WRC officially in Gran Turismo 5!

[JDMKING13]

One thing I can't help but notice is how much the wheels lean while they are turned. Is that Camber?

O yes love that negative camber.

 

[Raitziger]

It's weird to see a car do that with no skidmarks or smoke after seeing the new smoke in the latest build.

And that tale won't kick out as this car should have LSD.

 

[chepe371]

It looks terrible...

The vehicles pivot on a central point (ala Colin Mcrae series)...

The graphics look dated, and the game play sounds very dull, and only loosely inspired by actual WRC events/races.

Not impressed thus far.

Rally fans always pay the price.

From an outside point of view, rally is marketable as a game, fast cars sliding about jumping around beautiful scenery.

But thats only partial reality, yes cars are fast yes they jump around beautiful scenery, but there's so much more.

This one seems rushed and objective, seen totally from an outsiders point of view, I mean, a stage through a World Heritage Site?

Too much attention to textures with not enough attention to 3D models.

Interior\Cockpit view looked really bad to me, truly like the old CMR2K5 with interiors ported straight from the CMR2 on PS1.

Sigh.

Might need a new compy to keep up with future RSRBR releases.

 

[CoolColJ]

Well WRC is a bit of a farce these days, the glory years are long gone. So IMO it's pointless having a proper WRC license in GT5. The cars no longer look and sound any good

[YOUTUBEHD]sNwOkjxMAGI[/YOUTUBEHD]

 

[chepe371]

90% of those cars are already in GT. Loeb is a farce? 6 time world champion!

And personally I love the Citroen C4 WRC.


WRC license is important to GT, hopefully it will get their heads out of the sand and stop ignoring what real rally is, not just the new models and drivers, but the experience, so we can take all their great pre-existing rally cars for a REAL spin.

+WRC license opens up the existing cars to their real liveries.

 

[CoolColJ]

2 teams... It ain't like it used to be, how can you have a World Championship with 2 teams...?

You don't need a license to have an authentic Rally game.
And the cars these days all look like wimpy hatchback clones.
At least back in Group A days, you could buy the cars they raced with, and they all looked different.
Which is why we had all these cool cars back then like the Pulsar GTI-R

The cars don't slide around like they used to either, just too advanced and expensive now

 

[chepe371]

I agree with the 'monopolization' of world rally, as in, I agree that it has been 'monopolized'.

Theres not much variety as far as car models, granted.

But you have different classes WRC Championship, Junior WRC, and Super WRC.

But if GT's physics are so good, and we now have day\night transitions, rumored weather and nearly 50 existing rally cars, all we need is the stages.

Since the Peugeot 205 its been pretty much accepted that the hatch design makes the fastest rally cars, Delta HF, Focus, 206, Corolla, C4, Fiesta New Impreza etc, the 90's saw alot of sedans\saloons make amazing WR Cars, Evos Imprezas so on...But unfortunately mid sized 4 door cars have gotten ALOT larger in these past years ( as gas prices go up ??? ) so they hardly make good WR Cars anymore and rules state they must use 2.0 litre engines, how many sedans these days still use 2.0's?

 

[RACECAR]

2 Manufacterers... It ain't like it used to be, how can you have a World Championship with 2 Manufacterers...?

You don't need a license to have an authentic Rally game.
And the cars these days all look like wimpy hatchback clones.
At least back in Group A days, you could buy the cars they raced with, and they all looked different.
Which is why we had all these cool cars back then like the Pulsar GTI-R

The cars don't slide around like they used to either, just too advanced and expensive now

Fixed. There's more then 2 teams in WRC, but I think that was actually what you meant.

 

[JohnBM01]

A game we don't get in the United States was a PS2 game called "WRC Rally Evolved." It looked like a very cool and very detailed title. I read it was only sold in Europe. I guess we're all thinking about what other games with WRC cars and/or licensing has offered, and then compare those experiences to what Gran Turismo 5 could possibly provide.

There just isn't that powerhouse rally game unless you're fond of the Colin McRae Rally series or Richard Burns Rally. Gran Turismo still needs a new direction in rally racing.

