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Discussion in 'GT6 Tuning' started by Bowtie-muscle, Oct 29, 2014.
Well... that is almost depressing.
@DolHaus thanks for testing. I'm not suprise for what you said excess weight made it more vulnerable in the outputs of the corners but corregivel .segui his advice decreasing weight, now 920 Kg and I can say that I am very pleased at the 1st lap was 1: 19,495, thanks for the tip ja'll correct my tunings.
Bowtie-muscle so everything that involves tuners and testers these events are generally fantastic. 3 tested my car 3 correct observations then follow your recommendations al this the result 1: 19,495 .very thank congratulate
If you could update this post to show your tune it would make things easier, as far as I am concerned your tune is in on time.......and yes carbon shaft had to be installed.
As of now, testing for the Roadster Class is now Closed, Tuning for the Pro Touring Class is now also Closed.
Still 1 week left to test the Street Class and testing now begins on Pro Touring.
@DolHaus, yeah, my tune was not as good as I thought. Ran out of time to get it where I wanted but it was close. When I got back and retested it, I knew it was a bit off but did not think it was too bad so I just went with it. Should still be a top 5 tune.........maybe. Thanks for the review
@Ridox2JZGTE , side to side weight transfer. Rear would wag it's tail for me, not bad but.....Took me a bit to get used to it, not bad tune though for mostly stock heavy weight with that much power.
Too much extension damping and too little compression made the car shift weight and react quickly but not generate much grip leading to the skating feeling, the car never really settled. I drove it as cleanly as I could but there's not a lot of feeling to the car, makes it hard to keep it balanced and theres only so much throttle modulation you can get on a ds3.
Oops, I'll need to add the carbon driveshaft to my tune, didn't see it in the parts list
Actually, that's my bad , it is not listed but should be. How could I have missed that one?
I was going to ask earlier in the contest but forgot, easy fix though
@787bcgr - XKR-S
Bowtie-muscle - XKR-S
@DolHaus - XKR-S
@Motor City Hami - DB9
@Otaliema - XKR-S
@shaunm80 - DB9 Coupe
@sinof1337 - XKR-S
@xande1959 - DB9
Sorry guys, it seems I forgot to list the Carbon Driveshaft in mandatory parts. I will update the post and since all known testers are on the list, please test the tunes with. If you have begun testing, again I apologize for the oops, should not make a huge difference but I tuned mine with and we need to be fair.
Seems I put one on out of habit lol.
I intentionally tweaked the damper that way to make it sharper and responsive to reflect what I got from Lotus owners at their forum, I might have gone overboard as I tried to reduce weight shift with higher grip tires. When I tested it, I didn't have any issues with skating feeling, please have a look at my replay to know what I mean ( I actually a bit aggressive with the throttle ) - not a single rear wheel spin. It might also be the DS3
Distinct probability! the brake and throttle are not nearly as smooth as they are on a wheel. I need to check with i2 but the replays I have loaded show several things funny with the throttle, like it's unwillingness to stay at 100% Not sure if this is a GUI glitch or not, but the throttle indactor on the screen shows full throttle when I have my throttle presses at just over 50% same with the brakes. But this is only under driving, when at a standing start line it's smooth and uses the entire button movement.
I will update it after I get a few more cars tested for the street class. Kids are sleeping still and I'm not sure for hwo much longer so want to get as many done as I can.
What are you disagreeing about here and what would you like me to do about it?
I've run the car, my times are comparable with others and I've explained how it felt to me. If you would like me to run it again then I will but I don't think the car is going to go faster or feel any better.
Sorry if I offended you, I didn't ask for any more test drive nor it is about lap times. It's just a totally different experience to what I have that makes me curious, when you are saying the car has numb brakes, skating feeling and spin the rear easily ( none of which I en. I asked for watching the replay just so that you can see how the car was driven when I tested it ( brakes were more than enough, and no rear wheel spin ). For now, I only guess that we have totally different driving style Getting different feedback form several people sometimes can be confusing I'm going to use the feedback to fine tune the actual stock car replica suspension to reflect what real owners said and GT6 drivers. Need to balance the sharpness, neutral handling, and body roll.
