Patch Release Notes and Discussion Thread

  • Thread starter DrJustice
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Could this be related to the temp rise people are having ? Track surface temp too high ?

I have just been having a go -
  • Brands Hatch,
  • McLaren 12c GT3,
  • GT3 - softs,
  • June 21, 13:00,
  • fixed weather (clear),
  • track temp: 39ºC (!!!)
So I was actually trying really hard to heat my tyres. I did 5 laps, but I had turned off ABS & TC and was spinning & locking my tyres at every turn / break point and drifting around quite a few turns as well as a number of spins and many slides.

My tyre temps only varied by 2-3ºc the entire time, there was wear but the temps stayed at 98-100ºC

So I've just had steam veriify the game cache and 3 files have failed to validate, so maybe it is an issue with my installation. If not then I think it might be bugged. Although with SMS' rigorous development methods I find that hard to believe :sly:
 
Wow, different result than others have reported :( So PC and PS4 might be different for 6.0 ?

Right after re-downloading 748kb (across three files apparently, I don't know if there is any steam log file where I can see which files they were?) I tried again, identical free practice session as before (the track temp even came up identical, 39ºC).

This time though I reduced the tyre pressures to the minimum (otherwise I was default setup with 30l of fuel both times)

I had the telemetery view up so I could watch the tyre temps constantly. This time I drove very, very hard, but with less crashing - I was really overdriving so it wasn't fast. Too many slides & locks.

After three laps I managed to get the inner shoulders of the left tyres lightish orange, by lap 5 I had managed to get the left front orange in the middle and dark orange on the inner shoulder, however this would cool down within a turn or two if I stopped over driving. On lap 6 I got distracted by the cat and hit the wall hard enough to lose my front left wheel 3 turns from the finish straight.

After that I tried to make it back to the pits with the throttle flat. The rear right was spinning constantly, so after maybe 50 metres I had got that tyre completely red. My engine blew just before the last turn.

I was going to try another car, but PCars didn't reset the wheel back to centre after I quite the session so it was locked hard at 90º - I quite the game to type this.

I'll try some other cars and circuits, but in this instance I felt if anything they didn't heat as fast as they would under those conditions: 39ºC track temp and top gear style abuse!


I'm going to make a cottage pie now. I'll try a different car/track later.
 
@Zakspeed_TV

Casey stated that no leaderboards wipe is happening after the tire model has changed.


No they don't. Ultimate performance potential hasn't changed, but it will take more skill to achieve on many cars.

also he stated:

It rewards smoothness of input no matter what your controller type. We had conditioned a lot of players to poor driving habits because the tires were too forgiving. Very sorry about that, but those bad habits must be unlearned now.
 
@Zakspeed_TV

Casey stated that no leaderboards wipe is happening after the tire model has changed.




also he stated:

No one will be doing the leaderboards then as they won't get near the times, I mean the long tail will be fooked round nords now :lol:

PA1834900.0036.jpg
 
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PC Patch 6.1 Release notes

Online - Implemented a work-around that should fix the issue where at times only two peer-to-peer lobbies would appear in the browser.
Online - Reworked the dynamic race-end timer feature. In public races, the timer is 75% of the slowest moving car's lap time. In private races, the timer is 150% of slowest moving car's lap time.
Other - UDP integration (Tim will post further details in his dedicated thread covering this topic)

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?42188-Project-CARS-PC-Patch-6-1-Release-Notes
 
PC Patch 6.1 Release notes

Online - Implemented a work-around that should fix the issue where at times only two peer-to-peer lobbies would appear in the browser.
Online - Reworked the dynamic race-end timer feature. In public races, the timer is 75% of the slowest moving car's lap time. In private races, the timer is 150% of slowest moving car's lap time.
Other - UDP integration (Tim will post further details in his dedicated thread covering this topic)

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?42188-Project-CARS-PC-Patch-6-1-Release-Notes
UDP integration, yay!
 
PC patch ONLY no 6.1 for concules

Tom Curtis
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Originally Posted by chig88
Hate to be the one to ask, but is this coming to consoles as well?
We can't hotfix on consoles due to Certification. But this and the UDP changes will make it into the 7.0 console patch.
 
Right after re-downloading 748kb (across three files apparently, I don't know if there is any steam log file where I can see which files they were?) I tried again, identical free practice session as before (the track temp even came up identical, 39ºC).

This time though I reduced the tyre pressures to the minimum (otherwise I was default setup with 30l of fuel both times)

I had the telemetery view up so I could watch the tyre temps constantly. This time I drove very, very hard, but with less crashing - I was really overdriving so it wasn't fast. Too many slides & locks.

After three laps I managed to get the inner shoulders of the left tyres lightish orange, by lap 5 I had managed to get the left front orange in the middle and dark orange on the inner shoulder, however this would cool down within a turn or two if I stopped over driving. On lap 6 I got distracted by the cat and hit the wall hard enough to lose my front left wheel 3 turns from the finish straight.

