2014 United Sports Car Championship

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raven214
Totally agree with you. The DPs and P2s are so different, though, that I really think they should be split into separate categories and eliminate PC or run it as a support series.
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PC isn't slower, it's just has lower cost with it. While it doesn't seem to fit exactly in the top series because of that thing, the only option I really see if they were to move was to make them the Prototype class in Contiental series which seems alot more spec class and cost efficient compared. It guess younger/smaller teams who maybe can't afford to run with the big dogs a stepping stone to atleast get the same style of racing with multi-class instead of just a slower/faster GT series which is no different than others really.

As far as what I am seeing today, it seems to be one DP team ahead on the rest of the teams but LMP aren't off at all.
 
Wilbur
PC isn't slower, it's just has lower cost with it. While it doesn't seem to fit exactly in the top series because of that thing, the only option I really see if they were to move was to make them the Prototype class in Contiental series which seems alot more spec class and cost efficient compared. It guess younger/smaller teams who maybe can't afford to run with the big dogs a stepping stone to atleast get the same style of racing with multi-class instead of just a slower/faster GT series which is no different than others really.

As far as what I am seeing today, it seems to be one DP team ahead on the rest of the teams but LMP aren't off at all.
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Oh I have nothing against the PC class. I just fear it's proving too difficult to get the BoP right in P, and in the interest of providing good fair racing and making USCC successful, I think P needs to be split into the 2 groups it really is.

I think there are (probably) too many cars out there right now as well, although the numbers (in the Grand Am days) normally taper off after Daytona since some people come just to do that race. Eliminating PC helps reduce overall numbers to help make a little more room on the track and in the pits, both of which I think are good things.

The only problem with adding PC to CSCC is field size. CSCC usually has quite large fields to begin with and they run on some smaller tracks so I don't think there would be enough room to have the PCs out there too. That's why I suggest making them their own series, though I like your point about PC drivers still needing/getting the experience of multi-class racing. I guess that could be accomplished in CSCC by carefully limiting the number of entries per each group (PC, GS, and ST).
 
raven214
Oh I have nothing against the PC class. I just fear it's proving too difficult to get the BoP right in P, and in the interest of providing good fair racing and making USCC successful, I think P needs to be split into the 2 groups it really is.

I think there are (probably) too many cars out there right now as well, although the numbers (in the Grand Am days) normally taper off after Daytona since some people come just to do that race. Eliminating PC helps reduce overall numbers to help make a little more room on the track and in the pits, both of which I think are good things.

The only problem with adding PC to CSCC is field size. CSCC usually has quite large fields to begin with and they run on some smaller tracks so I don't think there would be enough room to have the PCs out there too. That's why I suggest making them their own series, though I like your point about PC drivers still needing/getting the experience of multi-class racing. I guess that could be accomplished in CSCC by carefully limiting the number of entries per each group (PC, GS, and ST).
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Do not under any circumstances limit the field at all imo. That's an easy way to screw over one off teams and smaller privateer teams. Continental is an awesome series with better racing than TUSC. This leads to a lot of crashes though with the packed grids and mostly am drivers in the series. It's also the series we all can relate to the most. I think the majority of us here drive something closer to an mx-5, Honda Civic, Ford Mustang, or Camaro irl rather than an Audi R8 or Ferrari 458.

I'm honestly not surprised AXR is fastest here at Sebring. In the winter tests, AXR ran the most laps and got the most data points. More data+Harder work=faster lap times. We didn't see Oak or MMPR running dozens of laps a few months ago.
Tired Tyres
BoP = Balance of Performance. This to make all the cars in a category run the same lap times.

I hate it. The fastest/most efficient car should win the race. That is the literal point of going motor racing. To prove you are the best at what you do..
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The majority of the time, those races become very monotonous because whoever builds the fastest/most efficient race car from day 1 is virtually unstoppable for the entirety of a 12 round 8 month long championship that's over with 1/3 the season left. I'm not saying I want a fabricated race just to have a close championship though.
 
raven214
Oh I have nothing against the PC class. I just fear it's proving too difficult to get the BoP right in P, and in the interest of providing good fair racing and making USCC successful, I think P needs to be split into the 2 groups it really is.

