Do you believe in God?

[Strittan]

If string theory is right and there is multiple universe with many things happening in each of them. Yes it's interesting to think of, but still useless because it doesn't answer how the very first one started. The veeeeerrrry first anything is what I'm talking about. Who made that?

That's impossible for any living man to fully understand, and I hope you realize that. You know, these things are not easy to figure out, but they're working on it, and look at how much we know today compared to just 50 years ago.

No one can know for sure how everything started, it's simply too big. However, there are good theories about the small part of the universe that we're in, and how it has become what it is, and that is, even if not explaining everything, at least a good start.

Even if God created earth, that'd still just be the tip of the iceberg. Who created God, and the creator of God, and the creator of the creator, and so on. God has been forever you might say. Oh really? What did he do before he created the universe, and before that, and before that?

 

[TankAss95]

That's impossible for any living man to fully understand, and I hope you realize that. You know, these things are not easy to figure out, but they're working on it, and look at how much we know today compared to just 50 years ago.

No one can know for sure how everything started, it's simply too big. However, there are good theories about the small part of the universe that we're in, and how it has become what it is, and that is, even if not explaining everything, at least a good start.

Even if God created earth, that'd still just be the tip of the iceberg. Who created God, and the creator of God, and the creator of the creator, and so on. God has been forever you might say. Oh really? What did he do before he created the universe, and before that, and before that?

God lives outside the realms of linear time. Think of his "time" like a circle while ours is like an arrow. He has no beginning nor end.

 

[shmogt]

Please go and read my previous post. Your questions are provoking so many answers that you're managing to post a couple of times while I'm trying to respond, so you're missing out on a lot of really key stuff.

Not God.

The second you say "it must have been God" then you have to ask yourself exactly the same question - where did the almighty being come from?

If you can believe God is infinite but not the origins of the universe, then we're wasting our time here.

I never said god since post one and I have in multiple post asked who made god if he is the so called creator.

And if the answer was a deity of some kind, (though there's NO evidence to suggest such a thing), how would that put your mind at ease - for you would still need to apply the same questions to that deity.

It wouldn't. As I just mentioned I never said its obviously god. I did and do say it could be a so called god tho. It also could be a infinite number of things. What I want all of you to do is use your own brains. Forget what science, math, teachers, forget everything that you have been taught and think for yourselves. Literally everything you know is only a theory and is excepted because it works out for so many things. Science is only one persons view that they have passed down to others and they learn more and pass that down and so on. It's the same as what religion does and it isn't the real answer tho. To understand that you must go back to the very start and follow the path forward not backwards like we as society are doing. Don't just judge someone's views, theories, or way of lives just because your mind doesn't understand it. Open them up to all sorts of possibilities an accept everything as a possible answer.

Religion vs science, black vs white, gay vs non gay, US vs terrorist is all made up to get people to fight with each other. It's all fake. None of it matters it's just peoples choices and than someone comes along and starts saying there wrong because of this etc and others join. It becomes a mob mentality as I think I have just proven in here with everyone joining against me. There's no need to fight because in the end we all started from that little tiny cell and no one knows why.

Thought provocking and hopefully eye opening to some of you on what society and science has taught us. Also please don't quote this and start cutting out the smallest details and make meaningless post out of them as you should know by now what my actual question was.

 

[Strittan]

God lives outside the realms of linear time. Think of his "time" like a circle while ours is like an arrow. He has no beginning nor end.

Really? How cute. And what is it he do, this God? Does he have any power to help people, or is he just chillin all day?

 

[Exorcet]

God lives outside the realms of linear time. Think of his "time" like a circle while ours is like an arrow. He has no beginning nor end.

So why can't the universe be an arrow with no beginning?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_(mathematics)#Ray

Also, why does him being outside of time make him immune to creation?

 

[huskeR32]

I never said god since post one and I have in multiple post asked who made god if he is the so called creator.