@DolHaus what paint color is your Jag?
I didn't feel like the setup was adequate for the low grip tyres, there just wasn't enough transfer of weight over the tyres to make them grip. It reacted very quickly to steering input but never found grip, the brakes slowed the car but didn't transfer enough load to the front end, again reducing available grip. It was sort of like driving on a frozen pond, rotation was fast and easy but very little grip to use once facing the direction you wanted.
I don't really have a fixed driving style when testing, my natural driving style is aggressive but I will adjust to suit the car, I can enter corners backwards in a cloud of smoke and launch it out the other side or I can tip-toe with my inputs and be silky smooth if that's what the car needs. I only have 10-15 laps to get the best out of the car though, there's only so much learning I can do in a short period and if the car isn't giving me much feedback then it makes the process even harder.
I would recommend that you do some testing of the other cars so you can feel the differences for yourself, its easy to fall into the trap of thinking that your way of adjusting a tune is the be all and end all but then you drive someone else's and it feels completely different and better, thats the moment where you've got to start assessing whether your way is best or whether its time to up your game.
Err.... one of the GT colour shift's, can't remember which number, looks much more green/purple in the paint shop
Test Driving results for the FITT British Invasion hosted by @Bowtie-muscle Driven at Autmn Ring Reverse
All cars received 5 Laps warm up and learning. All cars then driven for 5 Laps or till I got all I could from the car on the majority of the track. Which ever came second.
Track and driving aids. Grip= Real, ABS=1 all other driving aids off that impact handling.
DC scoring is as follows. Stock suspension & LSD with power and weight upgrades. (3 Stock Laps max to get a feel on it)
1-4 worse than stock and why.
5 as good as stock.
6-7 better than stock but….
8-9 Great tune.
10 WOW one of the best I’ve had the privilege of driving n GT6
@787bcgr - Tuscan Speed 6 No aero
Stock Lap;1:26.179 Lap Time;1:26.324 DC; 7.4
Entry; Precision is the name of the game here, miss your mark by even a little bit in anyway and your toast. French toast. -_- Get it right and it’s magic, it just glides like it’s nothing.
Mid Corner; Throttle driven here, if you try and coast it you will understeer like a mad man, too much throttle and you spin it. Precision required. Get the throttle application just right and rotates wonderfully.
Exit; If I was in any condition other than straight I would fish tail I lost more than one lap in the chicane section from sudden over rotation in between the turns. Little softer tail or less on the LSD accel setting would have helped this a lot.
Overall impression; Over all this is a high very high skill tune, I could feel and tell the car was not happy with my moderate driving skills and it wanted to go faster. The 4 gear transmission settings where a brilliant move, it gave the car the highest top speed of any car in the group. But this came at cost of earlier braking and harder to control it out of the turns. Despite the tuned lap being slower than the stock lap I could tell this car was far better than stock settings I just couldn’t drive it.
@Bowtie-muscle - Espirit V8 '02 front aero
Stock Lap;1:27.855 Lap Time;1:25.228 DC; 8.0
Entry; Stable but stiff is the way I would put it for taking this car into a turn, it resposed very well, and carved out the turns like a knife through butter, but it was not nice if I came in hotter than the car wanted and I would slide through the apex like I had grease on the wheels.
Mid Corner; Get my throttle point right and it just zipped through the turns like nobodys business, miss my throttle point and I would under or over steer, Thankfully the lift rotation would save me on the understeer and stability offered by the car saved me in the oversteer situations.
Exit; easy does it, lots of the throttle control needed here, get it right and it’s a thing of beauty, get it wrong and you’re likely looking at the turn you just left.
Overall impression; This car reminded me of my Type 72, toss it hard give some gas and hang on, get it right and the turns mean nothing to this car, get it wrong and you’re mowing the lawn. Great fun sir.