 

[JoshB1984]

A game we don't get in the United States was a PS2 game called "WRC Rally Evolved." It looked like a very cool and very detailed title. I read it was only sold in Europe. I guess we're all thinking about what other games with WRC cars and/or licensing has offered, and then compare those experiences to what Gran Turismo 5 could possibly provide.

There just isn't that powerhouse rally game unless you're fond of the Colin McRae Rally series or Richard Burns Rally. Gran Turismo still needs a new direction in rally racing.

Like this one?

 

[JohnBM01]

Exactly, JoshB1984. The only way I know about this title is from YouTube videos I've seen of it. Had all kinds of cars ranging from modern (at its time) rally cars and even the classic rally cars. It's a great shame the US didn't get this game because it looks and plays wonderfully. I don't mean to go this far off-topic, but that is at least something to fall on in terms of good rally racing experiences.

 

[CoolColJ]

WRC Evo is the last of the series by Evolution Studios. I have WRC2 on the PS2.
I haven't played it in ages, but at the time I remember being disappointed in how the cars looked and moved, it just ain't like Gran Turismo unfortunately. Not many games are

I guess that's why people want all these different things in a GT game, since no one else has been able to get the cars to move and look right....

 

[RACECAR]

And the cars these days all look like wimpy hatchback clones.

Well can't the same be said about the Peugeot 205, the Renault Maxi Turbo, the Lancia Delta Intergrale, the Ford Escort and the Toyota Corolla from years past? I know you miss seeing the likes of the Evo and the STI, but these "wimpy" hatchbacks are simply much more manuverable cars. Lancia and Peugeot proved this long ago and now Citroen and Ford have proven it the past few years.

 

[Snaeper]

2 manufacturers... It ain't like it used to be, how can you have a World Championship with 2 manufacturers...?

Well... the V8 Supercar Series is fairly popular down there in Australia I hear. It's not exactly a World Championship, but it's very exciting and competitive and strictly features two manufacturers.

In the '90's times were good and money was plenty, alas.... the money ran out and manufacturers had to look at their priorities for racing. It's become a pick and choose for racing series and you have to remember that it's about marketing dollars too.

 

[CoolColJ]

Well can't the same be said about the Peugeot 205, the Renault Maxi Turbo, the Lancia Delta Intergrale, the Ford Escort and the Toyota Corolla from years past? I know you miss seeing the likes of the Evo and the STI, but these "wimpy" hatchbacks are simply much more manuverable cars. Lancia and Peugeot proved this long ago and now Citroen and Ford have proven it the past few years.

I don't consider these wimpy hatchbacks, but muscular hatchbacks
Big wings, pumped up guards etc

And not hard for Citroen and Ford to prove it, because they're not racing anyone else!

Well... the V8 Supercar Series is fairly popular down there in Australia I hear. It's not exactly a World Championship, but it's very exciting and competitive and strictly features two manufacturers.

In the '90's times were good and money was plenty, alas.... the money ran out and manufacturers had to look at their priorities for racing. It's become a pick and choose for racing series and you have to remember that it's about marketing dollars too.

I'm Australian and I don't watch the V8 Supercars - yawn...
The old days of Group A Touring car racing, again with the wider variety of cars and the R32 Skyline GT-R competing was so much better!
Until they banned everyone else to leave only Ford and Holden V8 cars.. like they say, if you can't beat em, ban em

 

[amar212]

Well... the V8 Supercar Series is fairly popular down there in Australia I hear. It's not exactly a World Championship, but it's very exciting and competitive and strictly features two manufacturers.

In the '90's times were good and money was plenty, alas.... the money ran out and manufacturers had to look at their priorities for racing. It's become a pick and choose for racing series and you have to remember that it's about marketing dollars too.

V8 Supercars never got attention it deserves in gaming, except from Toca Race Driver 3 and not-so-ell-known EA games back in '90s.

However, Toca Race Driver 3 gave the fans all tracks from season - including Bathurst, but more importantly Adelaide, Surfers, Phillip Island and Eastern Creek - making V8 Supercars my favorite venue of the whole game, mostly because of the great tracks Austraila have.