It wouldn't. As I just mentioned I never said its obviously god. I did and do say it could be a so called god tho. It also could be a infinite number of things. What I want all of you to do is use your own brains. Forget what science, math, teachers, forget everything that you have been taught and think for yourselves. Literally everything you know is only a theory and is excepted because it works out for so many things. Science is only one persons view that they have passed down to others and they learn more and pass that down and so on. It's the same as what religion does and it isn't the real answer tho. To understand that you must go back to the very start and follow the path forward not backwards like we as society are doing. Don't just judge someone's views, theories, or way of lives just because your mind doesn't understand it. Open them up to all sorts of possibilities an accept everything as a possible answer.

I did use my brain tho, and here's what I can plainly see (tho I admit, I don't no for sure):

The string theory is built upon a lot of evidence that is slowly building upon itself, continually adding more weight to an ever-developing theory. It makes sense to assume our expanding knowledge will continue to fit into this puzzle.

On the other hand, you've got the god theory, which has been riddled with so many holes over the years, and has become less and less plausible as our knowledge of physics and chemistry grows. To cling to this theory makes a lot less sense.

And yes, I no that there is know proven answer either way, but one seems a lot more likely.

 

[Tic Tach]

God lives outside the realms of linear time. Think of his "time" like a circle while ours is like an arrow. He has no beginning nor end.

Baseless assertion.

Dismissed.

 

[Tic Tach]

Forget what science, math, teachers, forget everything that you have been taught.....

*crying*

 

[shmogt]

I did use my brain tho, and here's what I can plainly see (tho I admit, I don't no for sure):

The string theory is built upon a lot of evidence that is slowly building upon itself, continually adding more weight to an ever-developing theory. It makes sense to assume our expanding knowledge will continue to fit into this puzzle.

On the other hand, you've got the god theory, which has been riddled with so many holes over the years, and has become less and less plausible as our knowledge of physics and chemistry grows. To cling to this theory makes a lot less sense.

And yes, I no that there is know proven answer either way, but one seems a lot more likely.

String theory is so ultra complicated it's creating more questions than answers. It could be the way it all works I have no idea, but it does show promise which is why researchers have continued to fund money into it.

You have to get the whole god linked to religion thing disconnected tho. Religion for most people is roman catholic and that is those people views on how to live life. I don't agree with church's not having to pay taxes while everyone else does at all. Or the fact that this Pope guy sits in his castle all day and decides what I am allowed to do. It sounds like a dictatorship to me putting these people at a higher level than everyone else when they are preaching about how we are all brother and sister. Total scam money grab. Now if you follow the same views as what they talk about and agree on the same issues go ahead and be apart of it. Doesn't hurt me in anyway, whatever makes you happy I am all for.

God however is a all powerful. A creator of everything. Something so insane words can not describe. The start of the world, the start of human life, the very first universe in string theory you could call god. It just a word humans made to describe what we don't understand, but know there is so much information it is above us humans.

 

[Tic Tach]

God however is all powerful. A creator of everything.

Another baseless assertion.

Something so insane words can not describe. The start of the world, the start of human life, the very first universe in string theory you could call god. It just a word humans made to describe what we don't understand, but know there is so much information it is above us humans.

Why "personalize" this something? If it's that unknowable, untestable, ununderstandable and unreachable, then it's functionally non-existant isn't it?

 

[homeforsummer]

I never said god since post one and I have in multiple post asked who made god if he is the so called creator.

So if you're not trying to discuss God, what exactly are you doing in this thread?

Forget what science, math, teachers, forget everything that you have been taught and think for yourselves. Literally everything you know is only a theory and is excepted because it works out for so many things. Science is only one persons view that they have passed down to others and they learn more and pass that down and so on.

False. Science isn't one person's view. It's the method of finding answers through experimentation and repetition. A scientific theory is one that has been explored over and over with every other possible scenario discounted before settling on an explanation. And then picking and twisting that explanation just to make sure.

