Gran Turismo Sport: General Discussion

[davidt33]

Here and there ,not as much as I play project cars and assetto corsa tho. Mainly because there on next Gen

I hear ya. Would have preferred if you were still playing GT6 regular too until. I myself am anxiously awaiting release of GTsport but still playing GT6 regular until.
But meh, I'll add you still. Hope to see you in the TTs for now at least.

 

[georgetigra]

The engine sound is very close to the real Amg GT...
Also i like the new physics of the electronic assist!
They save his life at 1:33...

 

[davidt33]

Psn: Tru_killa420
If anybody wants to race or practice today add me please

Ok just sent Friend request bro. Only for you to accept now.

 

[Zlork]

Is it me or is the FOV in Chase Cam mode a little closer to the car now? If it is then I'm liking it. Makes the car look less like a toy.

A little closer would be nicer though.

@azeeza

A video of new build with AI in Pro mode ! Finally !

Excellent !

 

[KevinHeryanto]

The engine sound is very close to the real Amg GT...
Also i like the new physics of the electronic assist!
They save his life at 1:33...

its closer than you think...

 

[Zlork]

There is a blind spot indicator on the dash.

In fact, it already existed at Gamescom. But I didn't know that it was blindspot indicators. In my head, I thought PoDi will keep little arrows like GT6.

Sorry to be mistaken about that.

 

[sems4arsenal]

AMG sounds are def a big step up 👍

 

[SlimCharles]

An engine in GT that sounds like a real engine

And then, when I was happy, i heard the collision noises and saw the collision physics.

 

[daus26]

I understand the complain about ai but every player I see seems to just crash through them to get first place, but if the the ai does it, it's bad for them implying they don't know their surrounding. A little bit unfair lol. There seems to be a thin line between the ai being too aggressive and too soft, so I don't think I'll ever see the whole A.I thing being a resolved argument.

I appreciate the A.i overtake attempt somewhere in the middle of the AMG video by the way.

 

[GTEFGHA]

I understand the complain about ai but every player I see seems to just crash through them to get first place, but if the the ai does it, it's bad for them implying they don't know their surrounding. A little bit unfair lol. There seems to be a thin line between the ai being too aggressive and too soft, so I don't think I'll ever see the whole A.I thing being a resolved argument.

I appreciate the A.i overtake attempt somewhere in the middle of the AMG video by the way.

Why do people care about AI this much anyways, considering what kind of game this is it doesn't seem that im going to spend a lot of time in arcade mode

 

[sems4arsenal]

Sounds for the Subaru still needs work

 

[fatkid]

Why do people care about AI this much anyways, considering what kind of game this is it doesn't seem that im going to spend a lot of time in arcade mode

Thank you for speaking for me. Shall I post you my polling card so you can vote for me also?

Why do we need good a.i.? Let me guess : because some players have always enjoyed playing GT as a solo experience; some people do not like the type of players they meet when they go online; some people do not have a good internet connection; maybe it is just a good choice to have the option of a.i. and online; maybe racing a championship of a race class against a full grid is just fun; maybe some games have shown good a.i. for years, and GT being so far behind, despite PD's claims of improvement, that it is beginning to look stale; and maybe, just maybe, we all have different preferences?

GT mode and arcade mode have been a part of the GT series since the beginning, and now online mode is more important to the GT series than ever. Why isn't it possible to take what you want from a game and enjoy it for what it gives you?

Take a look at EA's Fifa franchise: completely dwarfs the GT games in terms of sales and popularity. The online vs and Ultimate Team modes far outweigh the 1p v cpu mode in terms of importance and popularity. The Ultimate Team mode has turned out to be a masterstroke and a goldmine for EA. So would you say EA should scrap the vs cpu mode since it is nowhere near as popular? Even on official forums people berate the a.i. on the latest Fifa of that time, yet EA still make a effort to improve it year in year out. Why should PD be given a "pass" for consistently not improving in even a reasonable amount in this area for what looks like over a decade?!

