FIA Race Discussion [Archive]

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Well, the good news is that I now have 2 wins in the Manufacturer Series this season. Last Wednesday at DT Gardens, and yesterday at Interlagos.

The bad news is that each of those wins was in a B/S lobby, so I didn't get a ridiculous amount of points. Either way, wins are wins and I'm pretty happy with my performances. At Interlagos I started on pole, had fastest lap, and a clean race....triple star. Not bad for the Lancer, which I'm good with but not my strongest car in Brazil. Even though it was a B/S lobby, I was at SR.99 so there were some pretty fast guys in there, Interlagos is just one of my best tracks. I actually pulled off a 132.0 in qualy.

I was also able to finish 2nd yesterday in the Nations Cup at Maggiore in the Megane, so I'm pretty happy with that result too. One of these days I'll get setup to post replays on here.

After my DR reset last week I've managed to have a lot of really good, clean races and have pulled my DR back up to almost 30k. One or two races tonight at DT Seaside and I should be DR.A again.
 
ZokyCRO
I am currently a resident of 2 countries and can race on both accounts if I wish to untill final season that starts in August.
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I would be willing to say that this probably would not be true or a correct interpretation of the rules or the signed competition agreement which is currently in force governing the championships.

To keep the entries and the chances equal as to the competition and number of chances to qualify for all competing even multiple entries from different regions I am sure would be deemed breaking the rules of the competition agreement and championship rules resulting in being disqualified.

If both countries which you say allow you to be legally eligible to race with 2 entries are within the SAME competition region then not only are you doubling your chance of actually qualifying for the finals in the championship over other racers vying for a spot in the finals which in itself I am sure would not be allowed in the sense of fairness and equal opportunity for all entered in the competition.

Then you have an issue that the Championship even remotely allowing any chance of an opportunity of a competitor using the second account racing in the same championship, in the same region trying to secure one of the limited slots in the actual finals uses that second account to affect the finishing position or points awarded to another top racer which may cost that racer the finals spot and award such spot to the racers first account in the championship would never be allowed as such actions could taint the actual fairness and legitimacy of the entire competition.

I do not believe that either PD or the FIA would allow something of such a nature to possibly have the entire event questioned as to the results being equal and fair among all competitors.

In my opinion by the rules as I interpret them you have already disqualified yourself from the championship for multiple entries period.

Further again just my opinion if PD and the FIA examined the footage of the second account that was seen on this thread of you appearing to intentionally crash into and take out another top competitor within the same region that you are vying for a finals spot and perhaps even a finals win to lower that competitors finishing spot and accumulation of points which could affect that competitor for the finals then a much more severe penalty should be forthcoming including the possibility of a lifetime competition ban for any future Gran Turismo tournaments.

I think most people participating and following the rules of the competition would tend to agree with my assessment of what has already transpired where you are concerned in this competition.

Using two accounts for the same competition is nothing but a form of cheating no matter how you attempt to slice it.
 
Matty28
The people using multiple accounts in the same championship are giving themselves multiple chances at getting S rank and later multiple chances of qualifying. One of those accounts shouldn't be there regardless of eligibility, so if it's involved in say, punting people off then it's changing results it shouldn't have. In fact it's changing results even by just being there.

The people using multiple accounts (1 in manufacturers and 1 in nations) are probably trying to get S rank on two accounts so they have a choice between manufacturers later while others do not.

In both cases they may become eligible.

Yes same rules for everyone. I know of another guy who I think was at the N24 doing it too.
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That is a rather twisted way of interpreting the rules... I don't like it, but it's legal :boggled:
 
Matty28
The people using multiple accounts (1 in manufacturers and 1 in nations) are probably trying to get S rank on two accounts so they have a choice between manufacturers later while others do not.
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Plus (because both nations and manufacturer cup races run on the same day) if you screw up for example nations race in 7pm and your SR drops heavy, you can enter manufacturers race at 8:10pm with "clean" 2nd account and top split again.
While having single account you would have to grind back to SR99 in daily race (takes alot of time) if you want to make manufacturers race top split again and my guess is you still wouldnt make it.
 
ivann
Plus (because both nations and manufacturer cup races run on the same day) if you screw up for example nations race in 7pm and your SR drops heavy, you can enter manufacturers race at 8:10pm with "clean" 2nd account and top split again.
While having single account you would have to grind back to SR99 in daily race (takes alot of time) if you want to make manufacturers race top split again and my guess is you still wouldnt make it.
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I agree that although I do not like this way of tip toeing the line since the Championships are separate and each has their own competiton agreement independent of the other then there is nothing illegal or against the rules by doing it.