As a result I'm quite happy with the lengths people far cleverer than me have gone to in order to prove something.

There's no need to fight because in the end we all started from that little tiny cell and no one knows why.

And you were doing so well up until then.

For probably the dozenth time, there doesn't have to be a "why?" to everything. I really don't understand why you're pursuing this train of thought because it's not getting any of us anywhere.

Thought provocking and hopefully eye opening to some of you on what society and science has taught us.

Life is already thought-provoking enough without delving that deep into philosophical drivel. The very reason I'm so interested in science is because there are still so many unanswered questions. And none of them are "why?".

Also please don't quote this and start cutting out the smallest details and make meaningless post out of them as you should know by now what my actual question was.

Sorry, couldn't help it.

And no, I don't know what your original question was. You're twisting and turning like a twisty turny thing.

 

[huskeR32]

And no, I don't know what your original question was. You're twisting and turning like a twisty turny thing.

 

[Famine]

Literally everything you know is only a theory

"Only a theory" is a meaningless phrase. "A theory" is a scientific byword for "a fact". Only the strongest, most resilient hypotheses become theories. "A theory" is indistinguishable from "an explanation that covers every known empirical fact".

You may as well run at a building head first shouting "It's only a wall!".

Science is only one persons view that they have passed down to others and they learn more and pass that down and so on. It's the same as what religion does and it isn't the real answer tho.

Does anyone have a jaw-dropping smiley?

No science is one person's view or opinion. All science is testable by anyone, anywhere. You don't have to accept it - you can test it for yourself!

There's no need to fight because in the end we all started from that little tiny cell and no one knows why.

Religionists care about why. Scientists don't - we only care about how.

Also please don't quote this and start cutting out the smallest details and make meaningless post out of them as you should know by now what my actual question was.

You don't get immunity to post meaningless drivel.

 

[dylansan]

Here you go Famine:

 

[shmogt]

Another baseless assertion.

Why "personalize" this something? If it's that unknowable, untestable, ununderstandable and unreachable, then it's functionally non-existant isn't it?

That first part goes with the second part don't pull it out of context. Us humans personalize everything it makes us feel good. Like whatever it is can relate to us. Also as far as I know god hasn't been exactly personalized. He or she or whatever is the all mighty as all religions say. Jesus we said to have come down sent from god to talk to us or something. What was he supposed to look like a frog? Would people really believe a talking frog that teaches us things? Of course not so he was made human form so we can relate. It's just like how barbies and stuff like that look like humans. Even theses cartoon shows of animals don't look like animals they look more like humans so kids can relate. It's natural to want to fit in.

So if you're trying to discuss God, what exactly are you doing in this thread?

False. Science isn't one person's view. It's the method of finding answers through experimentation and repetition. A scientific theory is one that has been explored over and over with every other possible scenario discounted before settling on an explanation. And then picking and twisting that explanation just to make sure.

As a result I'm quite happy with the lengths people far cleverer than me have gone to in order to prove something.

And you were doing so well up until then.

For probably the dozenth time, there doesn't have to be a "why?" to everything. I really don't understand why you're pursuing this train of thought because it's not getting any of us anywhere.

Life is already thought-provoking enough without delving that deep into philosophical drivel. The very reason I'm so interested in science is because there are still so many answered questions. And none of them are "why?".

Sorry, couldn't help it.

And no, I don't know what your original question was. You're twisting and turning like a twisty turny thing.

God is just a word. He is referred to many things. Allah, the all mighty, and a ton of more names depending on what language you speak or culture you live in. The core is the same. It is too powerful to understand.

Again you are thinking too broad. Science yes is basically you do a test it works you do it a bunch more times and same results. That's the simplified version of what science does. It has to start from somewhere tho. Cave man hit a rock against another rock which made fire. They tried it a few more times and it always worked so they stuck with it. They didn't ask why is it doing this or what chemical compounds allow it to give a spark or what even is a spark that creates fire. They passed it down and down etc. sciences started somewhere just like religion. It just has more places to expand while religion has said its too tough to answer let's go with it and not ask why.

