PS4 Wheel Advice - Choosing between T300 and G29 - including a Poll

Discussion in 'Project CARS 1' started by Lanius1984, Jun 12, 2015.

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Which Wheel would you choose?

  1. Thrustmaster T300RS

    202 vote(s)
    69.9%
  2. Logitech G29

    87 vote(s)
    30.1%
  1. LeMansAid

    LeMansAid

    Messages:
    2,800
    The T300 is streets ahead of both the low end Fanatec wheels and the Logitech wheels. The Fanatecs will be sluggish and dead in comparison, and the Logitechs clunky. The G27 was always a great contender, but things have moved on. At anywhere near the retail price, the G29 is a non-starter. Fanatec pedals (Elite and up) have always been a cracking deal though.

    The Fanatecs are certainly a consideration for a low end wheel, but are nothing that will compare to a T300.
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2015
    G219 likes this.
  2. Mike_grpA

    Mike_grpA

    Messages:
    2,810
    Location:
    Australia
    From everything I've read, the CSR is closer to the T300 than it is to the G27. Everyone who has owned both CSR and T300 seem to think the 300 has a bit stronger FFB, and obviously with the brushless motor, it would be a bit more responsive too, but you're paying twice as much for a wheel that there's no way it's twice as good. I know you get pedals with the T300, but they're rubbish, so you may as well chuck them in the bin. Also read the T3pa are about on par or worse than G25 pedals, so If I was to buy a $500 T300, I'd also have to shell out $250 for T3pa Pros, which still aren't quite as good as CSPs, though should be better than CSR Elites.

    The CSR wheel base won't be as good as a T300 base. But it's much closer to it than the G29, and it's half the price of either. If you want bang for your buck, I don't reckon it gets any better currently. Of course, if money's no object, you could go for a T300 + T3PA Pro + TH8A. But, if money was no object, you could just go for a CSW V2 and have the best console wheel money can buy.

    Edit: Just found that the Ricmotech load cell mod for the T3PA Pro is another $200, which would take my total to $950 without a shifter! ( + Another $200+ for a TH8A). I could get a CSR + CSR Elite pedals + a Clubsport shifter for $620 brand new.

    ..But my problem is that if I had that cash on me, I would just spend it on my car. I can't justify spending a grand on a wheel so that I can pretend to drive slightly better. I'd prefer to spend that grand on new polyurethane bushes for my car lol.
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2015
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  3. LeMansAid

    LeMansAid

    Messages:
    2,800
    The CSR has a light and very plastic rim compared to the Porsche wheels, which allows it to not be quite so bogged down by the mechanical damping. But......... it has a light and very plastic rim. Before we get to CSW V2 level, the T300 is the only no compromise option. The others all have their pros and cons, but the T300 is good across the board.

    For those with a specific want (eg. lifelike Porsche rim, belt drive, or G25/27/29's low mechanical damping), it's great, because they can fulfill that want and not pay a premium. For an even performer, it starts with the T300 though.
     
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  4. Mike_grpA

    Mike_grpA

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    2,810
    Location:
    Australia
    The T300 doesn't have a premium rim standard either though. You'll either have to leather wrap it, which you could do with the CSR, or you have to shell out another couple hundred for the TM28. I do believe the T300 is the better wheel, but I still think it's overpriced, and that's why I think Fanatec gives the best bang for buck. I also think the G29 is overpriced too though. Way too overpriced.
     
  5. VBR

    VBR Premium

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    7,401
    Location:
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    Carbon fiber vinyl can look very good if done properly.

    [​IMG]

    Source.
     
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  6. mister dog

    mister dog (Banned)

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    The plastic rim doesn't bother me that much, you mostly have your hands around the alcantara grips.
     
  7. bleeder

    bleeder

    Messages:
    3,092
    Location:
    England
    TM released a leather rim for the T300 a few weeks ago, but another expense nonetheless.

    http://www.thrustmaster.com/products/tm-leather-28-gt-wheel-add-0
     
  8. fatkrakr

    fatkrakr

    Messages:
    2,801
    The T3pa pro pedals are on par with the Logitech pedals and the CSR elites are a lot better pedal set then either of those pedal sets.
     