 

[RaY29rus]

Sounds for the Subaru still needs work

I thought it was a real life footage at the right monitor until this Mercedes went off the track.

 

[queleuleu]

I thought it was a real life footage at the right monitor until this Mercedes went off the track.

I was more interested by the replay than the rally track^^
Turn signals seem very likely given the HUD. There are two arrows in each corner of the speedometer, just under the blind spots indicators. They stay off, so no purpose unless they are turn signals IMO.

Another one

 

[azeeza]

I was more interested by the replay than the rally track^^
Turn signals seem very likely given the HUD. There are two arrows in each corner of the speedometer, just under the blind spots indicators. They stay off, so no purpose unless they are turn signals IMO.

Another one

The return of GT5p shadow on cockpit view ?

 

[SlimCharles]

Why do people care about AI this much anyways, considering what kind of game this is it doesn't seem that im going to spend a lot of time in arcade mode

Bingo

 

[Losco]

I Raced on intermediate and the ia looked Pretty similar to gt6

 

[05XR8]

Even though GTS will cater to the online portion, offline players that love the series, only have this NEW NEXT GEN GT game to play.

We shouldn't even be having an AI discussion after 20years of GT. That's the main problem. AI in Grandmother Turismo should be leading the console racing game charge.

 

[FPV MIC]

Yeah I'd hardly call that "fighting". It went down the inside and then promptly gave up on the exit.

Please explain to me how a pass that is started at 2:32 (earlier if you count the first failed attempt) and not completed until 2:56 is not "fighting", or in the slightest bit "prompt". You have just cherry picked a very small part of the sequence IMO.

This is where the fighting starts

Then the dive bomb back to the lead,

Corner exit (he's still there and hasn't "promptly given up on the exit")

And finally the overtake is completed

Certainly seems like fighting to me.

 

[Farushi]

Ok, which one of you did this?





If only GT Sport could be this exciting...

 

[Tornado]

(earlier if you count the first failed attempt)

Would be hard to do that. The failure of that attempt at the two minute mark had nothing to do with any specific effort by the AI (it was already in the process of making the turn) and everything to do with how the player tried to force a line that wasn't nearly sustainable and had to back off.

This is where the fighting starts
View attachment 596678
Then the dive bomb back to the lead,
View attachment 596679

He took the spot from the Charger pretty close to uncontested, and then screwed up the next three corners enough that it caught back up anyway. So the Charger dive bombed him. Taken in isolation, this is behavior that GT5 and GT6 AI already did. If you hadn't pulled away enough from him with him catching up, the AI would happily try and divebomb and make it stick. In fact, that behavior is one of the more reliable ways to see the AI in GT5/GT6 screw up and go off track; and manipulating how it worked to your advantage was one of the keys to doing well in GT5's B-Spec. It's good behavior by itself and GT5 occasionally put it to great effect on certain tracks (and it made B-Spec legitimately impressive at times), but it's irrelevant to the discussion.

Corner exit (he's still there and hasn't "promptly given up on the exit")
View attachment 596680
And finally the overtake is completed
View attachment 596681
Certainly seems like fighting to me.

And if the Charger hadn't gotten off the gas so much as soon as the player pulled level with him (another trait common in GT5 and GT6); or spent the entire rest of the race less than a second behind the player after being so laughably slower for the first 3 minutes of the race (infamous in GT6), the video would probably be more convincing to Simon.

 

[ron86]

Wow, the SLS sounds fantastic!

Also the AI seems very fast once you overtook them. Look how the charger manages to stay behind the player even when he drives fast and without failures. 👍

Its similar to my experience - after i spun out at 7th place and was on the track as 20th i only could manage to overtake about 5 opponents in the last lap (at willow springs) and the cars in front of me where pretty fast at cornering.

Now they only have to make the AI that fast from the beginning and not just once they got overtook.