You have to ask why to everything. Science does it all the time. When I say why Im asking why what where when and how all the same time. If I no all the other factors than ya I'm only asking why, but not in this case. I'm not sure why you think not asking why to things is so strange? The whole evolution thing you think science didn't ask why does it happen. Why is one of the first questions asked. Sometimes you find the answer sometimes you don't. It sounds like you may be perfect for religion since you don't ask all the questions.

Like I said to the religion people if you are happy with how it's going awesome for you. You choose science and like it more than religion go ahead and choose that,path. Doesn't matter to me, as long as yhappy.

 

[shmogt]

Sorry for double post, but I can't view the bottom of what I wrote on my phone for some reason. I tried to fix a word and it got more screwed up. I mean to say whatever makes you happy is fine for you. Same answer to the religion people.

Edit: Famine you have totally ignored what I have been saying. I am supplying information and not debating. I am not saying anyone is right not am I saying they are wrong. Yes you could run into a wall because it is only a wall, but you will get hurt. You still can do it there is just constituencies. There's no rules of life you can do anything you want.

Theories are not based on facts, but paschal evidence that could prove it to be correct. To than prove it right you run a bunch of experiments and see what works. Something like string theory is not fact it's just a bunch of weird things that science has put into the same category and thought of how to use all that knowledge to make large scale theory. Science ask how what where when and why just like everything else. If I shoot you and you die. Cops will show and send your body to get investigated. They are researching what happened and must ask all the questions to get all the facts to put a plausible theory together.

 

[homeforsummer]

Cave man hit a rock against another rock which made fire. They tried it a few more times and it always worked so they stuck with it. They didn't ask why is it doing this or what chemical compounds allow it to give a spark or what even is a spark that creates fire. They passed it down and down etc.

People passing down a skill they've learned isn't science, it's the basis of civilisation. People don't need to ask "why" striking two stones together makes a spark as long as it's useful for them and they can start a fire with it.

Sciences started somewhere just like religion.

The only similarity between science and religion is that they're both used to explain life, the universe and everything. Of the two, only science can show you how something happens with evidence. Religion asks "why?" and while I'm sure you can get answers from that, it's essentially just conjecture.

And it still tells you no more about how the world actually works.

You have to ask why to everything.

You really don't. The question "why does the sun rise?" can't have an answer that imparts any knowledge to anyone. You can speculate, but that's all you can do. The question "how does the sun rise?" can be answered using evidence. Once you know the answer, it becomes part of your knowledge.

When I say why Im asking why what where when and how all the same time.

The reason we have those five basic questions is because they all have different meanings. If you're using all of them to refer to "why" then you're using them incorrectly.

I'm not sure why you think not asking why to things is so strange?

That's completely the opposite of what I've been saying. Like, the polar opposite.

I've not been talking about not asking why, I've been saying that asking why is irrelevant. Asking "why did life begin?" doesn't get anyone anywhere, at least from a knowledge point of view. The reason for this is because there doesn't need to be a reason (I'm going to start tallying this phrase up soon) for things happening.

"Why did life begin?" is a philosophical question, one that can be discussed on and on ad nauseum without ever really getting anywhere.
"How did life begin?" is a scientific question that can be answered with evidence.

There's nothing wrong with the first question per se, but since we can essentially answer how life began already, the question "why?" becomes irrelevant in the context of discussing God.

Why is one of the first questions asked.

It isn't. You're looking for "how?".

But then since you appear to be using every question interchangeably it's impossible to tell what you're really asking.

Sometimes you find the answer sometimes you don't. It sounds like you may be perfect for religion since you don't ask all the questions.

No, I ask the right questions. "Why?" is the wrong question to ask about how we're all here.

 

[shmogt]

People passing down a skill they've learned isn't science, it's the basis of civilisation. People don't need to ask "why" striking two stones together makes a spark as long as it's useful for them and they can start a fire with it.

