turismo! :dunce:
 
I think sparks have been misinterpreted from this demo. In my opinion they arent sparks at all, just a visual representation of an impact occurring. The in car video confirms this for me. Like, why would PD animate sparks that came inside! Maybe the demo was built with 3D in mind and the 'KAPOW' lines ( official name :lol: ) give more of an inpact if you play in 3D.

Wether they're sparks or,.. KAPOW lines, i'd prefer not to see them either way. Too arcadey.

Sparks from car totalling incidents, fine.
Sparks from cars bottoming out on tarmac, yes.
Anything else, no thanks.

Really impressed with the videos so far though, visually. Need to see pro physics. We'll see the ring in all of its pimpley glory then i'll bet.
 
Wow no wonder GT5 will never been finished... After 6 years you guys are whining for 2D trees and sparks?

So lets give them another 2 years for development...
 
Back