 

[Samus]

Would be hard to do that. The failure of that attempt at the two minute mark had nothing to do with any specific effort by the AI (it was already in the process of making the turn) and everything to do with how the player tried to force a line that wasn't nearly sustainable and had to back off.



He took the spot from the Charger pretty close to uncontested, and then screwed up the next three corners enough that it caught back up anyway. So the Charger dive bombed him. Taken in isolation, this is behavior that GT5 and GT6 AI already did. If you hadn't pulled away enough from him with him catching up, the AI would happily try and divebomb and make it stick. In fact, that behavior is one of the more reliable ways to see the AI in GT5/GT6 screw up and go off track; and manipulating how it worked to your advantage was one of the keys to doing well in GT5's B-Spec. It's good behavior by itself and GT5 occasionally put it to great effect on certain tracks (and it made B-Spec legitimately impressive at times), but it's irrelevant to the discussion.





And if the Charger hadn't gotten off the gas so much as soon as the player pulled level with him (another trait common in GT5 and GT6); or spent the entire rest of the race less than a second behind the player after being so laughably slower for the first 3 minutes of the race (infamous in GT6), the video would probably be more convincing to Simon.

Pretty much what I was going to say. The screenshots even illustrate it, the AI was ahead on the exit having been up the inside then on the small straight that follows as I say, it just gave up. Nothing about that video showed AI better than GT6, i'm afraid.

 

[FPV MIC]

Would be hard to do that. The failure of that attempt at the two minute mark had nothing to do with any specific effort by the AI (it was already in the process of making the turn) and everything to do with how the player tried to force a line that wasn't nearly sustainable and had to back off.

This is why I didn't include it, but I very well could have. Just because he didn't succeed doesn't mean it's not the start of the fight, just as if I throw a punch at someone and fail to connect it is still the start of the fight.

He took the spot from the Charger pretty close to uncontested

But not uncontested, so still a fight.

and then screwed up the next three corners enough that it caught back up anyway. So the Charger dive bombed him.

Still fighting.

Taken in isolation, this is behavior that GT5 and GT6 AI already did. If you hadn't pulled away enough from him with him catching up, the AI would happily try and divebomb and make it stick. In fact, that behavior is one of the more reliable ways to see the AI in GT5/GT6 screw up and go off track; and manipulating how it worked to your advantage was one of the keys to doing well in GT5's B-Spec. It's good behavior by itself and GT5 occasionally put it to great effect on certain tracks (and it made B-Spec legitimately impressive at times), but it's irrelevant to the discussion.

Here I agree, this is irrelevant to the discussion.

And if the Charger hadn't gotten off the gas so much as soon as the player pulled level with him (another trait common in GT5 and GT6); or spent the entire rest of the race less than a second behind the player after being so laughably slower for the first 3 minutes of the race (infamous in GT6), the video would probably be more convincing to Simon.

I'm not saying it's perfect and I'm also not saying the behavior isn't similar to what we've seen in earlier games but, as several people have stated in earlier posts about their own experiences (and proof was demanded), the AI do put up a fight and this is proof, that's all.

 

[Scaff]

The key issue for me Is that while the AI has improved over past GT releases, it's still not got the best of the competition.

AC (now it's been patched) and PCars both are still a long way ahead.

In isolation I can see how GTS can impress in this regard, but viewed across the wider SIM spectrum it's still not good enough.

 

[Samus]

the AI do put up a fight and this is proof, that's all.

A rather pathetic fight. It left the door wide open and braked way too early as every GT AI does to let the player past then it's only attempt to re-pass was a dive-bomb which it promptly gave up on the following straight for no apparent reason.

Look at these screenshots you posted:

It's a straight piece of road and the AI is ahead, why does it just give up?

You can call that fighting if you like, I don't. It's nothing compared to most other games, as Scaff says.

Is it me or is the FOV in Chase Cam mode a little closer to the car now? If it is then I'm liking it. Makes the car look less like a toy.