I would really like that PD recreate some of those beauties - with all respect to European tracks, true beauty lies Downunder.

 

[Snaeper]

I don't consider these wimpy hatchbacks, but muscular hatchbacks
Big wings, pumped up guards etc

And not hard for Citroen and Ford to prove it, because they're not racing anyone else!

Well you can't blame their competition for not being able to afford the cost of running a semi-obscure professional racing series that requires the cars to venture around the world.

Nevertheless, I'd hope Volkswagen makes the rumors true and joins in the fray. Wouldn't mind seeing Hyundai return either with the upcoming Tiburon Coupe

I'm Australian and I don't watch the V8 Supercars - yawn...
The old days of Group A Touring car racing, again with the wider variety of cars and the R32 Skyline GT-R competing was so much better!
Until they banned everyone else to leave only Ford and Holden V8 cars.. like they say, if you can't beat em, ban em

I'm sure it was better, but after racing the cars in Toca and seeing enough on websites etc. It doesn't matter if you watch it or not, a two-make racing series that barely leaves Australia has quite a reputation, showing you don't need to have a bunch of manufacturers entered to be interesting.

I would love to see a huge manifestation of Group A Touring cars from around the world in GT. I can only imagine the sheer amount of fun that would be to race cars that never raced against each other yet complied to the same sets of rules.

Also, I was doing a little reading on the series' "Car of the Future". Rumors are that Mercedes, Nissan and Hyundai are interested in competing down under. Rumors.

V8 Supercars never got attention it deserves in gaming, except from Toca Race Driver 3 and not-so-well-known EA games back in '90s.

However, Toca Race Driver 3 gave the fans all tracks from season - including Bathurst, but more importantly Adelaide, Surfers, Phillip Island and Eastern Creek - making V8 Supercars my favorite venue of the whole game, mostly because of the great tracks Austraila have.

I would really like that PD recreate some of those beauties - with all respect to European tracks, true beauty lies Downunder.

I remember Toca and wholly crap the V8 Supercars were fun... if a little challenging for my less-then-stellar driving skills back then. I should scrounge around for that game to see how I'd fare now.

 

[RACECAR]

I don't consider these wimpy hatchbacks, but muscular hatchbacks
Big wings, pumped up guards etc

And yet, I bet you couldn't have even bought their road going counterparts to look like the WRC spec machines. Last I checked, there wasn't sort of performance aero package from TRD to make your Corolla look like the one Carlos sainz drove. And just out of curiousity, what makes today's hatchbacks "wimpy" by your definition?

And not hard for Citroen and Ford to prove it, because they're not racing anyone else!

You seem to have forgotten that this is the only the second year in a row that its only Ford and Citroen (unlike the DTM, which has been a two Make scrap for the last 6 years). Lets not forget that even then, Mitsubishi's Lancer and Subaru's STI simply couldn't keep up with the Focus and the Xsara (and eventually the C4) so they kinda of did have someone to race, it just happens to be the same unfortunate fate suffered in GT1: One make was simply too dominate and no one had the funds (more like balls to me) to keep up.

 

[CoolColJ]

And yet, I bet you couldn't have even bought their road going counterparts to look like the WRC spec machines. Last I checked, there wasn't sort of performance aero package from TRD to make your Corolla look like the one Carlos sainz drove. And just out of curiousity, what makes today's hatchbacks "wimpy" by your definition?



You seem to have forgotten that this is the only the second year in a row that its only Ford and Citroen (unlike the DTM, which has been a two Make scrap for the last 6 years). Lets not forget that even then, Mitsubishi's Lancer and Subaru's STI simply couldn't keep up with the Focus and the Xsara (and eventually the C4) so they kinda of did have someone to race, it just happens to be the same unfortunate fate suffered in GT1: One make was simply too dominate and no one had the funds (more like balls to me) to keep up.