The only similarity between science and religion is that they're both used to explain life, the universe and everything. Of the two, only science can show you how something happens with evidence. Religion asks "why?" and while I'm sure you can get answers from that, it's essentially just conjecture.

And it still tells you no more about how the world actually works.

You really don't. The question "why does the sun rise?" can't have an answer that imparts any knowledge to anyone. You can speculate, but that's all you can do. The question "how does the sun rise?" can be answered using evidence. Once you know the answer, it becomes part of your knowledge.

The reason we have those five basic questions is because they all have different meanings. If you're using all of them to refer to "why" then you're using them incorrectly.

That's completely the opposite of what I've been saying. Like, the polar opposite.

I've not been talking about not asking why, I've been saying that asking why is irrelevant. Asking "why did life begin?" doesn't get anyone anywhere, at least from a knowledge point of view. The reason for this is because there doesn't need to be a reason (I'm going to start tallying this phrase up soon) for things happening.

"Why did life begin?" is a philosophical question, one that can be discussed on and on ad nauseum without ever really getting anywhere.
"How did life begin?" is a scientific question that can be answered with evidence.

There's nothing wrong with the first question per se, but since we can essentially answer how life began already, the question "why?" becomes irrelevant in the context of discussing God.

It isn't. You're looking for "how?".

But then since you appear to be using every question interchangeably it's impossible to tell what you're really asking.

No, I ask the right questions. "Why?" is the wrong question to ask about how we're all here.

I don't like to say this but your wrong. If you don't ask all those question you will never solve the true problem. That's the whole problem with society is no one ask why anymore. We are taught as kids to listen to what the schools teach, repeat exactly what we leaned by doing test, and than shut our mouths. There is no creativity anymore. The world doesn't like it when we ask why because it questions there authority and gives us a voice.

If my bank bill has a extra charge on it from the bank if I don't ask why this happened and call them to ask I would be a sucker and just payed it. Most of the time it's a mistake where someone hit a button twice.

Asking why along with the other questions is what makes you think for yourself and not follow just what other are telling you. You can get away with not asking why like in the cave man reference, but that didn't answer the question as to what made the fire did it? They just did it, it works and gave up and went with it.

Science only started because people started asking why. Religion for example everyone went with until someone was brave enough to ask why. That lead to more questions and pretty much brought us to this convo right now. So please don't tell me why is not as important as the other questions at all.

 

[homeforsummer]

I don't like to say this but your wrong. If you don't ask all those question you will never solve the true problem.

And what exactly is the "true problem"?

We are taught as kids to listen to what the schools teach, repeat exactly what we leaned by doing test, and than shut our mouths. There is no creativity anymore. The world doesn't like it when we ask why because it questions there authority and gives us a voice.

Don't give me that tosh. I'm a journalist, I earn my money from being a) creative and b) using my "voice" in a public format.

If my bank bill has a extra charge on it from the bank if I don't ask why this happened and call them to ask I would be a sucker and just payed it. Most of the time it's a mistake where someone hit a button twice.

That's irrelevant. I'm not saying that nobody should ever ask the question "why?", I'm saying that you're asking "why?" of the wrong things. If you can answer the reason for the sun coming up in the morning with "how?" then "why?" becomes irrelevant.

You can get away with not asking why like in the cave man reference, but that didn't answer the question as to what made the fire did it? They just did it, it works and gave up and went with it.

The explanation for fire can't be answered by "why?". It can be answered by "how?".

Science only started because people started asking why.

False. Again, virtually every question in basic science is a "how?" question. "How does this happen?" not "why does this happen?".

Religion for example everyone went with until someone was brave enough to ask why. That lead to more questions and pretty much brought us to this convo right now. So please don't tell me why is not as important as the other questions at all.

It is important, but only when you use it in the right context. And so far, you haven't been.