Actually I would say that if the information used to have created any of the accounts used was not factual and correct could be the only thing that may make an account be in violation of using that account to enter any competition regardless of whether it was not in violation of any other rules.

One thing that could be done in the future as far as using such a tactic to delay choosing a manufacturer to race with early in the contest is to have the actual registration and entry deadline for the competition to close before the actual first race of the event.

That would eliminate that as reasoning to delay entry.
 
Matty28
You register and agree to one entry before taking part in any championships, so as far as I'm concerned it's one account can enter in both championships.
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But since the championships are separate and independent of each other currently, each with their own individual competition agreement as long as you do not violate and run any championship with 2 entries in the SAME championship you have not broken any rules.

The only way PD could change that is make it against the rules of the games usage OVERALL for any one individual to have or log into the game on more than one account.

Otherwise what account you choose to use to log into an individual championship is separate and apart from what account you may use on a completely separate championship with its own competition agreement.
 
Alpha Cipher
What you said. Technically, the said player only does one entry per race, albeit on different accounts. They won't be breaking any rules, but it's ugly
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Yeah but some are doing the same championship on both accounts. So using two accounts and doing one championship on each is still a bit sketchy for the reasons already outlined, but as you say probably falls within the permissible grey area; but where we've seen one driver doing the same race twice on different accounts - can't see an argument for that being "legal".

It is pretty :censored:y and clearly flies against the spirit of the competition and rules however it's tried to be justified.
Sport mode is supposed to be a representation of a competitor's driving; you take the rough with the smooth.

If you're using several accounts you just always take the smooth and that isn't very sporting, in my opinion.
 
@Matty28, can you please upload a replay of the incident with Zoky in last DTG corner from your perspective?

Its bugging me that you didnt uploaded it immediatly (as I would) to prove your words, after Zoky uploaded replay from his perspective.

Matty28: ↑
When someone is fully alongside/ahead you're supposed to give them a cars width lol
ivann: ↑
That rule applies for the braking zone only, otherwise car infront has full right to the racing line and the car behind must avoid contact at any cost.
Majority of drivers in GT Sport do not obey this rule and thats why every race is like armaggedon.
Matty28: ↑
We're talking about cars being side by side though. You can only legitimately use all the track if you are ahead. "Ahead" is a bit of a grey area and isn't defined in FIA rules but seems to generally be if the nose of the car behind is less than half way up the car in front. If I was not alongside by that much it would be my fault.
ivann: ↑
He clearly stays 2nd for the whole time as you can see on the leaderboard.
Matty28: ↑
You can visually see I was fully alongside, a game is always going to be a bit wonky determining a live position.

I think we need to see the incident from both perspectives so we can resolve it fairly once and for all,
otherwise same things will happen in following seasons and as @adstomko says,
it will create further frictions and accusasions between players in community.
(just dont say you dont have the replay)
 
The rules are not clear regarding eligibility for people with dual citizenship and/or multiple residences. I think it depends on what kind of identification they require: passport or ID. In my case I am a US citizen with legal residence in the US and also with legal residence in Argentina. I race with my US account. I have a US passport but no US ID card with my address. I don't have an Argentine passport but I do have an Argentine ID card with my address. If I had to show my passport for the finals I would be fine. If I had to show a US ID for the finals I would be in trouble. I don't have an Argentine PSN account, but if I did, again, would I have to show an Argentine passport or an Argentine ID to get to the finals? If the former I would be screwed. If the latter I would be OK.