That's because around that time, was when WRC machines kicked in.
Back in the Group A days, you could buy the cars that they rallied in. Pretty much as they appeared in Group N, and with some changes turn them into Group A cars.
It's when the whole WRC specs was phased in was when things started to go downhill IMO.

Honestly I don't see the point of that. Manufactorers enter these events to sell more cars, and maybe further their technology in such said cars. Once you remove the connection between the rally car and the road car, it becomes pointless. You spend all this money for what?
That's why everyone started to pull out. Much like in F1, lots of money spent for naught.

Rally machines for the road

 

[HN7]

That's because around that time, was when WRC machines kicked in.
Back in the Group A days, you could buy the cars that they rallied in. Pretty much as they appeared in Group N, and with some changes turn them into Group A cars.
It's when the whole WRC specs was phased in was when things started to go downhill IMO.

Honestly I don't see the point of that. Manufactorers enter these events to sell more cars, and maybe further their technology in such said cars. Once you remove the connection between the rally car and the road car, it becomes pointless. You spend all this money for what?
That's why everyone started to pull out. Much like in F1, lots of money spent for naught.

I wouldn't call it all for nothing. The technology does trickle down, just not for the average guys like in the old days. You just have to be rich to benefit from it (ie, Ferrari E-Diff). When racing first started, the motto is: Race on Sunday, Sell on Monday; now it's just: Let's see who can get more money on sponsorship by winning.

 

[chepe371]

Group B were the wild days, anything goes, unlimited power, wolves in sheeps clothing, the only ones sticking to the base was the Audi camp the rest were making Turbocharged 4WD's out of FF Hatches.

That's with no rules, now you have WRC, a million and one rules, and still most of them manage to radically transform their base cars in the same way as Group B albeit with more restrictions on power and engine size.

Group B cars cost something along the lines of 150k to build whilst WRC cars cost something like 750k, thats 5 times as much!

With a 150k price tag, there could be alot of competition from Works and Privateers, but not many (especially these days) are willing to plop down 3/4 of a Mil per car + avg. 15-20k entrance fee per event.

That's why today we only see the biggest names competing.

The only way to see this change to become more welcoming is to change the rules again, maybe the format, to save money on travel expenses have the Euro WRC, then Asian\Oceanic WRC and American WRC, then have International WRC for the big heads who can afford to scoot around the globe.

 

[amar212]

That's why today we only see the biggest names competing.

The only way to see this change to become more welcoming is to change the rules again, maybe the format, to save money on travel expenses have the Euro WRC, then Asian\Oceanic WRC and American WRC, then have International WRC for the big heads who can afford to scoot around the globe.

Both somewhat wrong

"Big names" have left WRC years ago, today you only have Citroen and Ford. Why? It has a lots to do with something else, not costs. And it also says something about the second claim.

WRC is just not the format that can be "TV-lised". There is no way you can make a comprehensive overwiew for TV viewers, except for those that really folow the sport.

Thus sponsors have become less intrested, because without TV there is no intrest in funding all-around-the-world expenses that WRC teams have.

Even strong inclusion of SS tracks in calendar couldn't do much.

It is a pity, yes, but WRC will never be as popular as it was three, two or just decade ago.

It will remain the sport for us enthusiasts, but I can safely see that without some serious reformatting of the overall sport we will never see "Big names" in WRC again.

 

[Raitziger]

Was those cosworth sierras 2wd or 4wd in the vid? Their straight speed at least matched GTRs.

 

[RACECAR]

Honestly I don't see the point of that. Manufactorers enter these events to sell more cars, and maybe further their technology in such said cars. Once you remove the connection between the rally car and the road car, it becomes pointless.

Well, can't the same be said about most Production based Motorsports? Super GT, perfect example. Other then the Badge, headlights and in rare case the chassis, they share nothing with there road going counterparts. Same for DTM. To my surprise, the V8 Supercars don't even use the same engines in the production cars sold in their repective Australian market, but rather use the exact same V8 from their American parent companies(which may be the exact same ones used in NASCAR)

You spend all this money for what?

Marketing? Brand awareness? (notice the popular cars are usually the ones competeting).

