Normal Car Cup

Discussion in 'Gran Turismo 1' started by psonefreak, Apr 15, 2002.

  1. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Extracts from Normal Car Cup. 1996 Corvette @GVES II and Deepforest II
     
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2020
  2. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Hey,
    A long time ago, SportWagon (where is this great member?) made this post: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/normal-car-cup.7786/#post-437667 .
    Kind of a summary of which "Normal" car can win the Normal Car Cup. I love summaries. :dopey:
    With his permission and using his post as a base, I'd like to go on with his idea, must say a perfect idea for a second post on page 3 :) .
    Maybe it could be used as "Challenge List" ... ???
    For the videos below, I tried to privilege the GT-Planet members ones, as far as their pseudo is the same on Youtube & here.

    Cars from Chrysler/Dodge
    Concept Car - PAL
    Viper RT/10 - PAL
    AND
    Viper GTS - NTSC-J

    Cars from Toyota
    Supra RZ - PAL
    Supra'95 RZ - PAL TRD 3000GT - PAL Supra JZA70 (awesome) - NTSC-U Soarer 2.5 GT-T VVT-i - NTSC-J Soarer 2.5 GT-T '95 - PAL (No NSX) Chaser Tourer V - PAL Mark II '92 Tourer V - PAL (No NSX) MR2 GT-S - PAL (No NSX) Celica GT-Four - PAL (No NSX)

    Cars from TVR
    Cerbera - PAL Griffith 4.0 - PAL Griffith 500 - PAL

    Cars from Mitsubishi
    Eclipse GT (incredible) - NTSC-U Galant VR-4 (great) - PAL Lancer Evo III - PAL Lancer Evo IV - PAL GTO'92 Twinturbo - PAL GTO'95 TwinTurbo
    GTO'95 MR - PAL GTO Twinturbo​

    Cars from Honda/Acura
    NSX type S Zero - PAL (only a few races) NSX Type S
    NSX
    NSX'92 TypeR - PAL NSX'90 - PAL
    Cars from Chevrolet
    Corvette'96 - PAL Corvette'67 - PAL Camaro Z28 - PAL (No NSX)
    Cars from Subaru
    Impreza'96 WRX-STi III - PAL Impreza'95 WRX-STi II - PAL Impreza WRX Type R STi Version - PAL Imp.'96 WG WRX-STi Ver. III
    Imp.'95 WG WRX-STi Ver. II - PAL Imp.'94 Wagon WRX - PAL Legacy Touring Sedan RS - PAL (No NSX)
    Cars from Car Wash
    Nothing here, everything is clean​

    Cars from Nissan
    Silvia S14 (strong driving) - NTSC-J Pulsar'91 GTI-R - PAL (No NSX) Fairlady Z 2seater TwinTurbo - PAL (Against NSX!!!) R33 GTS25t Type M - PAL (No NSX) R32 Skyline GT-R'89 - PAL R32 Skyline GT-R'91 - PAL R32 Skyline GT-R Vspec - PAL R32 Skyline GT-R Vspec II - PAL R32 Skyline GT-R Nismo - PAL R33 Skyline'95 GT-R
    R33 Skyline'95 GT-R Vspec
    R33 Skyline GT-R
    R33 Skyline GT-R Vspec
    Nismo 400R - PAL Nismo GT-R LM - PAL

    Cars from Mazda
    FD RX-7 '91 Type R - PAL FD RX-7 Type RB - PAL (No NSX) FD RX-7 Touring X - NTSC-J FD RX-7 Type RZ - PAL FD RX-7 A-spec - PAL Cosmo 20B Type-E CCS - PAL (No NSX) FC RX-7 (missing video forever? Failed attempt here)​

    Cars from Aston Martin
    DB7 Coupe - PAL (No NSX) DB7 Volante - PAL (No NSX)

    Questions:
    - do you think a '96 Soarer 2.5GT-T VVT-i could win? 269hp-1570kg/3439Lbs - Edit 04/13/20: possible on JP
    - '95 Soarer 2.5GT-T? 266hp-1570kg/3461Lbs - Edit 05/18/20: possible vs the TRD 3000GT
    - '92 Mark II Tourer V? 266hp-1450kg/3196Lbs - Edit 05/06/20: possible vs the TRD 3000GT
    - Chaser Tourer V? 286hp-1470kg/3240Lbs - Edit 05/07/20: possible on PAL
    - Celica GT-Four? 245hp-1380kg/3042Lbs - Edit 05/05/20: possible against the TRD 3000GT
    - Fairlady Z TwinTurbo? 272hp-1530kg/3373Lbs - Edit 04/18/20: Great run against NSX on PAL: here
    - VR-4 Galant? 272hp-1480kg/3262Lbs - Edit 04/17/20: possible on PAL !!
    - Nissan Pulsar'91? Edit 05/14/20: possible against the TRD 3000GT
    Apologies:
    If I forgot a car able to win, or if I'm a total dreamer about the Fairlady Z, for example. I'll be happy to add/correct it.
    Also, this is based on the PAL specs of the game, it seems there are some difference between this and the NTSC-U & maybe J of Gran Turismo.​