After that I tried to make it back to the pits with the throttle flat. The rear right was spinning constantly, so after maybe 50 metres I had got that tyre completely red. My engine blew just before the last turn.

I was going to try another car, but PCars didn't reset the wheel back to centre after I quite the session so it was locked hard at 90º - I quite the game to type this.

I'll try some other cars and circuits, but in this instance I felt if anything they didn't heat as fast as they would under those conditions: 39ºC track temp and top gear style abuse!


I'm going to make a cottage pie now. I'll try a different car/track later.

Sent you an invite to a convo :) Hope you can try this one.
 
PC patch ONLY no 6.1 for concules

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Originally Posted by chig88
Hate to be the one to ask, but is this coming to consoles as well?
We can't hotfix on consoles due to Certification. But this and the UDP changes will make it into the 7.0 console patch.
Then roll on DLC!
 
You need to try, just to prove yourself wrong! Come on, man, smash a record with the new tires, it can be your new life's goal :lol: We all know you can do it :gtpflag:

:lol: will give one a try at some point but there's no chance. On the rocket bunny challenge someone beat my time on sunday :lol: so i updated monday and got on it but after the first sector he pulls away now as the tyres are getting much hotter. We had a good battle before the update, now there's no point!
 
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:lol: will give one a try at some point but there's no chance. On the rocket bunny challenge someone beat my time on sunday :lol: so i updated monday and got on it but after the first sector he pulls away now as the tyres are getting much hotter. We had a good battle be for the update, now there's no point!
I don't quite get why they're not resetting the leaderboards again, perhaps for one final time. They should level it.
 
I'm not sure but they still have "camber fix" coming and that could change things up again
Forgot about that one. Well if they see that no one is beating the times currently put down I'd hope they'd agree to reset them again in the future.
 
Ok so I just did my first test with 6.0, specifically trying to find out about this tyre heating problem people are having.

I first had a bit of a blast around mojave with the Lotus 49, as I'd read somewhere that the changes to tyres have made the old tyres far more realistic. If you haven't tried the 49 yet, give it a go, it's bloody glorious. It doesn't snap hard like it did before, it is far more progressive with the slip angles, and feels much more how you'd expect it to. Great fun! Also, no problems with temps at all, the operating window on this car is enormous, and I was drifting massive circles on the skid pan without overheating them. This is to be expected, as those old tyres were designed like that, so all good there.

Anyway, I then got a little more serious. I've noticed something of a trend, both here and at the official forum, where the people most vocal about tyres overheating are saying they've been driving GT3 cars, so I jumped in the Mclaren 12c GT3, and went straight to Catalunya, as it's hell on tyres in real racing there, with all the long medium and high speed right handers, the heavy loads on the left tyres will easily overheat them if you're not careful.

Right, so I went out, and did a normal outlap. I don't usually push on an outlap, as it's pointless, but I don't dawdle around either. I noticed nothing out of the ordinary. I then put in 5 laps paying attention not to scrub the fronts on those long corners (It's tempting to wind a bit more lock on I know), and avoiding wheelspin, and I noticed the temps rose on the first timed lap up to around 104 degrees C, but then stayed around there pretty consistently.

When I was exiting turns three and four, I noticed the temps had risen a few degrees, but would come back down pretty quickly and stabilise. During this period, I felt the temps were far more "alive" than before, where loading up the tyres, even a bit, would result in small temporary fluctuations.

Then I went for a rough lap. Throwing the car into corners, and really pushing on the front in the sweepers, and within one lap left tyre temps were up to 125 degrees, and the tyres were dark orange. I also noticed with this dramatic temp increase, the back end was very lively mid corner on the final corner.

So the next lap I went back to protecting the tyres, and without going too slow I had dropped the temp by 10 degrees on the lefts in one lap. So I pushed for time on the next lap, not being purposely rough like before, but just trying to be fast, but smooth, and not worrying about loading up the lefts through the sweepers. The temps rose 10 degrees again, but the lap was faster than before.

The next two laps I tried to nurse the tyres to reduce temps, but while giving away as little lap time as possible. This was tricky, as I had to really be mindful of sustaining a high peak load on the lefts through all those hard long right handers, but without bleeding lap time. I managed to drop the temps by 10 degrees each lap, so in two laps they were back in the perfect 105 degree zone, but I had only gone 8 tenths slower on the first lap, and 9 tenths slower on the second lap.

So this had me keen to see if I could use the tyres in the right parts of the track, and nurse them in the right parts, and get as good a lap as I could without raising temps. I did a run of four laps, all quite quick, and each one was faster than the last, all of them faster than the lap where I pushed hard, due to not overheating the tyres by the last sector I guess, and in those four laps, my temps had only risen by ten degrees, from 105 to 115.

