Normal Car Cup

Mouc · Jan 19, 2020

Extracts from Normal Car Cup. 1996 Corvette @GVES II and Deepforest II

Mouc · Apr 7, 2020

Hey,
A long time ago, SportWagon (where is this great member?) made this post: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/normal-car-cup.7786/#post-437667 .
Kind of a summary of which "Normal" car can win the Normal Car Cup. I love summaries.
With his permission and using his post as a base, I'd like to go on with his idea, must say a perfect idea for a second post on page 3 .
Maybe it could be used as "Challenge List" ... ???
For the videos below, I tried to privilege the GT-Planet members ones, as far as their pseudo is the same on Youtube & here.

Cars from Chrysler/Dodge

Concept Car - PAL

Viper RT/10 - PAL

AND

Viper GTS - NTSC-J

Cars from Toyota

Supra RZ - PAL

Supra'95 RZ - PAL

https://youtu.be/FxHos17Z3G4

TRD 3000GT - PAL

https://youtu.be/a-1YVWhfqQc

Supra JZA70 (awesome) - NTSC-U

https://youtu.be/Kx-gDvgTKfs

Soarer 2.5 GT-T VVT-i - NTSC-J

https://youtu.be/KtqUZk3D8gA

Soarer 2.5 GT-T '95 - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/DfMJg9Y9a_I

Chaser Tourer V - PAL

https://youtu.be/OKC8Wc2KOWw

Mark II '92 Tourer V - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/sQNh4cXWTic

MR2 GT-S - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/poBMmnQm6Ws

Celica GT-Four - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/tu_yju68YMA

Cars from TVR

Cerbera - PAL

https://youtu.be/MDrrs2LPxuo

Griffith 4.0 - PAL

https://youtu.be/iq9-zfZAxZY

Griffith 500 - PAL

https://youtu.be/rCWQcD8lYHs

Cars from Mitsubishi

Eclipse GT (incredible) - NTSC-U

https://youtu.be/C6NzGuyUfCs

Galant VR-4 (great) - PAL

https://youtu.be/HYHCrRZU7hg

Lancer Evo III - PAL

https://youtu.be/IccKOSik9IM

Lancer Evo IV - PAL

https://youtu.be/ofIcIQiZc3k

GTO'92 Twinturbo - PAL

https://youtu.be/xKHAusg8Css

GTO'95 TwinTurbo
GTO'95 MR - PAL

https://youtu.be/X2XJo-EUdiU

GTO Twinturbo

Cars from Honda/Acura

NSX type S Zero - PAL (only a few races)

https://youtu.be/wHHpc_F6tGo

NSX Type S
NSX
NSX'92 TypeR - PAL

https://youtu.be/wTUxgJ-Uqf0

NSX'90 - PAL

https://youtu.be/PeKbBNgZe4E

Cars from Chevrolet

Corvette'96 - PAL

https://youtu.be/NKx8B82OIv4

Corvette'67 - PAL

https://youtu.be/PwpAB1hF1go

Camaro Z28 - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/fiBPr76B-_o

Cars from Subaru

Impreza'96 WRX-STi III - PAL

https://youtu.be/kupGsWOFums

Impreza'95 WRX-STi II - PAL

https://youtu.be/p2DvBd_pmnE

Impreza WRX Type R STi Version - PAL

https://youtu.be/aQxnPqYRKUI

Imp.'96 WG WRX-STi Ver. III
Imp.'95 WG WRX-STi Ver. II - PAL

https://youtu.be/26odOpocBJU

Imp.'94 Wagon WRX - PAL

https://youtu.be/0r8zD0fLB1o

Legacy Touring Sedan RS - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/Eq_2hGDn2yM

Cars from Car Wash

Nothing here, everything is clean

Cars from Nissan

Silvia S14 (strong driving) - NTSC-J

https://youtu.be/mZXK_zfSO3E

Pulsar'91 GTI-R - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/kvUcF3iY424

Fairlady Z 2seater TwinTurbo - PAL (Against NSX!!!)

https://youtu.be/rMgfQO5EW-8

R33 GTS25t Type M - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/cNCcxEeuhIw

