FIA Race Discussion [Archive]

[DrAug]

I should have done the same and tanked my DR. Qualified 20th to finish 20th in Oceania top split only to get zero points. 2nd split I would have been in the top 5.

At least you've got your pride.

 

[JayOTT]

Up until now, the highest 2nd split we had seems to be 2996 or 2998 points, and more often than not they give 2950+. I am not aware of a 3000+ 2nd split but this could happen.

I had to have a look at the EMEA table myself after this comment and at first thought this was an overstatement. Then I remembered that the first time slot of the season glitched and gave EMEA a low scoring top split, meaning that maatu's 2,987 score from that round had to have come from split two.

I'd like to think that such high scores are fairly rare, but it is worrying that the DR creep over time has resulted in second split yielding points that used to be top split points in EMEA. What seemed like a good solution when I thought about it and put my thoughts into text was ruined by everyone and their mother nearing the DR cap

 

[GT_Alex74]

Nah, 2900+ 2nd splits is the norm. And if it goes below that, that means it's an unpopular combo and top split is also lower than usual.

 

[watto79]

New details for the Manufacturer Season has been announced on the news page, along with a number of changes about the selection for the World Tour (which affects me in no way whatsoever).

As speculated elsewhere Toyota are now an official partner and as such will automatically be represented at all World Tour events, if I've understood it all correctly.

 

[eAxis Patohm]

lol, ist even more worse than you think

3rd Split: 2.750 - 2.800 k Top
4th Split: 2.400 - 2.500 k Top
(at least on saturdays)

We Need a solution to this. The Problem is not the lower splits, but the higher Splits are not rewarded as they should - the max CAP of DR is the Problem... If the System is like IRacing (no cap), it will sort itself out!

I sure see, that PD fight against this with only 1 out of 4 results and endless tries per day, so better Slot is still in front... but this cannot be the solution. Races are not "tense" anymore, stable races are not even a factor… this is baaaad

 

[Achika_Kuonji]

New details for the Manufacturer Season has been announced on the news page, along with a number of changes about the selection for the World Tour (which affects me in no way whatsoever).

As speculated elsewhere Toyota are now an official partner and as such will automatically be represented at all World Tour events, if I've understood it all correctly.

Not only World Tour, but also World Final. So Supra one make series is not Toyota-Driver only but Porsche one make is Porsche-Driver only (in Japan).

 

[LogSwapper]

I don’t like the look of those tire wear-multipliers in the manu races
17x, 19x... 👎

Has to be coincidence that the official partners Toyota and Porsche both have excellent tyre wears.

 

[Hasnain282]

I don’t like the look of those tire wear-multipliers in the manu races
17x, 19x... 👎

In the Nations as well, x25 Mount Panorama, x26 Monza

We get all these ridiculous tyre wear values and then you have x4 in the RB Jr. at Blue Moon Speedway

 

[Espial]

Interesting, it seems they've moved up the Manu schedule up a slot, so that each race day starts with Manu and not with Nations... or have I got the times wrong?

 

[Hasnain282]

Interesting, it seems they've moved up the Manu schedule up a slot, so that each race day starts with Manu and not with Nations... or have I got the times wrong?

Nope it's the same as usual

 

[Famine]

Interesting, it seems they've moved up the Manu schedule up a slot, so that each race day starts with Manu and not with Nations... or have I got the times wrong?

There's something odd going on with the timings in the articles - along with a few other things, like the European Manufacturer Pre-Season article starting off talking about the Nations Cup Stage 2.

The US timings in particular were insane when I checked last - 9am west coast is definitely not right.

 

[HERE4BEER3]

About the points issues, it's almost like PD needs to add a variable in the matchmaking system to take a driver's championship points into account.

You can't prevent people from tanking DR, but if they add some sort of variable then the guys who keep finishing at the top of 2nd split will be moved to the top split regardless of DR. Same goes for the guys who keep finishing at the bottom of the top split. Basically after a certain point in the season, once everyone has a few races in it might not even look at DR anymore and only championship points. We might not get as tight of races but at least the point scoring would be more fair for the fastest 20 drivers.

Might as well throw my idea out there since it seems every suggestion about the game I make ends up going into effect, last race counting for FIA attempts and global manufacturer ranking come to mind

 

[GT_Alex74]

Nah, the simple and obvious solution would be base points for the high tier splits. Haven't thought much about the values, let's say something like top split gets +2000 points, 2nd split gets +1000, 3rd split gets +500...

 

[HERE4BEER3]

Nah, the simple and obvious solution would be base points for the high tier splits. Haven't thought much about the values, let's say something like top split gets +2000 points, 2nd split gets +1000, 3rd split gets +500...