I'll test other cars, but so far I'm really liking how alive the tyres feel now. Before I could be lazy and just lean hard on the tyres lap after lap and the temps would hardly change at all. Now the temps are fluctuating constantly with every turn. They feel way more realistic to me this way. Maybe I'll find some cars or tracks where the effect may seem too strong/not strong enough, I don't know, and if I do I'll share it with you all, but so far I'm happy with what I'm seeing.

I will say though, that the one thing that concerns me, is the AI's physics don't contain temperatures, so while this tyre management is way more realistic, it might mean those of us playing career might have to drop the difficulty a bit. Although that's probably a good thing, as some races were ridiculously easy even at 100%, so maybe the career will be more challenging now. Anyway I'm ranting lol.
Nice test, a few things though.

All along we have been told maximum temperature should be 100C for optimal grip. You were at 105 to 115 on your 4 lap test of quick but not pushing. What were your lap times for those laps? At RA my tires were 98 to 112 when not pushing, and I was doing mid 2:05's or roughly 1 second off max pace with that fuel load. In both of our scenarios the tires are overheating. My point is you have to be way way off pace just to keep them under 100C, especially at high deg tracks. Yes the temp is more dynamic now, but don't you agree it's too sensitive to load? The tires jumped 22F through the carousel at RA while coasting 3/4ths of the turn.
 
Told you, who ever thinks this is faster or realistic is trippin :lol:

Its over kill, some track are way worse then others Brands way worse then Nords makes no
sense :lol:

That might be explained by Nordschleife having plenty of long straightish sections for the tyres to cool down.

Zak I know you sometimes like to have a very fast (max) steering ratio which duplicates the speed of steering with which DS4 users often turn. Could it be that you're being punished for using that as it is now potentially more damaging to tyres for overturning the wheel? Some controller users are having the same issue. Like with a controller any slight error in wheel angle is magnified and now being punished. Maybe using a ratio over to the centre/right of the scale would be worth testing? Maybe the old tyre model was rewarding with the extra speed but wasn't punishing enough.

You can see how tyres heat up suddenly in one or two corners in F1 races. Soft tyres used in qualifying will regularly only be any good for 1 lap right at the ragged edge. Those tyres cannot be driven at the same ragged edge in the race for 10 laps especially with higher fuel loads than qualifying/time trial laps.

Just doing a 25 lap race on lap 16 in the 1-series most of my right tyres have gone but i just set my fastest lap, how real is that?

EDIT lap 20 .500 faster nearly all gone in the right :lol:

If tyres have been well managed then races fastest laps can happen later in the race as fuel burns off. I've found that in the old tyre model and the new. Similarly some fastest laps in Grand Prix happen near the end when fuel is at it's lowest even on older rubber. Vettel in a championship winning Red Bull used to love slamming in the fastest lap of a race right near the end once the race was sewn up.

.

No they shouldn't but they still heat to fast, have you tested different tracks? can anyone tell me why a few laps at Sakitto GP heat 3 times as much as 2 laps at Nords?

Sakitto/Suzuka has a lot of long corners. Maybe the tyres are under a high lateral load for a longer proportion of the lap compared to the Nordschleife? Nords has many fairly short corners where the tyres aren't under so much lateral load for as long compared to the rest of the lap?
 
Zak I know you sometimes like to have a very fast (max) steering ratio which duplicates the speed of steering with which DS4 users often turn. Could it be that you're being punished for using that as it is now potentially more damaging to tyres for overturning the wheel?

@JohnScoonsBeard that's exactly what I was thinking earlier. His setups are very fast but I personally can't get on with them 100% as is, you might be onto something there.

On a side note, I wish we had the option to force pit stops in QRW. They added it to MP so why not everything?
 
That might be explained by Nordschleife having plenty of long straightish sections for the tyres to cool down.

Zak I know you sometimes like to have a very fast (max) steering ratio which duplicates the speed of steering with which DS4 users often turn. Could it be that you're being punished for using that as it is now potentially more damaging to tyres for overturning the wheel? Some controller users are having the same issue. Like with a controller any slight error in wheel angle is magnified and now being punished. Maybe using a ratio over to the centre/right of the scale would be worth testing? Maybe the old tyre model was rewarding with the extra speed but wasn't punishing enough.

You can see how tyres heat up suddenly in one or two corners in F1 races. Soft tyres used in qualifying will regularly only be any good for 1 lap right at the ragged edge. Those tyres cannot be driven at the same ragged edge in the race for 10 laps especially with higher fuel loads than qualifying/time trial laps.