Then take my daughters: dual citizens with both passports but only Argentine ID cards. They don't play GTS and are too young, anyway, but I am sure there are lots of people in this situation.

PD needs to clear this up and put in black and white exactly what citizenship/residence/ID requirements are in place.
 
It's not just Zoky doing it, it's multiple people doing it and the bigger issue to me is that some people will miss out on S rating because of it, which given the way the championships are set up is pretty unfair on them as they may not have a chance then to compete to make the world finals...

The only reason I'm not running 2 accounts is because of the above (Otherwise 1 would be running the Nissan competition) and I suspect GT are going to look into multiple account use, although no idea how they can deal with it properly.. For example how do they know;

GTP_Tidgney
GTA_Tidgney
Tidgney

Are all the same people? Even if they are at the same house using the same Playstation they could all be different people. It's pretty obvious that example would be me (Don't worry I haven't touched my other accounts) but for example there's a TRL_Lightning and an OvrD_Lightning (Or something like that), they are 2 different people. Imagine if they used the same Playstation and were in the same house how would Sony know? In the past I assume Ti-tech and his brother (Not sure if that needs to be plural) were all in the same house (Could be wrong), how do they know which account (All of them were) would be the legit account. It's a hard one..

To be honest if you run 2 accounts just for pure greed there should be serious consequences, Zokys situation is different to be honest and the rules haven't helped make it clear. In reality the rules should be set in stone before starting but it feels like they rushed to get season 1 started (It was a week late) and then try to finalise some things after. In the end 2 accounts for pure greed should be disqualification it also shows your true character as well, 2 accounts due to rules being unclear is very different in my mind.
 
ivann
@Matty28, can you please upload a replay of the incident with Zoky in last DTG corner from your perspective?

Its bugging me that you didnt uploaded it immediatly (as I would) to prove your words, after Zoky uploaded replay from his perspective.

Matty28: ↑
When someone is fully alongside/ahead you're supposed to give them a cars width lol
ivann: ↑
That rule applies for the braking zone only, otherwise car infront has full right to the racing line and the car behind must avoid contact at any cost.
Majority of drivers in GT Sport do not obey this rule and thats why every race is like armaggedon.
Matty28: ↑
We're talking about cars being side by side though. You can only legitimately use all the track if you are ahead. "Ahead" is a bit of a grey area and isn't defined in FIA rules but seems to generally be if the nose of the car behind is less than half way up the car in front. If I was not alongside by that much it would be my fault.
ivann: ↑
He clearly stays 2nd for the whole time as you can see on the leaderboard.
Matty28: ↑
You can visually see I was fully alongside, a game is always going to be a bit wonky determining a live position.

I think we need to see the incident from both perspectives so we can resolve it fairly once and for all,
otherwise same things will happen in following seasons and as @adstomko says,
it will create further frictions and accusasions between players in community.
(just dont say you dont have the replay)
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Could press the triangle on the ds4 on the saved replay and share to all on the Ps4.

Add a keyword and let everyone know on here and everyone can then see from every angle on any car in the race.
 
VFOURMAX1
But since the championships are separate and independent of each other currently, each with their own individual competition agreement as long as you do not violate and run any championship with 2 entries in the SAME championship you have not broken any rules.
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Can you link that individual competition agreements?
I think that both Nations cup and Manufacturer series are part of "FIA Gran Turismo championship" and regulated by it together. 1 acc for both cups as matty said.
 
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"6. Each Entrant may only submit one (1) entry and will only be eligible to win one (1) Prize as applicable (as defined below)."

"18. If there is any reason to believe that there has been a breach of these Terms or incorrect, illegible, fraudulent or other invalid or improper information has been provided, the Promoter may in its sole discretion refuse to process an entry or fulfill any Prize awarded. If an Entrant fails to comply with clauses 3, 5, 6, 9, and/or Schedule 1 or uses multiple accounts and/or any automated system to enter, they will be excluded from the Competition and their entry will be declared void."

https://www.playstation.com/en-au/legal/fia-gran-turismo-championships-2018-competition/


I'm no lawyer.
But my advise would be to use a single PSN account that has all the correct details.
 