 

[Azuremen]

You realize science is all about "why?" It is the process of understanding "why"

However, there is a point to which there is no blatant reason beyond "it just does." The entropy from cell divisions and the related chemical process is enough to lead to variations, which in turn ultimately lead to evolution.

No one in has said we shouldn't ask why. You are the one that told us to not listen to science, which is a thought process not a belief system so much, and all that jazz. It seems you might be a nihilist though, so I'm not seeing much point in this.

Or, to put it into perspective - would you ask why if you got "heads" three times in a row with a coin flip? Would you ever get an answer you'd be happy with? I mean, I could explain to you that the rotations of the coin would be determined by the initial rotation from your thumb, yada yada. But does that really tell you why you got it 3 times in a row when you were not trying? There are random things in the universe, they do exist, get over it.

And to continue my science of understanding mindsets, how old are you, shmogt?

 

[shmogt]

And what exactly is the "true problem"?

Don't give me that tosh. I'm a journalist, I earn my money from being a) creative and b) using my "voice" in a public format.

That's irrelevant. I'm not saying that nobody should ever ask the question "why?", I'm saying that you're asking "why?" of the wrong things. If you can answer the reason for the sun coming up in the morning with "how?" then "why?" becomes irrelevant.

The explanation for fire can't be answered by "why?". It can be answered by "how?".

False. Again, virtually every question in basic science is a "how?" question. "How does this happen?" not "why does this happen?".

It is important, but only when you use it in the right context. And so far, you haven't been.

The true problem is obviously depending on the situation. I will use prescription drugs for my example. You have cancer and want it gone. Basically a cure that will stop it from growing in you or anyone else. They give you all these drugs and treatments and still you have cancer potentially at the end. They aren't asking why cancer happens they are asking how it happens and treating the symptoms. If they ask why they will go down to the cellular level. See what happens when certain things are tried and come up with a drug that will stop the process of it spreading at all. Curing the true problem.

Your a journalist so why is every major story a negative one? Why is everything always to put us down instead of build us up? Why in the US is self help books sold in the millions where every other part of the world they are barely even existent. Why is an essential question. I'm not sure where you live so your society may be a little different, but that's how it is in north America. Asking how is fire made is answered by clicking the two rocks together. Why was it made makes you go way deeper into the exact compounds of the rock, how friction works, and how it can be replicated with other means. Why is the start to anything before you can ask how. How and why are the same you can't separate them. As a journalist if someone is shot you ask how. Cops tell you with a gun. Didn't really help much did it. Add why did it happen and suddenly a whole investigation into it must be done. That's science it ask all the questions.

And to continue my science of understanding mindsets, how old are you, shmogt?

This is relevant how to the discussion? I don't like going into details about my life or ask others to give that information out because if I said I was 17 and working as a garbage man even tho my points and comments would still be right or informative everyone would naturally think less of them. If I said I am 52 and a scientist suddenly people would not question what I say as much. Either way I don't want that as I want people to use their own brains and think for themselves with no prior "knowledge" to cloud their judgment.

 

[homeforsummer]

The true problem is obviously depending on the situation. I will use prescription drugs for my example. You have cancer and want it gone. Basically a cure that will stop it from growing in you or anyone else. They give you all these drugs and treatments and still you have cancer potentially at the end. They aren't asking why cancer happens they are asking how it happens and treating the symptoms. If they ask why they will go down to the cellular level. See what happens when certain things are tried and come up with a drug that will stop the process of it spreading at all. Curing the true problem.

"Why" has an application for sure, but until your last few posts you've been using it to ask "why" life began in the first place. There is no answer to that question from a scientific point of view. If you believe in God, sure, you can ask why life exists, but it won't answer any questions in any measurable sense.

Your a journalist so why is every major story a negative one? Why is everything always to put us down instead of build us up?

Most of my stories are quite positive, actually. Or sarcastic, when I think I can get away with it.

If all the news you see, hear or read is negative then you're getting your news in the wrong places.