There's that to lol.

PD really should have used the 2 years worth of exhibition seasons to try out different point scoring systems.

 

[HellzFire]

@JayOTT Players are already purposefully tanking their DR in EMEA in order to race in 2nd split, because a podium there scores more than being 7th in a lobby full of world finalists. Some race slots have seen points differences below 100 between top and 2nd split, because top splits are nearly maxed out. Even worse, one disconnect while lobby is loading means top split gives less points than second split, while still being significantly harder. Although so far it didn't pay, some people could definitely take advantage of that in Manufacturers. Nations seems difficult to reach with 2nd split races now, but it's technically still possible. Supra Cup, if the amount of qualified people is the same, could see someone from even 3rd split getting a spot for the final.

Up until now, the highest 2nd split we had seems to be 2996 or 2998 points, and more often than not they give 2950+. I am not aware of a 3000+ 2nd split but this could happen. Meanwhile, the highest score for top splits (excluding the Top 16) is 3105 points, while your average top split win seems to be around 3050 so far. According to our calculations, theorical max points in a regular lobby would be 3125 points, and 3250 in a Top 16 with the 30% bonus (this is an estimation though, in reality that might be a bit higher as the formula doesn't seem linear, we suspect there's some kind of coefficient, but I'd be extremely surprised if those values exceeded 3150 and 3280).

Another issue is that scores are going to be stupidly close at the end of the whole season. Current standings at the top are already extremely tight - we're talking about less than 10 points gaps in the top 10 (top 2 FR are separated by only 3 points), and this will only get tighter. There might even be some ties, and the line between qualifying and not qualifying will probably be single digit points. In other words, someone might not go to a world tour or world finals because an usual "backmarker" didn't enter a time slot and was replaced by someone with lower DR. When the drivers limit for countries like UK, France or Italy is 2 and might get to 1 for the finals, this is a problem.

When you see people racing in top splits on a regular basis being out of top 100 in the standings, that means something is not working out. Actually, if the Nurburgring World Tour qualifications are what I've been told for Manufacturers, then the overall winner of Asia (Akagi, aka Kokubun) won't be qualified because someone in another region got lower points than 4th splitters while racing in top splits (yeah that's me, having less points from top splits than a friend who just broke the A+ barrier and finishes 20+ seconds behind me in practice).

Theorically, this can be fixed so easily with multipliers. Top tier gets a 1.5x, 2nd tier a 1.3, 3rd tier 1.1x, and so on. Don't know if it is possible to do it on their algorithm

or base points too

In other words, the official twitter from Gran Turismo retweeted my race!

 

[watto79]

I just logged in and the game will now force you to choose a manufacturer before you can do any round 1 practice. So that's something. Just need to make a decision.
Stick with Ford?
Move to Porsche and have a more competitive car but no chance of being near the top for them?
Something else?

 

[GT_Alex74]

Multipliers can work as well, but would rely more on not having a DR cap. Ideally PoDi would want to do a sensible thing and use the data from stage 1 to simulate how the different systems would work.

 

[Jomas]

Theorically, this can be fixed so easily with multipliers. Top tier gets a 1.5x, 2nd tier a 1.3, 3rd tier 1.1x, and so on. Don't know if it is possible to do it on their algorithm

Multipliers, yes and no because the point system will always give 0pt to the last, and that's a bit harsh considering how the top split is, and the gaps between position will be increased as well. Base points seems to be better on paper, not something OP obviously but even if you finish last, you're rewarded by something because you're in a high split and still get decent points for a Top 8. Anyway, there's until 2020 to find a solution, it's too late now.

 

[GT_Alex74]

@Jomas your avatar picture has a severe lack of béret and baguette.

 

[mthomas_95]

Best solution (in EMEA at least) would be to basically have a Top 20 race for every timeslot, so they can add 1000 base points to it. No country/manufacturer limits, based on DR as normal.

It'd be a bit of a pain for everyone else at first mind but most would adjust to a 10 minute later lobby whilst only a few guys on the edge of top split would fail to enter.

 

[zocker_16]

Some races are just frustrating...
Yesterday I had my best qualifying lap of the season ( 1:50.338 ) giving me a good 5. position on the grid in a strong 2400 points lobby.
Usually my qualifying pace is worse than my speed in training or the race. The races before I started between 10-16th and finished about 5-7 places better in the end. This time i hoped for the podium and 2000+ points. But only half a lap later the dream was destroyed...
I don´t know if there was a possibility for me to avoid this crash. The corner is tricky and even i managed to avoid the spinning car in front there was simply not enough road left on the left side.
Similar situation with the second incident.
It seems there's no way for me to break my streak of bad luck this season...

