- 3,664
- Bristol
- priesty_lfc
Isn't it McLaren who make the electronics?
Either way, good to see them struggle!
Either way, good to see them struggle!
Red Bull RB10 launch
- Thread starter Roo
- 162 comments
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- 2,938
- Shrewsbury
- pezzarinho17
Just the ECU.
- 8,835
- Northamptonshire
- AlexGibbo27
Ted kravtiz: Adrian Newey and C Horner flying from Jerez to Milton Keynes now, AN to work on probs. RIC staying, mechs trying to put a fix in for tomorrow.
RBR could be in serious trouble, their powertrain packaging could need a redesign.
RBR could be in serious trouble, their powertrain packaging could need a redesign.
- 2,938
- Shrewsbury
- pezzarinho17
Was thinking about this, remember when KERS returned to F1? Newey makes his design and then has the engineers fit components in the space he doesn't need. I wonder if that is the case here, with Newey not wanting to compromise his air flows for cooling / packaging space.
The other thing is that in that year they could race without KERS and win. Now the power output is doubled and for longer, it definitely is not an option in 2014.
The other thing is that in that year they could race without KERS and win. Now the power output is doubled and for longer, it definitely is not an option in 2014.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
It is believed that the problem is not the electronics themselves, but the way Red Bull have arranged them within the car itself, and as a result of this, things are overheating to the point where they are burning. And the problem is exacerbated by the Renault engine - I have heard that it is almost guaranteed to overheat if it is pushed above 75% of its output, and that Renault need at least twenty weeks to produce a workable solution.
I could not agree more. I can barely contain my glee at the thought of them having to sit and watch everyone else win because they were too clever for their own good. Whatever the problems with the Renault engine, it has been known that engine cooling was going to be one of the key issues for teams to get on top of. For Red Bull to have over-emphasised the tight packaging of the car to the point where they have left the electrical systems vulnerable to burning is an amateur mistake.
Tired Tyres
Premium
- 12,879
- West Yorkshire
- Tired_Tyres
- Tired Tyres
Top arrows are onboard camera housings.
HKS racer
(Banned)
- 4,802
Regulation is forcing other teams to place them on "lower arrows".
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- Arizona
- HamiltonMP427
No they aren't mandated, all the regs say is that it is one of the multiple places to put them, but you don't have to. And if you do decide to they have to be on that area of the nose. Both positions are options for the placement of the camera housing. RBR decided not to put them on the nose so yeah.
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HKS racer
(Banned)
- 4,802
Ok now it make sense.
- 1,516
- Florida
- MARCUSH17
- MARCUSH16
Finally! A confirmation from Red Bull themselves with regard to the problems at Jerez.
http://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/mo...drian-Newey-admits-We-got-it-wrong-at-testing
http://www.dailystar.co.uk/sport/mo...drian-Newey-admits-We-got-it-wrong-at-testing
- 9,884
- Carthage, TN
- race_emhard
That's why they call it "pre-season testing". 
- 20,685
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
Didn't know whether to start a new thread or not... so tacked onto this one.
After a couple of hours in Bahrain only the Caterhams have done a couple of laps with the Renault engine.
Andrew Benson, the BBC's F1 writer, points to an interview with Adrian Newey this week where he said "It was, you could argue, a result of aggressive packaging but we felt that we needed to take a few risks to try to get a good package that would minimise the aerodynamic damage of this very large cooling requirement. "The Renault seems to have a particularly large cooling requirement. Everybody of the three engine manufacturers will have a different target for how hot their charge air is going back into the plenum and Renault have given us a fairly challenging target. It has all sorts of advantages if we can get there, but it is not easy to achieve.".
Benson goes on to point out that the Ferrari intakes are much smaller suggesting that they are hitting their air-cooling targets already.
The traditional tightness of Newey's bodywork coupled with an engine that's struggling to stay at operating temperature could be what actually opens the 2014 season up!
EDIT: The sneaky Renaults snuck out while I was writing, and didn't explode. Still no Infiniti Red Bull yet...
After a couple of hours in Bahrain only the Caterhams have done a couple of laps with the Renault engine.
Andrew Benson, the BBC's F1 writer, points to an interview with Adrian Newey this week where he said "It was, you could argue, a result of aggressive packaging but we felt that we needed to take a few risks to try to get a good package that would minimise the aerodynamic damage of this very large cooling requirement. "The Renault seems to have a particularly large cooling requirement. Everybody of the three engine manufacturers will have a different target for how hot their charge air is going back into the plenum and Renault have given us a fairly challenging target. It has all sorts of advantages if we can get there, but it is not easy to achieve.".