    Later videos additions (edit):
    04/08/20: a successful run with a gamesharked Corvette'67. Super-easy, much fun bothering the NSX
    04/11/20: a scandalous wallriding run with a Lancer Evo. III GSR. & a run with the Brilliant Black RX-7 Type RZ
    04/13/20: a run with Toyota Soarer (!! - Submaniac), & a run with RX-7 Type RB
    04/14/20: an outrageous wallriding run with a Lancer Evo. IV GSR, & a great Submaniac run with the 4-speed gearbox RX-7 Touring X on JP version (!)
    04/15/20: an atrocious wallriding run with a Nissan Fairlady Z, without any NSX
    04/16/20: a nice run with a Subaru Impreza '95 WRX WG WRX-STi Ver. II , a 2-parts run with an RT/10, & a run with a Mitsubishi GTO'95 MR
    04/17/20: a Master's run with a Mitsubishi Galant VR-4 (Submaniac) & an Impreza STi Type R

    04/18/20
    :
    a superb run with a Fairlady Z TwinTurbo, another one with the "lowest" GTO, the 1992 model. Finally a run with the NSX'90
    04/20/20: a run with the MR2 GT-S from Toyota, against TRD 3000GT
    04/21/20: a run with the Subaru Legacy Touring Sedan RS, against TRD 3000GT
    04/26/20: a run with the 1991 Nissan Pulsar GTi-R, against TRD 3000GT only
    04/29/20: a run with a Chevrolet Camaro Z28 against TRD 3000GT only (04/29/20)
    05/02/20: runs with a Subaru Impreza STi II, a Nissan Skyline R32 GT-R '89, & an Aston Martin DB7 Volante
    05/05/20: runs with the Celica GT-Four vs the TRD 3000GT, & with an Impreza'94 Wagon WRX
    05/06/20: a run with a Toyota Mark II '92 Tourer V versus TRD 3000GT only
    05/07/20: a run with the Toyota Chaser Tourer V vs the NSX
    05/08/20: a run with a R33 GTS25t Type M versus TRD 3000GT only
    05/10/20: a run with a Cosmo 20B Type-E CCS, no NSX

    05/18/20: a run with a Soarer '95 versus TRD 3000GT only
    06/04/20: runs with both R32 GT-R V-Spec & V-Spec II , and a failed attempt with an FC RX-7 against the TRD 3000GT only, on PAL
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020
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  3. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    Hmm should I attempt runs with cars that don't have a video in this list? *thinking emoji*
     
  4. Mouc

    Mouc

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    As you want, Sir. But no no no, I swear I did NOT made this post to see you attempting runs with cars that don't have a video in this list, no no no :O :D
    But if you do, what about the worst turbocharged GTO? Like '92? It's another whale, with the DB7 :D :D
     
  5. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    i see, i see... well consider me baited. I actually just beat it with a Soarer 2.5 gt-t vvti '97 (bonus version) on JP. I tried PAL and it was impossible. Got a 1-2-2-2-3 on it. While I got a 1-2-1-1-2 on JP. I swear despite my past testing on times, the game is easier on JP. I can't be placebo when i drove worse on JP (I spun out on SSR11!) lol
    This thing's awful. It's a boat with no brakes and no longitudinal grip ugh. Glad it's over x)
    The GTO i think has enough power to be competitive, but weight and its width is a big issue. We'll see. Non-turbo GTOs however... oboi. Probably not possible with them
     
  6. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Sorry, I can't do it alone, need your help, or other great drivers (Sough? ;) )
    So I may add a note, on successful runs/videos made on JP version?