@DaBomm4 - Tuscan Speed 6 No aero
Stock Lap;1:27.549 Lap Time;1:25.594 DC; 8.5
Entry; Slide a rific! this car loved to slide an entry as much as stick them. Once I got the entry speed dow for each time of corner this it was a fast set up.
Mid Corner; Throttle induce understeer and Lift off rotation, used in conjuction would get me through any corner in short order.
Exit; As long as I was a gear higher than I thought I should have been it stuck the exit and got out fast, if I was in the “correct” gear for exit it would spin and fish like a mad man.
Overall impression; Good fun tune to drive around. It would slide when asked and stick when needed. Well balanced and good acceleration, a touch longer the final gear to get some more speed and little less wheel spin would make this a great car. To toss around.
@demonchilde - Espirit V8 '02 front aero
Stock Lap;1:28.232 Lap Time;1:25.041 DC; 7.1
Entry; Grip? What’s grip? is what the outside front said in every turn, it was either sliding or skidding in every turn, once I learned to accommodate this I started to get faster, Rotation I noticed was either too fast or too slow at entry and this lead to issues in mid see below.
Mid Corner; Due to the lack of grip and rotation issues at entry mid was always a bit odd, I was sliding through the turn using the throttle to keep my tail in check or I was off the throttle trying to get some lift off rotation to get me through a turn. Grip was good here once the outside front got it’s grip back it would hold any line that I was one good or bad. It would loose a bit of grip if I jumped on the throttle too soon and start to over rotate.
Exit; As long as I didn’t jump on the throttle at or just after the apex grip here was very good, Never had issues that happened at the exit of a turn that didn’t start in mid or entry.
Overall impression; Good tune, little unstable and the low entry grip forced me to slow more than desired to take the turn thus costing me time, once I got used to how to slide the car around the turns it got decently quick, weight transfer was the biggest issue here it was either transferring too much or not enough. If it was a low speed it was over loaded, if it was a high speed it wasn’t getting enough. I think the ballast location was the problem move it back and would help this a lot.
@DolHaus - Espirit V8 '02 front aero
Stock Lap;1:27.179 Lap Time;1:25.124 DC; 6.2
Entry; Excellent entry rotation, brakes felt weak but did the job in the same distance as the rest without the ABS screaming at me. As soon as I started to transition to mid corner it almost always started falling apart for me if I was pushing to get a good lap time.
Mid Corner; The weight transfer on the car was the culprit here, like my Type 72 it was hard to manage, if I did it right it was fantasticly fast through the midsection of a turn, but more often than not I lost it at some point during the turn.
Exit; The high RPM turbo really made exit hard, Lots of torque on a squirly car meant lots of wheel spin. Between the weight transfer and the wheel spin I had a hard time on exit if I was pushing for a fast lap.
Overall impression; This would be a great a drifting car, it rolled with the turns really well was stable in a slide and actually prefered being sideways to straight I think. What I found was I had to let the car settle between turns or it would just roll past the grip of the tires in the next turn, so I had to take it easy around the entire track or I would lose the lap. Still a very quick car for not being able to push the car hard.
@nijalninja - Espirit V8 '02 front aero
Stock Lap;1:26.215 Lap Time;1:24.841 DC; 8.2
Entry; Solid brakes and entry grip, rotation was spot on, -IF- I was on the throttle. It recovered decently if I cooked an entry. This car had lift off understeer which saved me a few times from over rotation.
Mid Corner; As long as I was on teh throttle in same way this car rotated and glided through the turns like a butterfly on a gentle breeze. But I found soon as I started diving in and going hard on the car, it would just freak out and slide and spin.
Exit; Grip was phenomenal here, I could jump on teh throttle and pretty much not worry about tire spin or slip. Acceleration was very good as well, a tad longer of a 2nd gear would have allowed for a soon throttle use.