VFOURMAX1
But since the championships are separate and independent of each other currently, each with their own individual competition agreement as long as you do not violate and run any championship with 2 entries in the SAME championship you have not broken any rules.

The only way PD could change that is make it against the rules of the games usage OVERALL for any one individual to have or log into the game on more than one account.

Otherwise what account you choose to use to log into an individual championship is separate and apart from what account you may use on a completely separate championship with its own competition agreement.
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Where does it say they are separate? My understanding is:
Sign up for FIA Gran Turismo 2018 season with one account
Get access to 2 championships

I guess it's another thing they can be more clear on but the fact you sign up before entering either championship suggests you get one entry for both. The fact two accounts as I said allows you to have two choices of manufacturer is a clear unfair advantage and I highly doubt PD intended to allow a some to have two manufacturers while some are stuck with one.

@ivann I never have any replays because of the dumb replay limit. I did record it from my view though. I'll upload my view and also the two times he made the same apparently totally unacceptable move on me twice and I gave him space both times.
 
Alpha Cipher
You can name drop, as long as it's on a screenshot or a video. Famine explained before that the reason behind this is that if the said player searches up their name and you typed it, the post has a possibility of being turned up at Google's search engine, and could make things complicated.
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There are multiple posts with player´s name being typed, in a "name and shame" manner. Thats why I ask moderator.
And when I named and shamed player a while ago, I didnt put "@" infront if that could be the reason.
 
_ApexPredator
Yeah but some are doing the same championship on both accounts.
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Anyone that is doing the same championship on more than one account is for sure breaking the rules and should be immediately banned from the championship and possibly face further future disciplinary action concerning future GT competitions up to a lifetime ban from such.

ivann
Can you link that individual competition agreements?
I think that both Nations cup and Manufacturer series are part of "FIA Sport mode championship" and regulated by it together. 1 acc for both championships as matty said
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I cannot provide a link. I am not racing in either championship but I did sign up for both. I seem to think that when I signed foe each individual championship that their was a competition agreement acceptance involved. Not one agreement that covered both championships.

It is possible I am mistaken on that or how I have interpreted that.

But since the competitions are completely separate and if you only enter each championship one time as a competitor even if it is on separate accounts I cannot see where any conflict would actually occur as far as the individual championship itself was concerned or the possible finishing position that could be obtained as a result..

As far as SR rating advantage there would be no advantage from that that would be different if you only entered one of the championships instead of both as you fully have that right to do.

So if the account information was verifiable correct and I cannot see where you would actually be violating either individual championship as it is not against the games rules to have more than 1 account.
 
Also these second accounts can affect the result someone achieves in a race Which can have a much bigger impact on their points. Plus second accounts could have an impact on which manufacturers qualify for the live event.

Whether it’s in the rules or not, it’s still completely unfair and not really respectful to everyone else who are following the rules.
 
VFOURMAX1
As far as SR rating advantage there would be no advantage from that that would be different if you only entered one of the championships instead of both as you fully have that right to do.
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Yes, there is SR advantage.

-2 accounts, both SR99 (1st for nations, 2nd for manufacturers):
You drive 1st slot nations race with 1st account and have a terrible race and by consequence you drop to SR50.
You switch to 2nd account and drive next slot of manufacturers cup top split with SR99.
You have 3-4 days to bring back 1st account to SR99.

-1 account SR99 (for both cups)
You drive 1st slot nations cup and have a terrible race and by consequence you drop to SR50.
You can drive next slot of manufacturers cup with SR50, or grind daily race for maximum of 3 hours to get back to your SR99.
If you succeed (it is very hard, trust me), only then you can enter last slot of manufacturers cup (which usually isnt top split).
 
@Pfei I am in a very similiar situation and feel your pain, I guees we will know the results in the next few days. As passport is not a legal proof of residency I think you will need to provide a proof of address,but to be honest I am pretty sure PD has no idea what are they doing so...