I think there are (probably) too many cars out there right now as well, although the numbers (in the Grand Am days) normally taper off after Daytona since some people come just to do that race. Eliminating PC helps reduce overall numbers to help make a little more room on the track and in the pits, both of which I think are good things.

The only problem with adding PC to CSCC is field size. CSCC usually has quite large fields to begin with and they run on some smaller tracks so I don't think there would be enough room to have the PCs out there too. That's why I suggest making them their own series, though I like your point about PC drivers still needing/getting the experience of multi-class racing. I guess that could be accomplished in CSCC by carefully limiting the number of entries per each group (PC, GS, and ST).
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People seem to assume that P class are different, they aren't but a very different idea of what a Prototype is. The issue is neither have been really compared to each other til this year in terms of side by side (I am a real world data not a facts on paper kinda guy), and while it seems the LMP's are behind right now; this is testing nothing set in stone and not like all the DP's are upfront right away either. It seems some teams didn't take this year as serious as they should have while Action Express did alot of homework (and other DP's like CGR failed so far assuming they would be fine).

I wouldn't really say there are too many cars, the fields aren't that massive to keep times down. The biggest fields right now are GTD which makes sense but I'm glad to see numbers up period. How many PC teams are there that don't use someone else stall, and I'm sure some tracks will have a limit on how many of each can be there.

As far as the smaller tracks, none are that small but I think they will be fine in general. IF you want to make them their own series (in which they already are) then you will have to probably bump something else which nothing will, they seem ok to me and hell next race may not have as many show up.
 
Wilbur
People seem to assume that P class are different, they aren't but a very different idea of what a Prototype is. The issue is neither have been really compared to each other til this year in terms of side by side (I am a real world data not a facts on paper kinda guy), and while it seems the LMP's are behind right now; this is testing nothing set in stone and not like all the DP's are upfront right away either. It seems some teams didn't take this year as serious as they should have while Action Express did alot of homework (and other DP's like CGR failed so far assuming they would be fine).

I wouldn't really say there are too many cars, the fields aren't that massive to keep times down. The biggest fields right now are GTD which makes sense but I'm glad to see numbers up period. How many PC teams are there that don't use someone else stall, and I'm sure some tracks will have a limit on how many of each can be there.

As far as the smaller tracks, none are that small but I think they will be fine in general. IF you want to make them their own series (in which they already are) then you will have to probably bump something else which nothing will, they seem ok to me and hell next race may not have as many show up.
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The only tracks that would cause a problem on the schedule are the 2 street courses, but IMSA is smart enough to run split races there as those races would be run entirely under caution if not done that way.

The DP and LMP2 are much more similar than it seems. Both were originally conceived as a low cost alternative for privateer teams to race. The original selling point of the DP was "Prototype racing at GT cost." The DP is built for Daytona. When 29 were gridded for the Rolex 24, the ACO took notice. The LMP2 was born. It is built for Europe and Le Mans. There were over 20 LMP2 at Le Mans in 2013. Regardless of what the chassis is made of, we see that when you keep cost down and make the playing field level, teams come out of the woodwork to race them. I'm a fan of both, but I prefer the DP in the looks dept. Not liking one or the other is ignorant because they are 2 unique and equally valid solutions to the cost containment problem in sports car racing
 
Wilbur
People seem to assume that P class are different, they aren't but a very different idea of what a Prototype is. The issue is neither have been really compared to each other til this year in terms of side by side (I am a real world data not a facts on paper kinda guy), and while it seems the LMP's are behind right now; this is testing nothing set in stone and not like all the DP's are upfront right away either. It seems some teams didn't take this year as serious as they should have while Action Express did alot of homework (and other DP's like CGR failed so far assuming they would be fine).

I wouldn't really say there are too many cars, the fields aren't that massive to keep times down. The biggest fields right now are GTD which makes sense but I'm glad to see numbers up period. How many PC teams are there that don't use someone else stall, and I'm sure some tracks will have a limit on how many of each can be there.