R32 Skyline GT-R'89 - PAL

https://youtu.be/xdZq3PREez4

R32 Skyline GT-R'91 - PAL

https://youtu.be/9ebIBHDwp7Y

R32 Skyline GT-R Vspec - PAL

https://youtu.be/zZNBs2rwPgw

R32 Skyline GT-R Vspec II - PAL

https://youtu.be/uYz5kUEVJM8

R32 Skyline GT-R Nismo - PAL

https://youtu.be/EsBXSQ4_xCg

R33 Skyline'95 GT-R
R33 Skyline'95 GT-R Vspec
R33 Skyline GT-R
R33 Skyline GT-R Vspec
Nismo 400R - PAL

https://youtu.be/MaVqiaJeJdk

Nismo GT-R LM - PAL

https://youtu.be/8QdLT8xAyhU

Cars from Mazda

FD RX-7 '91 Type R - PAL

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxKkbGiKsHw&

FD RX-7 Type RB - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/P8j4d02PLpY

FD RX-7 Touring X - NTSC-J

https://youtu.be/jWp49c4JEiI

FD RX-7 Type RZ - PAL

https://youtu.be/hAOfRp4aUlw

FD RX-7 A-spec - PAL

https://youtu.be/MNoqhUW70xU

Cosmo 20B Type-E CCS - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/6ppbieTLcJ8

FC RX-7 (missing video forever? Failed attempt here)

Cars from Aston Martin

DB7 Coupe - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/WnLIMLzecZg

DB7 Volante - PAL (No NSX)

https://youtu.be/Nncrh0CDNyg

Questions:

- do you think a '96 Soarer 2.5GT-T VVT-i could win? 269hp-1570kg/3439Lbs - Edit 04/13/20: possible on JP
- '95 Soarer 2.5GT-T? 266hp-1570kg/3461Lbs - Edit 05/18/20: possible vs the TRD 3000GT
- '92 Mark II Tourer V? 266hp-1450kg/3196Lbs - Edit 05/06/20: possible vs the TRD 3000GT
- Chaser Tourer V? 286hp-1470kg/3240Lbs - Edit 05/07/20: possible on PAL
- Celica GT-Four? 245hp-1380kg/3042Lbs - Edit 05/05/20: possible against the TRD 3000GT
- Fairlady Z TwinTurbo? 272hp-1530kg/3373Lbs - Edit 04/18/20: Great run against NSX on PAL: here
- VR-4 Galant? 272hp-1480kg/3262Lbs - Edit 04/17/20: possible on PAL !!
- Nissan Pulsar'91? Edit 05/14/20: possible against the TRD 3000GT

Apologies:

If I forgot a car able to win, or if I'm a total dreamer about the Fairlady Z, for example. I'll be happy to add/correct it.
Also, this is based on the PAL specs of the game, it seems there are some difference between this and the NTSC-U & maybe J of Gran Turismo.

Later videos additions (edit):
04/08/20: a successful run with a gamesharked Corvette'67. Super-easy, much fun bothering the NSX
04/11/20: a scandalous wallriding run with a Lancer Evo. III GSR. & a run with the Brilliant Black RX-7 Type RZ
04/13/20: a run with Toyota Soarer (!! - Submaniac), & a run with RX-7 Type RB
04/14/20: an outrageous wallriding run with a Lancer Evo. IV GSR, & a great Submaniac run with the 4-speed gearbox RX-7 Touring X on JP version (!)
04/15/20: an atrocious wallriding run with a Nissan Fairlady Z, without any NSX
04/16/20: a nice run with a Subaru Impreza '95 WRX WG WRX-STi Ver. II , a 2-parts run with an RT/10, & a run with a Mitsubishi GTO'95 MR
04/17/20: a Master's run with a Mitsubishi Galant VR-4 (Submaniac) & an Impreza STi Type R
04/18/20: a superb run with a Fairlady Z TwinTurbo, another one with the "lowest" GTO, the 1992 model. Finally a run with the NSX'90
04/20/20: a run with the MR2 GT-S from Toyota, against TRD 3000GT
04/21/20: a run with the Subaru Legacy Touring Sedan RS, against TRD 3000GT
04/26/20: a run with the 1991 Nissan Pulsar GTi-R, against TRD 3000GT only
04/29/20: a run with a Chevrolet Camaro Z28 against TRD 3000GT only (04/29/20)
05/02/20: runs with a Subaru Impreza STi II, a Nissan Skyline R32 GT-R '89, & an Aston Martin DB7 Volante
05/05/20: runs with the Celica GT-Four vs the TRD 3000GT, & with an Impreza'94 Wagon WRX
05/06/20: a run with a Toyota Mark II '92 Tourer V versus TRD 3000GT only
05/07/20: a run with the Toyota Chaser Tourer V vs the NSX
05/08/20: a run with a R33 GTS25t Type M versus TRD 3000GT only
05/10/20: a run with a Cosmo 20B Type-E CCS, no NSX
05/18/20: a run with a Soarer '95 versus TRD 3000GT only
06/04/20: runs with both R32 GT-R V-Spec & V-Spec II , and a failed attempt with an FC RX-7 against the TRD 3000GT only, on PAL