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  9. TJC_69

    TJC_69

    Messages:
    1,510
    Location:
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    That's not fully correct . You can see from posts on this thread on previous pages and throughout this forum that many people state they are happy with their 300 and that it hasn't broken . I've read and taken on board both sides from both wheels from both sets of owners . You also assume i'm only focusing on the opinions on GTP , which is not the case , as I alluded to earlier that the wider the scope of your information sourced , the more accurate it becomes .

    My initial conclusions point to the Logitech being the choice wheel , notwithstanding the fact that that T300 has a better feel . The multiple cases of product recalls alongwith the pedals it comes with are the two main sticking points for me . The G29 ( Even though it contains G27 technology ) cannot be accurately measured for product longevity yet as it has had a couple of improvements made to it that have no data on any fail rate as of yet . Again , it must be treated as a new product , as these new components could still prove unreliable . Hence i'm still data gathering at this point .

    @bleeder 140 quid for a T300 leather wheel grip :eek: Ouch...
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2015
  10. killerjimbag

    killerjimbag

    Messages:
    3,881
    Location:
    Canada
    Ok, so go buy a wheel already.
     
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  11. Mike_grpA

    Mike_grpA

    Messages:
    2,810
    Location:
    Australia
    Yeah I saw that one, it looks really good, and I've got experience with vinyl wraps, having worked as a sign writer 5 years ago. I'm more leaning towards leather wrapping it for the feel. Carbon vinyl looks great, but won't really feel any better than the stock gloss plastic.
    Yeah, you must have missed it, but in my post you quoted I actually said "...or you have to shell out another couple hundred for a TM28". TM28 is the name of their leather wheel. It's not really hard to wrap a wheel rim in leather though, so I wouldn't bother paying so much for one of those when the leather to wrap a T300 GTE rim (exactly the same as the TM28, minus leather, plus ferrari badge) would cost $10, maybe less.

    Ok I stand corrected. I'm assuming you've used them all. I've used Logi pedals, and those were almost all plastic, and didn't feel too good. The T3PA Pros are all metal, which I would have assumed would be much better. I haven't used CSR Elites, But they're mostly metal. I guess the fact they are so adjustable and have a load cell brake stock would probably place them higher than the T3PA Pros. I have used the CSP V1s, and they're on a different planet to Logi pedals. Great adjustability, and highest quality construction. Also best brake out of the lot.
     
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  12. IceWarden

    IceWarden

    Messages:
    3,637
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    Ok, so to sum up the quality chain and to get a feel for where my planned $400 should be spent...after the PS3 and DFGT is sold etc...

    My choices appear to be these current setups:

    G29 $400
    T300RS $400
    Fanatec (CSR $200 + CSR Elite Pedals $149) $350

    This does not take into effect the possible new Fanatec wheel coming which may be better than the T300RS in FFB.


    Best to worst setup in wheel FFB:
    T300RS
    Fanatec CSR Forza or Porsche wheels
    G29

    Best to worst in supplied pedals:
    Fanatec CSR Elite
    G29
    T300RS

    So as a complete setup it looks like the Fanatec is the best choice within the confines of my budget? And if I wait, the rumored CSR replacement should be even better...even if it's $50 more it would still be the best value.

    Does this sound about right? I know you can mix and match wheels/pedals but that would require upwards of $550 which is not possible for me.
     
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  13. mister dog

    mister dog (Banned)

    Messages:
    8,396
    Location:
    Belgium
    It does, the T300 might be a tad better FFB wise, but compared to better pedals and build quality of the wheel I think the CSR set wins.
     
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  14. Spooky Wooky

    Spooky Wooky (Banned)

    Messages:
    1,654
    Location:
    England
    What product recall? Should I have sent my t300 back?
     
  15. Mike_grpA

    Mike_grpA

    Messages:
    2,810
    Location:
    Australia
    After months of reading reviews, watching videos of the wheels in action, reading about people pulling them apart (to find out how well they are built in the inside), and weighing up the costs and upgradability options, I came to the same conclusion as you. Sounds right to me mate. Before you buy the CSR Elite pedals, as good as they may be, try to find a used set of CSP V1s, as they are really top quality items, and I found one for sale in Australia for $150aud, but the ones I'm getting will only cost me $100. You may get lucky and find a set close to you for a comparable price to CSR Elites.
     