Asking how is fire made is answered by clicking the two rocks together. Why was it made makes you go way deeper into the exact compounds of the rock, how friction works, and how it can be replicated with other means.

No, that's still a how question.

You could absolutely ask "why build a fire?", to which the answer is "to keep you warm", but you cannot ask "why does fire exist?" in the same vein. You could feasibly ask "why does striking two rocks together create a spark?", but then that question is better served by "how" anyway because by asking "how" you're inviting an explanatory response.

As a journalist if someone is shot you ask how. Cops tell you with a gun. Didn't really help much did it. Add why did it happen and suddenly a whole investigation into it must be done. That's science it ask all the questions.

You're getting way, way off the topic here.

Once again - as already stated in my previous post - I'm not dismissing the word "why" in its entirety. If it was a useless word it wouldn't exist.

What I'm saying - and have been trying to say for the last two or three pages - is that asking "why did the first cells start to evolve" is completely the wrong question. There is no "why?" to evolution.

This is relevant how to the discussion?

It's no less irrelevant than most of the past few pages to the subject of "do you believe in God?"

 

[shmogt]

"Why" has an application for sure, but until your last few posts you've been using it to ask "why" life began in the first place. There is no answer to that question from a scientific point of view. If you believe in God, sure, you can ask why life exists, but it won't answer any questions in any measurable sense.



Most of my stories are quite positive, actually. Or sarcastic, when I think I can get away with it.

If all the news you see, hear or read is negative then you're getting your news in the wrong places.



No, that's still a how question.

You could absolutely ask "why build a fire?", to which the answer is "to keep you warm", but you cannot ask "why does fire exist?" in the same vein. You could feasibly ask "why does striking two rocks together create a spark?", but then that question is better served by "how" anyway because by asking "how" you're inviting an explanatory response.



You're getting way, way off the topic here.

Once again - as already stated in my previous post - I'm not dismissing the word "why" in its entirety. If it was a useless word it wouldn't exist.

What I'm saying - and have been trying to say for the last two or three pages - is that asking "why did the first cells start to evolve" is completely the wrong question. There is no "why?" to evolution.



It's no less irrelevant than most of the past few pages to the subject of "do you believe in God?"

stop taking all my stuff out of context and just answering certain parts. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Ws This explains when they are all said, none of which are more important than the other.

Asking how a cell was made will tell you a very basic form, asking why goes into whoever made it's thought process into making it etc. Completely disagree that why is not important here. I am not looking for anyone to answer it I just said it is a question that I think is important since it would help solve this HOW we were all made thing.

 

[Exorcet]

That's the whole problem with society is no one ask why anymore. We are taught as kids to listen to what the schools teach, repeat exactly what we leaned by doing test, and than shut our mouths.

Thankfully not at my schools.

 

[dylansan]

I was curious how old you were shmogt because earlier you said something about the Mayans and why their calender didn't end on a nice even number like 2000, which made me think you didn't know the Mayans made their calender before our current system of years even existed. That combined with your posting style and misuse of know/no (which have improved since then) made me wonder if you were younger than you're letting on.

All I can say is do the science, if you want answers. Do the experiments. That's the only way I can fathom you'll understand what we mean by facts, theories, evidence, why, how, etc.

 

[HP]

Thankfully not at my schools.

Nor at my sons, sent him to a Steiner school (best schools in the world IMHO) where they learn enough about a large number of belief systems so they can make an informed choice of what, if anything, to believe.

If there was a god he'd approve of that surely... or would he want the non believing little heathens to go to hell?

 

[Famine]

Famine you have totally ignored what I have been saying. I am supplying information and not debating.

If you're posting complete drivel like "only a theory" and "Science is only one persons view" and presenting them as fact, you are debating.

Yes you could run into a wall because it is only a wall, but you will get hurt.

Just as you could ignore something because it's "only a theory", but it'll still be true...