submaniac93 · Apr 11, 2020

Hmm should I attempt runs with cars that don't have a video in this list? *thinking emoji*

Mouc · Apr 11, 2020

submaniac93: ↑

Hmm should I attempt runs with cars that don't have a video in this list? *thinking emoji*
Click to expand...

As you want, Sir. But no no no, I swear I did NOT made this post to see you attempting runs with cars that don't have a video in this list, no no no
But if you do, what about the worst turbocharged GTO? Like '92? It's another whale, with the DB7

submaniac93 · Apr 11, 2020

i see, i see... well consider me baited. I actually just beat it with a Soarer 2.5 gt-t vvti '97 (bonus version) on JP. I tried PAL and it was impossible. Got a 1-2-2-2-3 on it. While I got a 1-2-1-1-2 on JP. I swear despite my past testing on times, the game is easier on JP. I can't be placebo when i drove worse on JP (I spun out on SSR11!) lol
This thing's awful. It's a boat with no brakes and no longitudinal grip ugh. Glad it's over x)
The GTO i think has enough power to be competitive, but weight and its width is a big issue. We'll see. Non-turbo GTOs however... oboi. Probably not possible with them

Mouc · Apr 11, 2020

submaniac93: ↑

i see, i see... well consider me baited.
Click to expand...

Sorry, I can't do it alone, need your help, or other great drivers (Sough? )

submaniac93: ↑

I actually just beat it with a Soarer 2.5 gt-t vvti '97 (bonus version) on JP. I tried PAL and it was impossible. Got a 1-2-2-2-3 on it. While I got a 1-2-1-1-2 on JP.
Click to expand...

So I may add a note, on successful runs/videos made on JP version?

Agreed for the Soarer, even if the engine is great (it's a missile @MegaSpeed Cup).
Another big boat (but with better grip) I'd love to see win the Normal event is the Fairlady Z. I once drove one in real life, it's an astounding car.

submaniac93 · Apr 11, 2020

I guess you could if you know write what version of the game was used in the links you write down. It's really mysterious why i have an easier time on JP... owo that's pretty nice, never drove a japanese sports before sadly :c
I'm sure the 300ZX can make it fairly well. I'll try it at some point

submaniac93 · Apr 12, 2020

Here's my Soarer run

Mouc · Apr 13, 2020

Wow! The Yellow Soarer! My favorite, and the fastest ('cause it's yellow )
Nice run! Sub 1.10' @GVES II. In my dreams I achieve that with such a car.
But:

- clearly the A.I. seems different from PAL. For example, at Clubman Stage Route 5 II, the NSX average lap time is around 54,5 sec, whatever happens. Or this one: in PAL, the NSX qualifying time is between 2:15 and 2:16 at SSR11, but it's more than 2:19 here in your run.
- how comes that the NSX is behind the Impreza, after the Qualifying Sessions? And the TRD 3000GT is at the back of the pack? You never see that thing in PAL!
- funny how the JP display seems (or is) slower & different compared to PAL. Took two screenshots from the same spot at GVES II, one in your vid', and in one of mine, seems the track is scaled down in JP. Camera point of view seems also a little bit lower in PAL