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  16. LeMansAid

    LeMansAid

    Messages:
    2,800
    You've got the right idea with you summary in general. The one thing I'd scrutinise is the bolded part here. It's a very subjective aspect. The biggest differential is belt drive vs gear drive. Belt drive will be smoother, but gear drive allows the G29 to be very "fleet of wheel", if you will. It means that minor ffb signals will have more clarity because they're not needing to overcome the mechanical damping that is inherent with the Fanatec wheels. The other thing that comes in to play is motor fade. Fanatec ffb will fade quicker due to having a weak motor, coupled with high mechanical damping. The G29 has weak motors, but they won't overheat quite as quickly. When I say overheat, I really mean it too. The temperatures inside these motor cans are extreme, and it's a very slow process to have the heat dissipate. These lower level Fanatec wheels fade as quickly as after only 15 minutes of use.

    That's the other aspect that the T300 has on it's side - a bigger motor, but also a brushless motor. Both of those things add to it succumbing far less quickly to heat. I have a couple of Fanatec Porsche wheels, a DFGT, and an ECCI 7000. Sometimes after two hours of use the ECCI's motor will be the coldest thing in the room, to the touch. After twenty minutes of use the motors on the others are well and truly at "boiling" point, and are very hot to the touch. The outside of the can being very much a fraction of what's inside.

    With all of that said, I recommend the Fanatec option (certainly over a G29), if you can't stretch to a T300 + CSR Elites + adapter - then, it's a matter of whether or not you wait for the announcement or release of a new wheel. That's probably where you were anyway, but it's good to go in with as much knowledge as possible, to hopefully avoid "if only...." later.
     
  17. TJC_69

    TJC_69

    Messages:
    1,510
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I mispoke there I think . What I meant by that is the multiple cases i've heard of with the T300 having multiple breakdown issues for some users , which resulted in sending their wheels back to be fixed several times . Not an official company issued recall no .
     
  18. skazz

    skazz

    Messages:
    2,431
    Personally I rate my Fanatec Porsche GT2 wheel behind my G25. Yes, it's smoother, but it's also VERY much more damped, and feels sluggish in comparison. FFB Spin speed is almost identical between the two (both clearly slower than the T300).

    I found that I preferred the compromise of cog rattle to sluggishness. I also didn't like the high hand position of the Porsche wheel, it's more like 10 and 2 o'clock than 9 and 3. And then I got the T300 which offers the agility and easy spinning nature of the G25 with close to the smoothness of the Fanatec. And decent hand position. Since I have no issue with the rubber grips, it was an easy win for the T300, at least once I put some better pedals with it.
     
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  19. Mike_grpA

    Mike_grpA

    Messages:
    2,810
    Location:
    Australia
    The GT2 isn't the same as the CSR. The CSR is based on the GT2, but with a lighter wheel, proper paddles and different electronics. It's hard to find info on exactly how they differ on the inside, but every comparison I've read of the two say that the GT2 feels sluggish and damped compared to the CSR. The CSR's ergo grips are also at 9 and 3, so that's where you'd be gripping that rim.

    The T300 is a much newer rim, with a much better motor, so it will have better ffb. It is however also twice the price
     
  20. skazz

    skazz

    Messages:
    2,431
    I know the CSR rim is considerably lighter (and mostly plastic, rather than alcantara) but I still find it hard to believe that this is enough to bring the CSR into G25 levels of agility. It uses the same motor/belts/construction as the Porsche wheels, except for the lighter rim, after all.

    Still, I've never had the opportunity to use a CSR wheel, so I reserve judgement.
     
  21. Mike_grpA

    Mike_grpA

    Messages:
    2,810
    Location:
    Australia
    According to Darin Gangi the electronics were changed from the Porsche wheels, though he didn't elaborate on that, so I don't know how much was changed. From all reviews I've read, the CSR is much more agile than the Porsche wheels.

    In the ISR review, Shaun Cole comments that the wheel is "as fast turning as the G27, smoother than the G27, and faster turning than all previous 911 wheels". He also comments that it has great ffb, with light touch effects and strong feedback. I've read a bunch of other reviews, there are some good ones on the ISR forum, and they all say the same things. It seems the weight of the Porsche wheel rims in the GT2/3RS were what was dampening the wheel speed and ffb.