Overall impression; When I set this car up, I was like Settings that I would not have considered for this car. The LSD was crazy the toe settings yet it all worked, I had to be on the throttle at all times or I would start to lose it this included braking, so the zones were a bit longer but that didn’t hurt the time much at all. If I went bombing around the track I found the car to be unstable and unpredictable it never settled in, if I took it easy it would glided around the track with no hesitation or complaints. Well done.
@praiano63 - Espirit V8 '02 front aero
Stock Lap;1:26.858 Lap Time;1:23.536 DC; 8.8
Entry; Solid, stable and predictable. The only thing I found that this car didn’t like on entry was a cooked entry it would slide out on me.
Mid Corner; Stable would hold any line I was on with throttle control, I could move my line easily by adjusting how much throttle I was giving the car.
Exit; Suburb grip only had grip issues if I jumped on the throttle too soon, it would start to fishtail on me, if I was a gear higher I could be on the throttle from the apex on with no issues.
Overall impression; Fantastic tune, easy to drive quick as all get up. It just didn’t like me when I went bombing into a turn it would put me in the grass every time. I could drive this one all day without getting tired of it.
@Ridox2JZGTE - Espirit V8 '02 no aero REMOVE WING
Stock Lap; 1:28.898 Lap time; 1:26.815 DC; 6.5
Sharp turn in, and excellent grip if I was at the right entry speed, which I found to be lower than most of the other cars, it felt like it was skating around all the time if I was at the speeds that most other cars could do. I learned to slide it in some of the turns which took seconds off my time, but it was risky I spent more time off the track than I did on it.
Mid Corner; Good control through the midsection of the corner, didn’t do anything crazy here, solid and stable little of understeer otherwise very good.
Exit; Unless I was a gear high exit I found myself spinning my outside rear at every turn, too stiff and too much torque from the turbo. I did find that I could use this to get around some of the turns much quicker than I could otherwise but most of the time it just killed me.
Overall impression; Good fun tune to drive, Great for photo op’s lots of sliding and countersteering giving the impression of great speed in a pic . But not a car I would take to the track, it was prone to sliding and fishtailing on a DS3, I think the force feed back into the wheel lets you know when your tires are breaking loose so you can control the car much much better. I found I had to slow down too much to keep this car under control if it was smoking and squealing like a stuck pig it was fast, If it was well behaved and squealing it was slow. Like 3 seconds slower.
@shaunm80 - Tuscan Speed 6 front aero
Stock Lap;1:27.952 Lap Time;1:25.178 DC; 8.1
Entry; The brakes were solid and didn’t cause too much lock very well balanced, entry rotation was hit or miss for me, if I was fast it under steered if I was slow it over steered. Lateral roll of the car was minimal and the grip was fantastic as long as I didn’t cook it.
Mid Corner; I found a little bit of understeer present here based on the entry line it made it better or worse, With a solid entry it held what ever line I was on but didn’t like to change it very much if at all which hurt it on exit.
Exit; As long as I didn’t jump on the throttle it held itself wonderfully here, the acceleration was great, it only complained if I smashed the throttle at the apex which would cause me to spin out.
Overall impression; Very well balanced tune. It didn’t do anything unexpected and I set my second fastest lap on lap 3. Personal pref would have been a little less on the LSD acceleration setting to let me jump on the throttle a little bit sooner with less fear of finding myself fishing. Well done Sir.
@sinof1337 - Espirit V8 '02 no aero
Stock Lap;1:26.354 Lap Time;1:25.686 DC; 6.5
Entry; Stable but poor rotation. The outside front would turn red on most turns for me, if I slowed down more than I thought it did ok. The car had no rotation without throttle use.
Mid Corner; It would hold what ever line I was on, and I could adjust it out by letting off the throttle due to the lack of rotation this car had. If I tried to bring it in with more throttle it simply would spin.
Exit; I would lose the tail a little on every exit, I could counter steer it back in most of the time tho so seldom caused issues just slowed me down a bit. I think the issue was the stiff rear and ballast location in the nose of the car.