    Agreed for the Soarer, even if the engine is great (it's a missile @MegaSpeed Cup).
    Another big boat (but with better grip) I'd love to see win the Normal event is the Fairlady Z. I once drove one in real life, it's an astounding car. :)
     
  7. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    I guess you could if you know write what version of the game was used in the links you write down. It's really mysterious why i have an easier time on JP... owo that's pretty nice, never drove a japanese sports before sadly :c
    I'm sure the 300ZX can make it fairly well. I'll try it at some point
     
  8. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    Here's my Soarer run

     
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  9. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Wow! The Yellow Soarer! My favorite, and the fastest ('cause it's yellow :) )
    Nice run! Sub 1.10' @GVES II. In my dreams I achieve that with such a car.
    But:

    - clearly the A.I. seems different from PAL. For example, at Clubman Stage Route 5 II, the NSX average lap time is around 54,5 sec, whatever happens. Or this one: in PAL, the NSX qualifying time is between 2:15 and 2:16 at SSR11, but it's more than 2:19 here in your run.
    - how comes that the NSX is behind the Impreza, after the Qualifying Sessions? And the TRD 3000GT is at the back of the pack? You never see that thing in PAL!
    - funny how the JP display seems (or is) slower & different compared to PAL. Took two screenshots from the same spot at GVES II, one in your vid', and in one of mine, seems the track is scaled down in JP. Camera point of view seems also a little bit lower in PAL :)

    [​IMG][​IMG]

    Added your run (thanks) to the summary, and an easy run (No NSX, lucky me :) ) with a red RX-7 Type RB. Great ride, almost as good as the Type RZ :)

     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020
  10. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    The only difference visually between GT1 JP and PAL is the hud's font, which is more square on JP. Don't forget you're using a different angle type for the camera (i think it's on "wide" on your end, which makes the FoV bigger, and things look further away at the center of the screen, as well as moves the car a bit forward. Kind of like a small fish eye effect) :p
    I'm using the stock one, but JP lacks the close chase cam sadly.
    It's a weird thing, the AI heh.
    As for the quali positions, I think it's ... i mean, pure theory there, but I think JP makes them closer to how the real life cars did on comparison races like on Tsukuba in Best Motoring. The Impreza was very light and often out-accelerated NSXes but i don't know if my theory has any truth in it or not. One thing for sure, it's different in PAL haha.
    JP's Megaspeed will have the GTO be 5th after quali rather than second, yeah...
     
  11. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    FDRX7 Touring X completed~
    Similar to the Soarer. I did a 2-2-1-1-2 on PAL and had to go on JP to beat it.
    I've added a controller input display in case @Mouc wants to see how i play in more details :p
    (i hold my controller weirdly, like claws)
     
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  12. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Sorry for inconvenience, I completely forgot this 'View" option! So for the sake of documenting this point, some new screen captures which confirm your explanations.

    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    The field of view is the same if you choose the "Normal" view in the Options Menu.

    Still very good driving with the RX-7 Touring X! It's a lil' bit like the Camaro, right? Good handling, good engine, but shameful gearbox and too much weight...
    All FD RX-7 are done :)
    Maybe a try with an FC RX-7 on JP? Or the Holy Grail for rotary lovers: a winning run with a Cosmo 20B (on JP, without the NSX? )

    Your way to handle the controller reminds me the RC cars, but with throttle at the right & steering at the left. I should try, I'm not so bad at RC cars (still have my JP ones from the eighties ;) ).
    This little "tremor" you do with the steering shift just before starting to turn (right or left), is that a way to avoid early sliding? Or to "average" the steering input, because it's not so precise, in GT1 ?

    Added your run ( :bowdown: ), and a Lancer Evo IV one to the summary. Wallriding @CSR5 II and SSR11 obviously, the car is underpowered for me. But I think you'll manage to get a 1-1-2-1-2(or1) with the green one :)
     
  13. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    Heheee we'll see what i do next (no plans yet). Yeah the wiggle i do is to make small adjustments to my trajectory since the deadzones are pretty large. I do so may unconsciously that my left joystick's got a nearly 1mm groove in the stalk and the bottom part of the slot has a crease x)
    Lancer Evo was my next thought, either III or IV, FC too. I didn't think of the Cosmo. So many left to try :p
     
  14. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Okay, thanks :)
    I'm also looking for 2 brand new original controllers, but it's getting hard to find...

    Added a winning run with a FairLady Z TwinTurbo to the summary . But too much wallriding as usual, and no NSX in the field... :grumpy:

     
  15. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    Could find a few Dualshock 2 if you want, PS2 controllers are retro compatible (which is awesome)
     
  16. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Well, how could I refuse? Let's discuss it elsewhere ;)

    Added some successful runs to the summary today:
    - Impreza Wagon '95 (found on YT)
    - Red Dodge Viper RT/10 (also found on YT)
    - GTO'95 MR. First time ever for me with this car, for some reasons (first one: total cheater's car with 900+hp when tuned :grumpy: ) . But, I must admit it's a good car, despite its dinosaur weight. The engine is so torqueful, powerful and seconded by a 6-speed gearbox, that you don't really feel the mass, and finally it's fast!
    I know a guy that will destroy the competition even on the 1992 model...
     