That's why everyone started to pull out. Much like in F1, lots of money spent for naught.

Actually, most of them have cited the economic climate as the main reason for pulling out, at the same time many teams in racing have either downsized, merged or closed all together. Of course Toyota finally came to the realization that they have wasted their time in F1 trying to when they had no hope pr chance of winning in the first place.

Rally machines for the road

Meh, not quite really, well not the Escort anyway:

Of course, I think that car has had more cosmetic adjustments then most women nowadays so I could be wrong

 

[JohnBM01]

I say that if PD wants to really expand with rally cars, they'll need a variety of rallying machines. Most of us all know about some of the rally cars we've seen in GT4. More Group B, more classics, maybe even trophy trucks and more Dakar machines. Like, I'd be okay racing some machines like the Volkswagen Touareg Dakar machine, or like the Nissan Pickup Dakar (like in Enthusia), or something like that. There also has to be more varieties of rally tracks.

I've never had much luck in rally games racing tarmac rallies. Tarmac rallying is fun, but just not as fun as kicking up dirt or (for my Swedish friends) snow. An even balance of tarmac and other surfaces would be awesome for rallying in GT5. Considering PD is a Japanese developer, maybe they can look to the Rally Japan for some inspiration. Or really, you know what? PD could come up with touge mountain passes, which are just as good as point-to-point rallying.

PD has a number of ideas to try. Whether or not we'll see any come to form remains to be seen.

 

[GDII]

Well, can't the same be said about most Production based Motorsports? Super GT, perfect example. Other then the Badge, headlights and in rare case the chassis, they share nothing with there road going counterparts. Same for DTM. To my surprise, the V8 Supercars don't even use the same engines in the production cars sold in their repective Australian market, but rather use the exact same V8 from their American parent companies(which may be the exact same ones used in NASCAR)

The Australian Holden Commodore road cars use the same engines as the Corvette road cars. The highers spec V8s use LS1 LS2 and LS3 engines.

 

[CoolColJ]

Meh, not quite really, well not the Escort anyway:

Of course, I think that car has had more cosmetic adjustments then most women nowadays so I could be wrong

Why not the Ford Escort RS Cosworth? I've seen that exact model here in Australia on the streets once, and it wasn't sold here. Probably an import, but street legal and all.

Was those cosworth sierras 2wd or 4wd in the vid? Their straight speed at least matched GTRs.

The Sierra RS500 used here were rear wheel drive, and had 1100kg minimum weight by 1991

The R32 raced here had something like 600HP, 1360kg minimum weight

 

[chepe371]

It is a pity, yes, but WRC will never be as popular as it was three, two or just decade ago.

It will remain the sport for us enthusiasts, but I can safely see that without some serious reformatting of the overall sport we will never see "Big names" in WRC again.

Their site wrc.com is really getting dated, who wants to hear audio podcasts from live rallies?

The rallies are spread throughout 3 days so to broadcast something like that LIVE is a big mess, but every time I watch a rally its on the net after knowing the results so it takes away the excitement a little.

And like I mentioned earlier if they had localized rallies that the average schmo\privateer could enter and win a few bucks , whilst having the prestigious World Rally events it would extend the reach of the sport which is sadly declining.

In the States you got Ken Block who has firm handshakes with the X-Games people, if the X-Games can get a few "real" rally stages (not just jumps and hoops of fire in arenas) as part of their summer AND winter X-Games, that too would do alot to expand the WRC.

 

[CoolColJ]

They used to do live or near live Rally coverage here here when Rally Australia ran. There was a buzz back then, and all opinions were WRC was getting popular and might rival F1 one day, things were going great and then something happened, everything crashed hard .....

I'll put it down to inept management....

 

[danielwhite74]

It looks terrible...

The vehicles pivot on a central point (ala Colin Mcrae series)...

The graphics look dated, and the game play sounds very dull, and only loosely inspired by actual WRC events/races.

Not impressed thus far.

I suck at detecting sarcasm, but you, sir, are a legend.

Edit: Scratch that. Thought you were talking about Gran Turismo 5.