@Tidgney You also forgot to mention that someone could easily give his account data to someone else that is faster to get him through, hence even pay for that... do we need to remind ourselve of SMS-R champ and what a charade that was? The whole situation with sony and their politics about accounts makes me want to puke, not to mention that I have to drive on the team account of which I am not a member anymore.

iRacing has sorted that straight away.
 
ivann
Yes, there is SR advantage.
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To answer this no if a driver only ran in one championship and not the other the SR would never be affected by the other championship.

By your definition someone that chooses to only race in one championship even with just one account and does not race in the other championship gains a possible clear advantage over a driver that races in both competitions.

I do not think you can count that as a person with one account only could easily possess that same advantage.

Meanwhile on to other things.


There is verbiage that definitely raises questions as to the legality within the contest rules of any single competitor using more than one account for entrance.

Also the question does remain and in my opinion is not answered beyond a shadow of a doubt whether because of the multiple references that without doubt state the contest are independent of each other.

That to me raises the question if separate single account entries that only raced one championship on each account with no multiple championship entries and each account was based off of factual verifiable information making the account legitimate in that respect may be a grey area that would slip through a loophole in the wording.

The wording below states an entrant to complete the registration and also states that you can race in either championship or both at your discretion.
If you only completed in one different championship on 2 separate profiles and your info was correct on both profiles used would it actually be in breach of the rules, you are not using multiple profiles to gain an advantage in the championship for that profile.

Having multiple profiles used to log in to the GTS game appears to be legal so as long as the actual competition rules are not being violated I think a question to the legality depends on interpretation and is not cut and dried.

The last sentence in this post will take care of it however PD and the FIA sees fit though!

In order to enter the Competition, Entrants must complete the GT Sport Mode registration form which shall be presented to Entrants who select ‘GT Sport Mode’ within the Game during the Competition Period.

Throughout the Online Series, Entrants may participate in the Nations Cup only, the Manufacturers Series only, or both the Nations Cup and the Manufacturers Series concurrently





Each Entrant may only submit one (1) entry and will only be eligible to win one (1) Prize

The following two championships will be hosted for the FIA Gran Turismo Championship 2018

FIA GT Championship Nations Cup (hereafter referred to as the “Nations Cup”):

FIA GT Championship Manufacturer Series (hereafter referred to as the “Manufacturer Series”):


In order to claim the Gran Turismo™ Championships World Final (as defined in clause 10(a)) element of the Prize (as defined below), each Winner must respond appropriately to the Promoter’s notification email within two (2) weeks from the date of the Promoter’s notification email, and provide their full name, and date of birth. The postal address provided must match any postal address provided at the time of entry, or a Winner may be disqualified.

Each Manufacturer Series Finalist and Nations Cup World Finalist will win:

(a) an invitation to attend and participate in the “Gran Turismo™ Championships World Final” which is a live event during which the 2018 Nations Cup World Final and the 2018 Manufacturer Series World Final shall take place;

The ten (10) Regional Finalists with the ten highest scores from all of the applicable Asia/Pacific Nations Cup Regional Final races (each a “Nations Cup World Finalists”) shall proceed to the Nations Cup World Final. The Nations Cup World Final shall take place as a separate competition during the Gran Turismo™ Championships World Final which is expected to take place in November 2018.

In the event of a dispute, the Promoter’s decision is final and no correspondence or discussion will be entered into.
 
Slentom
Not been here for a while but I just wanted to share you probably one of my best races yesterday on the Nations Cup, after a lot of disappointing races, I finally managed to exploit all of my capacities during a race !
Great battle against @Giorgio_57 during the whole race !



Enjoy :p
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Nice race mate!! I had to save fuel in the last two laps so I couldn't try to defend from your attack, well done 👍 ;)

Here's my manufacturer cup race where I had nice battles with @TRL LIGHTNING and @Fuvaros! enjoy

 
Tassie_tiger
I love how people with dual citizenship are all confused as if it's some sort of disadvantage.
Newsflash: it isn't.

Pick a PSN account and drive.
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Please point out where anyone said it was a disadvantage.
 
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