    Here's that ISR review again:
     
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  22. TDZdave

    TDZdave

    Messages:
    8,166
    Location:
    Australia
    I only had standard CSR pedals with obviously my CSR, after using Logitech DFGT pedals I wasn't complaining, I've gone to the T500 mainly because of my glorious tax refund, but to be entirely fair the CSR holds its own against the T500 in FFB, the T500 is a lot more precise on how much FFB to deal back to you regarding your situation on circuit, but the CSR is a great unit, and compared to the price of what the G29 is will be a far better option,
     
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  23. Ps4Skorpion

    Ps4Skorpion

    Messages:
    2
    Has anyone of you tryed or buyed a g29??
    I have. My last wheel is a g25 and
    Wow!!! What a diffrence. So smooth and extreme noiseless.
    Ok i must be fair i don't have tryed Thrustmaster Wheels but for me it's realy a good wheel. Becaus for example
     
  24. Ps4Skorpion

    Ps4Skorpion

    Messages:
    2
    ... i dont have time or a room to get in first place in games like Gt6, nfs shift, or any other games with the g25 it was to noisy and to how can i say if you take your hands of the wheel begins to spin left right left right. At any speed.
    I startet PC with my pad and it was realy hard to get in first place.
    Yesterday a opened the Box, attached my g29 at my playseat and 5 min later i get what i want. Finisht first. Yes that is what i want.

    Sorry about my bad english i am from Austria
     
  25. Glovesman

    Glovesman

    Messages:
    56
    Location:
    England
    I have always been a Logitech fan and had several wheels from them.
    My first serious wheel (some may laugh at this) was the DFGT.
    I was very happy with this and it suited all of my needs.
    I then used my friends G27 and the difference was incredible. I went out and got one myself.
    If Logitech had added support for the G27 on PS4 I would have been more than happy sticking with that, but luckily for me they didn't and I purchased the T300.
    For my opinion (and that is all it is, my opinion) it feels like the same step up from DFGT to G27. The pedals are reasonable, but I will upgrade them. I got the T300 for £270 from a catalogue based high street store (not sure if I can mention Argos on here so I won't). and got over half of this back from selling my G27.

    I personally think that the T300 is a big step up from G27.

    Sorry about my English, I am from Kent.
     
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  26. Fryto

    Fryto

    Messages:
    1,571
    Location:
    Belgium
    I voted for the G29, because I own a T300:
    First one broke after two months, I had to wait two months for a replacement, and now the replacement also broke after two months.
    The DFGT I have since 2009 still works fine (except some spiking on the throttle), which marks the build quality difference between Logitech and Thrustmaster.

    If I had known that Logitech would come up with the G29, I'd never have bought the Thrustmaster.
     
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  27. E46 M3 Man

    E46 M3 Man

    Messages:
    25
    Hey everyone. I recently got a PS4 for my birthday and I've been looking at buying either the Logitech G29 or Thrustmaster T300. I have had a Logitech DFGT for at least 5 years and never had any problems with it so I am going more towards the G29 as I hear the T300 has reliability issues. Is the 'notchiness' and noise of the G29 that bad or is it acceptable?
     
    JoeW likes this.
  28. IceWarden

    IceWarden

    Messages:
    3,637
    Location:
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    Mine is dead silent. And I came from a DFGT as well.

    When you turn it on it does the self calibration and you can't hear it all except when it hits the stops on the far left and right of the rotation.

    During driving it is silent. Literally.
     
  29. E46 M3 Man

    E46 M3 Man

    Messages:
    25
    That's great to know! It put me off using the DFGT for drifting since I was so concious about the noise. If it is that silent then I think I'll have to place an order!
     
  30. IceWarden

    IceWarden

    Messages:
    3,637
    Location:
    United States
    The DFGT goes through that loud "whiiirrrrr" noise when you plug it in. When I plug my G29 in, if my back is turned to it, I don't even know it's happening.

    The pedals will take some getting used to. They weigh more than twice as much and the brake pedal is MUCH stiffer.

    You will be impressed.