As far as the smaller tracks, none are that small but I think they will be fine in general. IF you want to make them their own series (in which they already are) then you will have to probably bump something else which nothing will, they seem ok to me and hell next race may not have as many show up.
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All good points - I really hope it works out! I overlapped the numbers/pits issue with the length of cautions, but perhaps protocol and the number of classes has a bigger effect than the overall number of entries.

At any rate, I agree there is no substitute for real world data, and the best/most relevant comes from the races themselves. Hopefully the BoP will become more level as we get more races in this season. And I love seeing the big GT fields! 👍
 
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On one hand I'm surprised as I would've thought they'd have another car ready or at least had enough time between Daytona and Sebring to have another put together. Then again, I think that's the hardest wreck this generation of DP has had in its short existence whereas we've seen multiple instances of LMPs have hard wrecks and then be rebuilt the next month (or even day).
 
It's a bit surprising that they don't have a spare car, but if they don't have one I sure can understand there's no incentive to get one now.

A bit OT but this reminded me the totalling of the Highcroft HPD and the awesome Youtube "rebuild video" and I wonder if any of the americans posting here have any news about this team because I can't find any. Seems odd that such a professional team simply vanishes and nobody cares or even mentions it in the usual press.
 
Hun200kmh
It's a bit surprising that they don't have a spare car, but if they don't have one I sure can understand there's no incentive to get one now.

A bit OT but this reminded me the totalling of the Highcroft HPD and the awesome Youtube "rebuild video" and I wonder if any of the americans posting here have any news about this team because I can't find any. Seems odd that such a professional team simply vanishes and nobody cares or even mentions it in the usual press.
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Last I heard about them was there involvement with Deltawing, but nothing else as far as I'm aware.
 
Hun200kmh
It's a bit surprising that they don't have a spare car, but if they don't have one I sure can understand there's no incentive to get one now.

A bit OT but this reminded me the totalling of the Highcroft HPD and the awesome Youtube "rebuild video" and I wonder if any of the americans posting here have any news about this team because I can't find any. Seems odd that such a professional team simply vanishes and nobody cares or even mentions it in the usual press.
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Honda stopped dumping money into their customer programs. That's not the only reason, but it all boils down to that one way or the other. They are somehow part of the DW program now.

Infinital-NG
The Red Dragon shut down for rest of the year.

http://www.racer.com/index.php/imsa/item/101410-imsa-bob-stallings-shuts-down-for-remainder-of-2014
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Hate to see that. That's business though. I don't blame them personally. Their goal was to win the Patron-NAEC. After Daytona, they're basically out of that. A complete new car needed. Watch for them next year
 
As much as I disliked seeing the Red Dragon at the track years ago I will hate to see them not on track.

A great team will certainly be missed this year.
 
01GTP
As much as I disliked seeing the Red Dragon at the track years ago I will hate to see them not on track.

A great team will certainly be missed this year.
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In the years of grand am where it was Ganassi v. Gainco/Stallings v. SunTrust/Taylor, I always was going for the Red Dragon. Jon Fogarty was my favorite driver from the grand am days, and he's now in a tie with A.J. Allmendinger after his performance at the 50th and 51st Rolex 24s. Gurney is a great guy too. I was really thrilled when they took the win at COTA last year. I would've loved to see them take the Rolex this year too as they were super fast. Oh well, they'll be back.

Wardez
Feel free to take a crack at the new comments section for this article, but be weary:
https://www.gtplanet.net/jann-marde...milk-pickett-nissan-lmp2-in-sebring-12-hours/
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Good opportunity for a young talent to compete against some of the best teams/drivers in the world for 12 hours with a competitive team. He'll be one to watch
 
RACECAR
On one hand I'm surprised as I would've thought they'd have another car ready or at least had enough time between Daytona and Sebring to have another put together.
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Hun200kmh
It's a bit surprising that they don't have a spare car, but if they don't have one I sure can understand there's no incentive to get one now.
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This was a team that was already in constraints to get their car to the NAEC + COTA this year. Most professional sports car teams rarely have spare cars unless they're massive and/or directly linked to the manufacturer. Or a Porsche team. It simply doesn't make sense to own a race car and not use it. Risi doesn't have a spare car either, for example. And the Team Falken Porsche is the only team I can think of in recent memory to pull out a spare, but that was a model several years out of date.