 

[Venster]

it would help if your DR was separate between fia and daily’s, at the moment if you have a few bad fia results you just go to the daily’s to top it back up to get back to the split you’re in. If it’s separate you would naturally move up and down and be in the split you are meant to be in.

Plus the fact if a second split race is worth 2.9k points that’s not exactly a walk over and an easy win, that’s still a very strong lobby. It’s not like the the one who comes first in a second split would automatically be last in top split, there is an overlap.

I agree that it isn’t great to score zero in a top split or fair, but equally imo someone who wins a second split with that high points probably would do well in top split.

 

[sundaydriving]

All FIA lobbies should have base points based upon the field you're racing against. This not just a top split problem its a problem all the way down from A+ to E.

All this was debated last year. The only reason it doesn't matter so much this year is that they've dropped the regional finals. What was a selection of 30 is now down to 10 or thereabouts depending on region.

You're just not getting to the world final this year without winning some of the top split races in nations.

Some races are just frustrating...
Yesterday I had my best qualifying lap of the season ( 1:50.338 ) giving me a good 5. position on the grid in a strong 2400 points lobby.
Usually my qualifying pace is worse than my speed in training or the race. The races before I started between 10-16th and finished about 5-7 places better in the end. This time i hoped for the podium and 2000+ points. But only half a lap later the dream was destroyed...
I don´t know if there was a possibility for me to avoid this crash. The corner is tricky and even i managed to avoid the spinning car in front there was simply not enough road left on the left side.
Similar situation with the second incident.
It seems there's no way for me to break my streak of bad luck this season...

A: Doomed. That track with those cars. Taking avoiding action is almost impossible.

 

[GT_Alex74]

it would help if your DR was separate between fia and daily’s, at the moment if you have a few bad fia results you just go to the daily’s to top it back up to get back to the split you’re in. If it’s separate you would naturally move up and down and be in the split you are meant to be in.

Plus the fact if a second split race is worth 2.9k points that’s not exactly a walk over and an easy win, that’s still a very strong lobby. It’s not like the the one who comes first in a second split would automatically be last in top split, there is an overlap.

I agree that it isn’t great to score zero in a top split or fair, but equally imo someone who wins a second split with that high points probably would do well in top split.

While there is an overlap, it is not as big as you think. Top 1 in 2nd split generally would end up midpack in top split. This is only considering his total race time starting from pole and avoiding battles. Top split level is just completely nuts at the moment, some races top split was so close that pole in 2nd split would have been 15th or lower. Which doesn't mean 2nd split are weak lobbies, they are indeed quite strong as well, but there's still a group of people for who a podium in 2nd split is nearly guaranteed.

 

[Venster]

I think bigger lobby’s would help too, 20 is potentially too small as it condenses the top too much. If you had 30 car lobby’s the top in split 2 would be in top split then. And the second split DR would be overall less DR which would reduce the points and potentially stop so much benefit of tanking your DR to be in second split.

Although I understand the potential technical limitations of achieving that.

 

[GT_Alex74]

Yeah, 30 spots on the grid would be perfect, that's what I thought as well. But we know that's not going to happen in GTS.

 

[DrAug]

Some races are just frustrating...
Yesterday I had my best qualifying lap of the season ( 1:50.338 ) giving me a good 5. position on the grid in a strong 2400 points lobby.
Usually my qualifying pace is worse than my speed in training or the race. The races before I started between 10-16th and finished about 5-7 places better in the end. This time i hoped for the podium and 2000+ points. But only half a lap later the dream was destroyed...
I don´t know if there was a possibility for me to avoid this crash. The corner is tricky and even i managed to avoid the spinning car in front there was simply not enough road left on the left side.
Similar situation with the second incident.
It seems there's no way for me to break my streak of bad luck this season...

You obviously tried your Best to avoid as you landed in the wall, however this one seemed unavoidable

 

[HellzFire]

They could race with 24. The game can handle it well enough, at least it did on the RIP top 24 races. The problem were the disconnections, which it does seem it has improved.

 

[Venster]

Yeah, 30 spots on the grid would be perfect, that's what I thought as well. But we know that's not going to happen in GTS.

They could race with 24. The game can handle it well enough, at least it did on the RIP top 24 races. The problem were the disconnections, which it does seem it has improved.

Yeah even 24 would be an improvement, 30 would be great. Would help the whole system and let’s be honest the more cars on track the better imo

 

[GT_Alex74]

Well, then they would need to fix the rolling starts and have the cars much closer together (and ideally two lane rolling starts). That's another subject though.