Benson goes on to point out that the Ferrari intakes are much smaller suggesting that they are hitting their air-cooling targets already.
The traditional tightness of Newey's bodywork coupled with an engine that's struggling to stay at operating temperature could be what actually opens the 2014 season up!
EDIT: The sneaky Renaults snuck out while I was writing, and didn't explode. Still no Infiniti Red Bull yet...
- 2,938
- Shrewsbury
- pezzarinho17
Not quite true, check my previous clipping from the FIA regulations themselves.
Red Bull RB10 launch
The last point states that they must be located on top of the engine cover, either side of the engine cover and the nose. If they choose not to have a camera then the housing must be there in its place.
Because this is pre-season testing, the teams can choose not to run with them in place. Possibly because Red Bull have a trick up their sleeve in how they will mount them. I expect they are using the Mercedes approach and form them into wing like shapes protruding out and up.
EDIT: And after just 13 laps, the RB10 is back on the low loader...
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- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
It's very entertaining to see them struggle. Their dominance - and the personalities involved - have really killed my enthusiasm in recent months. It will be interesting to see how Vettel handles it, because I have always felt that a bad car demands good leadership. Hamilton did it in 2009, and Alonso did it in 2012. But so far, I think Vettel has not handled it well. He's gone down the diplomatic route of "yeah, it's frustrating, but we're doing all we can" when he should be trying to motivate the team. And he has done nothing about the divisions in the team management; Helmut Marko likened the work needed for Bahrain to "major surgery", while Christian Horner said it was "nothing serious" and that he expected the issues to sort themselves out when Renault fixed the engine drama. When you have the two most senior teams members saying two completely different things like that, it does not look good for the team.
And it's hilarious to hear our media talk up Ricciardo joining Red Bull, knowing that they are struggling.
And it's hilarious to hear our media talk up Ricciardo joining Red Bull, knowing that they are struggling.
- 9,059
- Murica
- BasedAckbar
Nice to see a Red Bull with no wings.
- 9,059
- Murica
- BasedAckbar
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
If they manage to win the first race, it will be an absolute miracle. They can barely do five laps without stopping. They will, of course, get better, but there are just twenty-three days to Melbourne. Which is more like eighteen when you consider the way everyone arrives a week early to compensate for the time difference and the boatload of sponsor functions they will all do ahead of the first race.
Right now, I'd say Caterham are in a better position to win than Red Bull are.
Right now, I'd say Caterham are in a better position to win than Red Bull are.
- 9,059
- Murica
- BasedAckbar
Just mentioning Caterham makes me want to vomit. So ugly.
- 22,551
- Arizona
- HamiltonMP427
That was the picture I have saved and followed, I misread that they must be in two and only thought position five was the the must. I have the FIA regs saved don't worry.
Either way it doesn't matter, I so far predicted correctly that the new packaging would be a struggle for RBR and this was last year. Any little trick with camera housings wont fix their woes of packaging.
Do hold on with that if you could, you're talking about the same guy who actually assists his team in everyway including moving after the race rather than leaving to the hotel afterwards, and dives into the information side to how parts for the car are made. He's in the development process as much as he's a driver.
[not directed to you] It's slightly angering to see people say that he's this ignorant god send of child that doesn't have talent but the car and the people make him. I hate to tell you this, but he smashed records before he got into F1.
Red Bull completed 49 laps today in Bahrain, with bugs, but 49 laps. Renault always seem to have to struggle during a new phase of regulations.
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- Hammerhead Garage
Vettel has never been in this position before. He has never had to rally the team to come from behind and develop a difficult car. He needs to motivate and inspire, become the heart of the team. It's what Hamilton did in 2009.
I'm not denying that Vettel has talent - I am just arguing that he lacks certain key skills that set other champions apart, and until such time has he shows them, he will never be truly accepted as a legend of the sport. Anyone who wins multiple championships is universally accepted as a legend. Vettel has four, and yet fans boo him on the podium and eagerly await the day he is powerless to stop his own defeat. When was the last time that happened to a driver, much less a multiple World Champion?
- 23
- TheRedOctober__
I couldn't care less for Vettel, however I do feel for Ricciardo if Red Bull do end up struggling quite badly when the season starts. I really want to see him succeed and hopefully get a few over ze German.
Oh, we'll get that this year. That's for sure.
Unfortunately, as far as stats go. He's an absolute legend. But the universally accepted legend won't be applied till after he's done with the sport. Schumacher received the same if not more negative, besides the tifosi, in the 6 years are pure domination of the sport.