No i still run smooth with a fast lock , kie, oz and others are saying the same and they don't run a fast lock.
GT3 are endurance cars and don't heat like F1 cars


If tyres have been well managed then races fastest laps can happen later in the race as fuel burns off. I've found that in the old tyre model and the new. Similarly some fastest laps in Grand Prix happen near the end when fuel is at it's lowest even on older rubber. Vettel in a championship winning Red Bull used to love slamming in the fastest lap of a race right near the end once the race was sewn up.

The fastest laps came with nothing on the right 1.15.8 i think, when tuning with low fuel and fresh tyres i was around that time. I don't think road cars are affected like GT3 as i tested the Caterham today and was fine.

Nords should kill tyres, lots of fast long coners


Sakitto/Suzuka has a lot of long corners. Maybe the tyres are under a high lateral load for a longer proportion of the lap compared to the Nordschleife? Nords has many fairly short corners where the tyres aren't under so much lateral load for as long compared to the rest of the lap?
 
Nice test, a few things though.

All along we have been told maximum temperature should be 100C for optimal grip. You were at 105 to 115 on your 4 lap test of quick but not pushing. What were your lap times for those laps? At RA my tires were 98 to 112 when not pushing, and I was doing mid 2:05's or roughly 1 second off max pace with that fuel load. In both of our scenarios the tires are overheating. My point is you have to be way way off pace just to keep them under 100C, especially at high deg tracks. Yes the temp is more dynamic now, but don't you agree it's too sensitive to load? The tires jumped 22F through the carousel at RA while coasting 3/4ths of the turn.

I can't remember the times now sorry, but the tyres are nowhere near out of their range at 105. It takes until around 115 before the green colour starts to get some yellow in it, but even then the grip still feels good. Maybe another 5 degrees above that you feel the tyres letting go earlier. You say looking after the tyres was a second per lap slower than leaning on them, that's pretty much the same as I found. My laps that were 8 tenths to 1 second slower than when I really leaned on the tyres trying to get a fast time, and during those laps I was able to cool the tyres by 10 degrees.

To keep temps stable, you could put in quite quick laps as far as I can tell, but you have to really be careful where to lean on the tyres.

If you're not scrubbing the fronts or wagging the tail, your biggest contribution to increased tyre temp will be sustained peak loads. Taking long sweepers right on the edge of grip will do that, so you just have to carefully choose where to lean on the tyres and where to give them a little room to breathe so to speak.

I'll try more tracks though, as I'm seeing a few people talking about unusual track temps, and it's making me think perhaps some tracks temps are bugged, and that's what's playing havoc with the tyre temps. Sounds plausible to me, especially after having no trouble at the two tracks I tested.

Btw, I like your username mate, I desperately want a set of Oz rally wheels for the Group A :D
 
I'll try more tracks though, as I'm seeing a few people talking about unusual track temps, and it's making me think perhaps some tracks temps are bugged, and that's what's playing havoc with the tyre temps. Sounds plausible to me, especially after having no trouble at the two tracks I tested.

That was me noticing the track temps, but my experience of really trying to get the tyres hot, by sliding, locking & drifiting around Brands for 5-6 laps didn't produce anything I felt to be out of order as I posted here
 
I ran a 10 lap race round Dubai International, first with Mediums and then again with Softs, and was only about 1 sec down with the Meds, so if all else fails, I'll be putting Meds on all my cars to compensate. I can handle that.
 
I ran a 10 lap race round Dubai International, first with Mediums and then again with Softs, and was only about 1 sec down with the Meds, so if all else fails, I'll be putting Meds on all my cars to compensate. I can handle that.

So did your mediums not heat as fast as softs? had a few people say they heat up just as quick.
 
I can't remember the times now sorry, but the tyres are nowhere near out of their range at 105. It takes until around 115 before the green colour starts to get some yellow in it, but even then the grip still feels good. Maybe another 5 degrees above that you feel the tyres letting go earlier. You say looking after the tyres was a second per lap slower than leaning on them, that's pretty much the same as I found. My laps that were 8 tenths to 1 second slower than when I really leaned on the tyres trying to get a fast time, and during those laps I was able to cool the tyres by 10 degrees.

To keep temps stable, you could put in quite quick laps as far as I can tell, but you have to really be careful where to lean on the tyres.

If you're not scrubbing the fronts or wagging the tail, your biggest contribution to increased tyre temp will be sustained peak loads. Taking long sweepers right on the edge of grip will do that, so you just have to carefully choose where to lean on the tyres and where to give them a little room to breathe so to speak.

I'll try more tracks though, as I'm seeing a few people talking about unusual track temps, and it's making me think perhaps some tracks temps are bugged, and that's what's playing havoc with the tyre temps. Sounds plausible to me, especially after having no trouble at the two tracks I tested.

Btw, I like your username mate, I desperately want a set of Oz rally wheels for the Group A :D
Definitely need more testing.

Oh and I hope you have a lot of $$$. :)
 
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