  17. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    Galant VR4 incoming~ (will edit post when the upload is completed)

    EDIT: shiieeeeeeeeeeet my sound's messed up! Gotta redo it :C
    EDIT2: Second run was much better. NSX gave me trouble, but i won all 5 races this time. I'll upload tomorrow~

    EDIT3: Recorded GTO Twinturbo '92 and Fairlady Z 2seater Turbo vs NSX heh. An extremely close win. Attempted the FC RX7 Infini III but it's impossible on PAL. Same for the 1994 Impreza Sedan WRX. I'll try on JP later
     
    Last edited: Apr 17, 2020
  18. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Cool :)
    Many cars can win actually, it's weird that there's not more variety on Youtube... But now there is! :gtpflag:

    Waiting for your runs, a winning Subaru Impreza STi Type R (easy, this car is great)

     
  19. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    Galant is up~

     
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  20. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Hey!
    Just watched the vid'... I'm flabbergasted.
    Funny to see a Daddy's car walking on a NSX! :D (clean driving, furthermore). And you were lucky that the NSX was in "Turquoise" green... Perfect with your purple boat ;)

    So glad the NSX messed up its CSR5 II, but this same cornering-bastard hit you badly at Deepforest!
     
  21. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    Yeah, the NSX is a bit of a b*tch lol

    GTO TwinT time~
    One of the easiest wins i had, this one.


    Now uploading the Fairlady Z run, which was extremely close! a 0.1s 1st place for the tie breaker haha


    EDIT: Aaaand here's the Fairlady run~
    It's weird. the car handles well enough, brakes well enough, accelerates well enough... but it's still slow.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2020
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  22. Mouc

    Mouc

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    :bowdown::bowdown::bowdown:
    Well, let's say that the Nissan Z is a very good boat, but still, a boat :) (in GT1)
    Also I didn't know that the GTO'92 had a 5-speeds gearbox only. Seems the later ones have a 6-speeds one.
    Congratulations for both runs, added to the summary! This thing's growing fast... We'll soon arrive to the gearbox-nightmares: the Cosmo 20B and the Camaro :mad:
     
  23. TumeK5

    TumeK5

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    You should really add Sough's run. His driving is godlike.
     
  24. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Hi,
    Already done ;) Sough is one of these Great Men that pushed me here, after having seen his vids :bowdown:
    It would be an honor that he joins us here to drive a "Nobody-thinks-about" Normal Car :)

    A run with the original NSX. Harder to control than the NSX Type S Zero...
     
  25. karelpipa

    karelpipa

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    You say that with FC RX-7 its impossible to win against NSX?
     
  26. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Would you say it's possible? :boggled:

    I'm so :banghead: not to have thought of it before: the famous "MR" from Toyota. This crazy little thing called MR2 GT-S is totally able to take the TRD 3000GT, and I'm 99% sure it can beat the NSX (not me, 100% sure).



    PS: I would have won at Deepforest if this jealous TRD 3000SoB wouldn't have slammed my beloved MR2 into the wall: 17:20 :mad:
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020
  27. submaniac93

    submaniac93

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    FC might be doable on JP, but i couldn't even get first on ARmini on PAL which really doesn't bode well overall lol. MR2 i think should be possible. I'll have to try. for now, i have a surprise in the works heh
     
  28. Mouc

    Mouc

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    We almost forgot "The Boat" from Subaru: the Legacy Touring Sedan RS (or the wagon, for the most vicious amongst us ;) ). Pretty good boat, I beat without much difficulty the TRD 3000GT, and I guess it could take the NSX :)
    It's a bit hard to get it started, but once it's done, nothing can stop it.

     
  29. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Hi,

    Gave a try tonight with the 222hp/1220kg '91 Pulsar (failed stupidly @GVES II & DeepForest II. 1 & 1.5 sec behind :mad: ).
    I think it's impossible on PAL against the NSX, but doable with the TRD 3000GT-only Entry List. With a 1-1-1-1-3 or maybe 1-1-1-1-2. A bit like Sough's (winning) attempt with an Eclipse:

     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020
  30. Mouc

    Mouc

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    Finally added to the summary a run with the Pulsar* (TRD 3000GT only). Surprisingly good "little" car, despite a weird steering. Not really understeering, but... I don't know. Not very precise I'd say.
    Or maybe it's just me: as usual, I ****ed up Deepforest II and SSR11. And I almost got nailed at GVES II by the TRD 3000GT.
    By the way I changed my estimation: an excellent driver could maybe manage a 1-1-2-1-2(or 3) against the NSX.



    * with it's Japanese license plate?
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2020