A little closer would be nicer though.

@azeeza

A video of new build with AI in Pro mode ! Finally !

Excellent !

Oh, and this is still pretty poor as well. They are a little faster but that's about it, and it's still rather suspicious the way they're faster.

Exhibit A, 1:00 in. They're behind the AI heading into a braking zone, not even alongside at all. What is going to happen? You guessed it, the AI is going to brake way too early and way too hard and the player is going to fly past.

Exhibit B, 1:20 in. The Ferrari again brakes too much allowing the player up the inside. As soon as it receives a little nudge it lifts off and let's him by.

Exhibit C, 2:30 in. See Exhibit A. It briefly attempts to come back at him, then gives it up.

The same behaviour continues throughout the video. Player catches the AI, pulls alongside or even just behind, easily outbrakes them and if they do happen to stay with them, they give it up on the exit or next corner.

The only thing that slowed him down were mistakes and the fact the track is extremely tight. Place this AI behaviour on a wider track without player mistakes and it's still no challenge at all.

It's the same as GT6, the only way they're faster is on the straights and curiously once they're behind you. ie, suspiciously like rubber banding. Otherwise they're like turtles in the corners and give up position far too easily.

 

[FPV MIC]

Pretty much what I was going to say. The screenshots even illustrate it, the AI was ahead on the exit having been up the inside then on the small straight that follows as I say, it just gave up.

Hmm.. So changing your story from this

It went down the inside and then promptly gave up on the exit.

to this

the AI was ahead on the exit having been up the inside then on the small straight that follows as I say, it just gave up.

when provided with proof that your first statement was incorrect is ok, well, whatever.

A rather pathetic fight. It left the door wide open and braked way too early as every GT AI does to let the player past then it's only attempt to re-pass was a dive-bomb which it promptly gave up on the following straight for no apparent reason.

Look at these screenshots you posted:

It's a straight piece of road and the AI is ahead, why does it just give up?

You can call that fighting if you like, I don't. It's nothing compared to most other games, as Scaff says.

Again, look at the whole sequence, several overtakes in a short period (24 seconds) of time is a fight for position, is it not. And why does it just give up, maybe because if someone has got a run on you heading into a fast approaching left hand corner on the outside of another car is a stupid thing to do, I would lift too. I agree that the AI still needs work compared to other games but for you to state there is no fighting is pure BS.

 

[azeeza]

Hmm.. So changing your story from this

to this
when provided with proof that your first statement was incorrect is ok, well, whatever.

Again, look at the whole sequence, several overtakes in a short period (24 seconds) of time is a fight for position, is it not. And why does it just give up, maybe because if someone has got a run on you heading into a fast approaching left hand corner on the outside of another car is a stupid thing to do, I would lift too. I agree that the AI still needs work compared to other games but for you to state there is no fighting is pure BS.

The point is they want an Ai that they could never overtaking them
Like a 20 grid race, we re allowed to gain only 2-3 places on the whole race to qualify a good AI
And this kind of race they can experience it on online, with fair player, and outpass their imagination but the same guy don't want to experience it for some reason, cause they prefer to race with scripted AI

 

[05XR8]

This is the kind of "AI" GT needs.

I've run countless races in PCars at Monza with AI that behaved just like the real thing in this video . . Admittedly, the AI do a bit of bashing up the inside and at corner exit, but I can expect AI will not brake check me. I can actually use braking markers to keep pace with AI. Plus, the AI will keep the gap for the duration of the lap unless, I'm consistent in my lap times or the AI makes a "mistake".

GT AI need to go beyond "it's an improvement".

P.S.: The sound of the AMG GT is okay. Here's hoping all cars in GT games sound realistic.

 

[Samus]

I didn't change what I said. It is ahead at the exit of the corner and then it gives up, at the exit.

Look, if that behaviour makes you excited to race the AI then good for you, it doesn't for me. Having online is no excuse, basically all games have had online for years but they still have better AI than that.