Having followed the news of the Red Dragon building up to Daytona, I knew that once they were involved in that accident that their season was over.
 
Seriously hoping the 12 hours doesn't seem as long as the 24 hours. 24 hours is a long time of spectating a race. 12 hours, also quite long, but at least it's a half-size pill to swallow.
 
ITCC_Andrew
Seriously hoping the 12 hours doesn't seem as long as the 24 hours. 24 hours is a long time of spectating a race. 12 hours, also quite long, but at least it's a half-size pill to swallow.
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The Rolex 24 was long, but it was action packed throughout its entirety. I expect the GTD field again to be the best race while everyone will focus on complaining (again) about how crappy he/she thinks the prototype BoP is
 
cnd01
The Rolex 24 was long, but it was action packed throughout its entirety. I expect the GTD field again to be the best race while everyone will focus on complaining (again) about how crappy he/she thinks the prototype BoP is
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Don't you mean GT racing in general LM and D. Also I'd say more people will complain about DP not getting a fair shake this time around compared to P2 cars
 
ITCC_Andrew
Seriously hoping the 12 hours doesn't seem as long as the 24 hours. 24 hours is a long time of spectating a race. 12 hours, also quite long, but at least it's a half-size pill to swallow.
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If you think of it as a "pill to swallow" then that means endurance racing is not your thing in motorsports. Nothing wrong with that, we all have different preferences.

In my case I do LOVE endurance races and especially the 24 hour ones. Nothing wrong with quick races like we have in the WTCC or medium sized like we have in F1 Grand Prixs (2 hour tops), but when finishing the race is itself an achievement and I see teams up and down the order genuinely happy and proud just because they made it to the chequered flag ... that's my thing.

:)
 
I mean, I can't wait for the races I enjoy most on the Rolex calendar - the 2 hour Glen, etc. I'm seriously surprised by this "let's have two endurance events in a row!" Idea.


I hope this one's good...
 
ITCC_Andrew
I mean, I can't wait for the races I enjoy most on the Rolex calendar - the 2 hour Glen, etc. I'm seriously surprised by this "let's have two endurance events in a row!" Idea.


I hope this one's good...
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What did you expect when they decided to merge an endurance race championship that prepares and emulates WEC in America only, with a series that does one of the longest endurance races of the year along with other sprint and enduro rest of the season?

I expected to see a calendar as it is now, the only thing I wasn't expecting was the PC only race
 
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cnd01
The Rolex 24 was long, but it was action packed throughout its entirety. I expect the GTD field again to be the best race while everyone will focus on complaining (again) about how crappy he/she thinks the prototype BoP is
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I don't know... I feel the 24 was a joke with the stupid fake yelow that turned a 24hr race into a 7 minute one so they could brag about a "close finish" which was so freaking artificial it makes any Vegas stripper seem real!
I really hope they change their stupid ways or they'll kill this series before it even has a chance to succeed!
 
What's wrong with Vegas strippers? And what is their relation with 7 minutes freaking artificial close finishes?
 
ITCC_Andrew
I mean, I can't wait for the races I enjoy most on the Rolex calendar - the 2 hour Glen, etc. I'm seriously surprised by this "let's have two endurance events in a row!" Idea.


I hope this one's good...
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As a Grand Am fan, I've never seen a race at Sebring but I have heard of it, and I am excited to see it this year! Then again I love sports cars and endurance races. Sounds like endurance racing isn't for you, which is fine, but it amazes me - the drama, the effort, pushing cars and crew to the max - I love it! Let us have our moment - there will be plenty of short races for you later in the season. ;)👍
 
Hun200kmh
What's wrong with Vegas strippers? And what is their relation with 7 minutes freaking artificial close finishes?
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Because women should be carbon based life forms rather that Silicon based life forms? :sly:

Having said that, I don't understand the comparison either.:confused:
 
I always wondered what was up with all the ALMS/Grand-Am animosity. I love racing in many forms, especially sports cars so I have always followed and enjoyed both series. The way I saw it was that it was just that much more racing to watch :)
 
All I'm saying, is that I'm surprised. Endurance races are hard to schedule.
 

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