Added your run (thanks) to the summary, and an easy run (No NSX, lucky me ) with a red RX-7 Type RB. Great ride, almost as good as the Type RZ

submaniac93 · Apr 13, 2020

The only difference visually between GT1 JP and PAL is the hud's font, which is more square on JP. Don't forget you're using a different angle type for the camera (i think it's on "wide" on your end, which makes the FoV bigger, and things look further away at the center of the screen, as well as moves the car a bit forward. Kind of like a small fish eye effect)
I'm using the stock one, but JP lacks the close chase cam sadly.
It's a weird thing, the AI heh.
As for the quali positions, I think it's ... i mean, pure theory there, but I think JP makes them closer to how the real life cars did on comparison races like on Tsukuba in Best Motoring. The Impreza was very light and often out-accelerated NSXes but i don't know if my theory has any truth in it or not. One thing for sure, it's different in PAL haha.
JP's Megaspeed will have the GTO be 5th after quali rather than second, yeah...

submaniac93 · Apr 14, 2020

FDRX7 Touring X completed~
Similar to the Soarer. I did a 2-2-1-1-2 on PAL and had to go on JP to beat it.
I've added a controller input display in case @Mouc wants to see how i play in more details
(i hold my controller weirdly, like claws)

Mouc · Apr 14, 2020

Sorry for inconvenience, I completely forgot this 'View" option! So for the sake of documenting this point, some new screen captures which confirm your explanations.

The field of view is the same if you choose the "Normal" view in the Options Menu.

Still very good driving with the RX-7 Touring X! It's a lil' bit like the Camaro, right? Good handling, good engine, but shameful gearbox and too much weight...
All FD RX-7 are done
Maybe a try with an FC RX-7 on JP? Or the Holy Grail for rotary lovers: a winning run with a Cosmo 20B (on JP, without the NSX? )

Your way to handle the controller reminds me the RC cars, but with throttle at the right & steering at the left. I should try, I'm not so bad at RC cars (still have my JP ones from the eighties ).
This little "tremor" you do with the steering shift just before starting to turn (right or left), is that a way to avoid early sliding? Or to "average" the steering input, because it's not so precise, in GT1 ?

Added your run ( ), and a Lancer Evo IV one to the summary. Wallriding @CSR5 II and SSR11 obviously, the car is underpowered for me. But I think you'll manage to get a 1-1-2-1-2(or1) with the green one

submaniac93 · Apr 14, 2020

Heheee we'll see what i do next (no plans yet). Yeah the wiggle i do is to make small adjustments to my trajectory since the deadzones are pretty large. I do so may unconsciously that my left joystick's got a nearly 1mm groove in the stalk and the bottom part of the slot has a crease x)
Lancer Evo was my next thought, either III or IV, FC too. I didn't think of the Cosmo. So many left to try

Mouc · Apr 15, 2020

Okay, thanks
I'm also looking for 2 brand new original controllers, but it's getting hard to find...

Added a winning run with a FairLady Z TwinTurbo to the summary . But too much wallriding as usual, and no NSX in the field...

submaniac93 · Apr 15, 2020

Could find a few Dualshock 2 if you want, PS2 controllers are retro compatible (which is awesome)

Mouc · Apr 16, 2020

Well, how could I refuse? Let's discuss it elsewhere

Added some successful runs to the summary today:
- Impreza Wagon '95 (found on YT)
- Red Dodge Viper RT/10 (also found on YT)
- GTO'95 MR. First time ever for me with this car, for some reasons (first one: total cheater's car with 900+hp when tuned ) . But, I must admit it's a good car, despite its dinosaur weight. The engine is so torqueful, powerful and seconded by a 6-speed gearbox, that you don't really feel the mass, and finally it's fast!
I know a guy that will destroy the competition even on the 1992 model...

submaniac93 · Apr 16, 2020

Galant VR4 incoming~ (will edit post when the upload is completed)

EDIT: shiieeeeeeeeeeet my sound's messed up! Gotta redo it :C
EDIT2: Second run was much better. NSX gave me trouble, but i won all 5 races this time. I'll upload tomorrow~

EDIT3: Recorded GTO Twinturbo '92 and Fairlady Z 2seater Turbo vs NSX heh. An extremely close win. Attempted the FC RX7 Infini III but it's impossible on PAL. Same for the 1994 Impreza Sedan WRX. I'll try on JP later

Mouc · Apr 17, 2020

Cool
Many cars can win actually, it's weird that there's not more variety on Youtube... But now there is!