Overall impression; This was a very easy to drive car just not fast about it. Once learned this car didn’t do thing I didn’t expect. Until I started pushing the car harder for a better lap then I started to run into little random issues at various points caused by weight shifting from braking or throttle use.
@xande1959 - Tuscan Speed 6 no aero
Stock Lap;1:26.551 Lap Time;1:26.032 DC; 7.2
Entry; This car liked the sweepers more than the tight turns, it took them better and faster than any other Tuscan, it has medium grip at entry-mid but the lower speed turn it’s developed understeer that built up during the turn slowing me down.
Mid Corner; In the low speed turn it built up under steer through the turn till the start of the exit, at which time it often transitioned to oversteer requiring precision on the exit. If the cars balance was upset for any reason during the mid section of the turn it wouldn’t settle back down at all.
Exit;Smooth throttle use needed here, smashing the throttle would fish it, as long as I had held a good line through the mid part of the turn it was fantastic on exit and would just fly out of the turns, if I was off my line for some reason I had trouble getting the car back into place and going the direction I needed to set up for the next turn.
Overall impression; Good tune, little too unsettled for me to really lay down a good lap, it would recover well from a cooked entry, but didn’t like recovering if I cooked an exit. Felt like I was in a MR car a lot of the time from the outside front lighting up on most turns to fish tailing at exit.
So far this tune has got the skating feeling and fishing. With it being winter and all, if you put the two together, you'll get ice fishing. I am not complaining though, thanks again for the test and the review. I appreciate the comments and going by the DC, I can tell you sort of enjoyed driving this car around the lake, i mean autumn ring reverse.
I have checked both my cars and out of habit, even though it wasn't written down, I have put a carbon prop shaft on both the doormans' Jag and the beautiful aston martin. Thats good news for me as I won't have to retest the three cars that I've already put under the spot light. All I will say is that the tunes must be at the top of their game to get into the podium spot, some interesting entries in this class of cars
I did have fun with it. and hey it would be a great car to clear out the fishing competition with before you start fishing
Just click your dampers down one click front -or- rear at a alternating between them till it's stops skating. I've been finding that recently one click front and rear could be too much so I go one at a time now. generally rear then front unless I need more rotation than it's front then rear.
Thanks for testing and the review, it had flaws that I did not get to fix or notice until it was too late. But it wasn't a too safe tune.
I can't open your Zip file on my mac. It doesn't recognise the .ods file type on the zip file. Can you put the tune in the OP as text for me to test your car? Many thanks. Yours is the last jag for me to test.
Thank you for testing and the review
Thought you might struggle with this one, not the easiest car to drive. The trick with keeping stability is to keep giving the car a little bit of throttle during longer turns, this prevents the diff from opening too much and keeps the rear stable. That way you can constantly amend your line whilst holding speed. I constantly flick the accelerator during turns to keep the diff loaded, the faster you flick it the more stable the rear will be, the slower you flick it the sharper it will turn
@Otaliema Thank you for trying, but if I could change now would be unfair to rest tuners, after all testers gave me 2 fantastic tips to improve that time.
@shaunm80 & @sinof1337
EDIT: Pic resized.
Thank you. Should be able to test that in the next few days
Glad to help.
Too bad it´s too late for the aston X jaguar entry... they are very fun. I prefer the jag but they are very very close. Can´t say one is better than the other , i´m 2:00.7xx with both. This gone be a great challenge.
Good luck to tuners and testers.
Time posted for @DolHaus - Fastest so far
Time posted for @demonchilde
Thank you for testing and for the review
I agree that its not an easy car to drive, very much on a knife edge a lot of the time Thank you for the feedback on the trans, I drive auto myself so unless its doing anything obviously bad I don't tend to notice these things
@DolHaus @Otaliema @shaunm80 My tune for the XKR-S (here) has been updated with the image. Sorry for the wait.