Theories are not based on facts, but paschal evidence that could prove it to be correct. To than prove it right you run a bunch of experiments and see what works.

Absolute horsecrap.

Theories are explanations of phenomena covering all known facts. You don't get any more true than a theory - even Laws are incorporated in theories.

The scientific method is not "a bunch of experiments" to "prove it right". It's a concerted effort to prove an observed effect to be a chance occurrence and not dependent on a proposed cause. Anyone who sets out to prove themselves right invariably will.

Something like string theory is not fact it's just a bunch of weird things that science has put into the same category and thought of how to use all that knowledge to make large scale theory.

Theories are explanations of phenomena covering all known facts. You don't get any more true than a theory - even Laws are incorporated in theories.

The varying string theories are explanations of a phenomenon that cover all known facts about that phenomenon. As new facts are discovered - high energy particle impactors, such as CERN are at the forefront of this - the theories are refined.


"Only a theory" fundamentally misunderstands what "a theory" is in science. It doesn't get any better than theory.

Incidentally, gravitation is "only a theory" (in fact a couple - Newtonian, Special Relativity amongst them - each of which explain the phenomenon of gravity covering all known facts about it). I presume you're not about to put forward Intelligent Falling as a viable alternative?

 

[homeforsummer]

stop taking all my stuff out of context and just answering certain parts. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Five_Ws This explains when they are all said, none of which are more important than the other.

I'm not taking anything out of context. Unlike you, I'm answering each part of each of your posts individually.

And yes, each W (and the H) has equal importance, but not every question applies to every scenario.

"Who do you create fire?"

See how that works?

Asking how a cell was made will tell you a very basic form, asking why goes into whoever made it's thought process into making it etc.

Nobody "made" its "thought process". I've already told you this several pages back - the answer to "why did cells first appear?" is "because the conditions were right for them to appear". No more, no less. It's a chemical and biological process. "How did cells appear?" is a process you can explain with scientific method.

Completely disagree that why is not important here. I am not looking for anyone to answer it I just said it is a question that I think is important since it would help solve this HOW we were all made thing.

And how does "why" specifically solve how we came into being? What can "why?" possibly add to the discussion unless you're expressly talking from a religious perspective?

If you believe in God, then "why are we here?" is a perfectly reasonable question because if you don't understand the process behind the origins of life then creationism is a natural path to take - even if it's not necessarily correct. But if you know how we came into existence, then the "why?" question immediately becomes irrelevant.

Once you know how the sun rises, why would you need to know why the sun rises? See where I'm going with this?

 

[Danoff]

"Only a theory" fundamentally misunderstands what "a theory" is in science. It doesn't get any better than theory.

Very much this ^. If you catch yourself saying "only a theory" in earnest in this debate, you just failed. I'll reiterate because it's worth reiterating - there is no higher honor in all of science than Theory. Law is not a higher honor.

Laws are observations, theories are explanations for observations. They don't overlap. A Theory will never become a Law, and Laws were never Theories.

 

[Grand Prix]

We really should ask why to everything. People have been asking "why" to everything since the beginning of consciousness most likely. "Why do I exist?" "Why does the Universe exist?" "Why does there need to be a God involved in my existence?" "Why stop asking questions?"

People who submit to God are perfectly fine with the idea of unquestioning faith, but bring up evidence of evolution for example, and they start asking questions of why it happens.

Unfortunately, it doesn't help that some atheists respond to this with something along the lines of "because that is how it works." To do so makes them look no different from the unquestioning believers in God/gods themselves. The answer they should give is: "I don't know (yet)." In effect, an answer that doesn't pretend to know the "true" answer, and still leaves room for questioning "why?" The religious person may decide to answer this question with "God did it." Which then leads to "Why does God need to exist? And why did he do it?", and so on.

Which sums up the debate really. It's just arguing in circles. So if you're going to argue in circles, at least get into the really juicy, philosophical stuff of the nature of God instead of bashing or defending the bible. That stuff is way more interesting IMO.