Waiting for your runs, a winning Subaru Impreza STi Type R (easy, this car is great)

submaniac93 · Apr 17, 2020

Galant is up~

Mouc · Apr 17, 2020

Hey!
Just watched the vid'... I'm flabbergasted.
Funny to see a Daddy's car walking on a NSX! (clean driving, furthermore). And you were lucky that the NSX was in "Turquoise" green... Perfect with your purple boat

So glad the NSX messed up its CSR5 II, but this same cornering-bastard hit you badly at Deepforest!

submaniac93 · Apr 18, 2020

Yeah, the NSX is a bit of a b*tch lol

GTO TwinT time~
One of the easiest wins i had, this one.

Now uploading the Fairlady Z run, which was extremely close! a 0.1s 1st place for the tie breaker haha

EDIT: Aaaand here's the Fairlady run~
It's weird. the car handles well enough, brakes well enough, accelerates well enough... but it's still slow.

Mouc · Apr 18, 2020

Well, let's say that the Nissan Z is a very good boat, but still, a boat (in GT1)
Also I didn't know that the GTO'92 had a 5-speeds gearbox only. Seems the later ones have a 6-speeds one.
Congratulations for both runs, added to the summary! This thing's growing fast... We'll soon arrive to the gearbox-nightmares: the Cosmo 20B and the Camaro

TumeK5 · Apr 18, 2020

You should really add Sough's run. His driving is godlike.

Mouc · Apr 18, 2020

Hi,
Already done Sough is one of these Great Men that pushed me here, after having seen his vids
It would be an honor that he joins us here to drive a "Nobody-thinks-about" Normal Car

A run with the original NSX. Harder to control than the NSX Type S Zero...

karelpipa · Apr 20, 2020

You say that with FC RX-7 its impossible to win against NSX?

Mouc · Apr 20, 2020

Would you say it's possible?

I'm so not to have thought of it before: the famous "MR" from Toyota. This crazy little thing called MR2 GT-S is totally able to take the TRD 3000GT, and I'm 99% sure it can beat the NSX (not me, 100% sure).

PS: I would have won at Deepforest if this jealous TRD 3000SoB wouldn't have slammed my beloved MR2 into the wall: 17:20

submaniac93 · Apr 21, 2020

FC might be doable on JP, but i couldn't even get first on ARmini on PAL which really doesn't bode well overall lol. MR2 i think should be possible. I'll have to try. for now, i have a surprise in the works heh

Mouc · Apr 21, 2020

We almost forgot "The Boat" from Subaru: the Legacy Touring Sedan RS (or the wagon, for the most vicious amongst us ). Pretty good boat, I beat without much difficulty the TRD 3000GT, and I guess it could take the NSX
It's a bit hard to get it started, but once it's done, nothing can stop it.

Mouc · Apr 22, 2020

Hi,

Gave a try tonight with the 222hp/1220kg '91 Pulsar (failed stupidly @GVES II & DeepForest II. 1 & 1.5 sec behind ).
I think it's impossible on PAL against the NSX, but doable with the TRD 3000GT-only Entry List. With a 1-1-1-1-3 or maybe 1-1-1-1-2. A bit like Sough's (winning) attempt with an Eclipse:

Mouc · Apr 26, 2020

Finally added to the summary a run with the Pulsar* (TRD 3000GT only). Surprisingly good "little" car, despite a weird steering. Not really understeering, but... I don't know. Not very precise I'd say.
Or maybe it's just me: as usual, I ****ed up Deepforest II and SSR11. And I almost got nailed at GVES II by the TRD 3000GT.
By the way I changed my estimation: an excellent driver could maybe manage a 1-1-2-1-2(or 3) against the NSX.

* with it's Japanese license plate?