Hyundai Ioniq & Kia EV Thread

Kia EV5 concept

It is just a design concept and will most likely not become a production car


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Also, the new title is misspelled, should be Ioniq with a Q
 
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Kia EV5 concept

It is just a design concept and will most likely not become a production car


kia-concept-ev5.jpg


kia-concept-ev5.jpg


kia-concept-ev5.jpg


kia-concept-ev5.jpg


kia-concept-ev5.jpg




Also, the new title is misspelled, should be Ioniq with a Q
Will likely not? Press X. The exterior is perfect for the American market. I bet the exterior is 95% complete here and there aren't even many concepty details that will change. Look at the aerodyanmic work especially at the sides and top of the rear end - the sharp edge to break off airflow cleanly, the downward curvature of the roof, how the rear window pinches down in width compared to the windshield, and the rear spoiler which appears to scoop air down onto the rear window. Designers do not design details like that, aerodynamicists come up with those ideas and they compromise over the course of a year or more as the design is being finalized. Traditional concept cars don't go through that level of development. It needs door handles but that is within that 5% of stuff that will change.

The body of this car is fully developed aerodynamically which I why I disagree that it's just a design concept. I suppose you're right that it might not go into production - the Chrysler Airflow was also a fully developed car that won't make it to production, but that one also was not "just" a design concept. It was a whole ass car that was scrapped. I doubt Kia will do that with this. Kia isn't an incompetent company.
 
Will likely not? Press X. The exterior is perfect for the American market. I bet the exterior is 95% complete here and there aren't even many concepty details that will change. Look at the aerodyanmic work especially at the sides and top of the rear end - the sharp edge to break off airflow cleanly, the downward curvature of the roof, how the rear window pinches down in width compared to the windshield, and the rear spoiler which appears to scoop air down onto the rear window. Designers do not design details like that, aerodynamicists come up with those ideas and they compromise over the course of a year or more as the design is being finalized. Traditional concept cars don't go through that level of development. It needs door handles but that is within that 5% of stuff that will change.

The body of this car is fully developed aerodynamically which I why I disagree that it's just a design concept. I suppose you're right that it might not go into production - the Chrysler Airflow was also a fully developed car that won't make it to production, but that one also was not "just" a design concept. It was a whole ass car that was scrapped. I doubt Kia will do that with this. Kia isn't an incompetent company.
You're probably right. Some other outlets said it previews a new SUV. I think I misinterpreted what that article meant by "purely a design showcase for the future SUV"


At a Hyundai event, a Hyundai designer revealed that the Ioniq 6 is based on the Stout Scarab


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The massive EV9 is going to get a sporty GT version


Along with revealing more specs about new mid-size three-row EV9 SUV, Kia has confirmed a high-performance GT model is also on the way. The regular 2024 Kia EV9 will go on sale in the U.S. in the second half of this year, with the GT version that's currently being developed to be released in early 2025.

There's currently a EV9 GT-Line

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Kia EV5 concept

It is just a design concept and will most likely not become a production car


kia-concept-ev5.jpg


kia-concept-ev5.jpg


kia-concept-ev5.jpg


kia-concept-ev5.jpg


kia-concept-ev5.jpg




Also, the new title is misspelled, should be Ioniq with a Q

The massive EV9 is going to get a sporty GT version




There's currently a EV9 GT-Line

2024-kia-ev9-gt-line-exterior-front-three-quarter-view.jpg


2024-kia-ev9-gt-line-exterior-side-view.jpg


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Wait a second...what the heck is going on here? Is Kia putting out concept SUVs faster than I can eat a bowl of frosted mini wheats? Since when the hell did the EV9 become a production car but the EV5 is just some newfangled concept? They're the same damn thing.
 
Wait a second...what the heck is going on here? Is Kia putting out concept SUVs faster than I can eat a bowl of frosted mini wheats? Since when the hell did the EV9 become a production car but the EV5 is just some newfangled concept? They're the same damn thing.
I think the EV5 is smaller and initially for the Chinese market. As the article states, the EV5 was revealed at Kia Chinese EV Day event in China


Meanwhile, the EV9 design was officially revealed 6 days earlier while specs were announced yesterday


 
Another great video by Technology Connections.

He talks about how when using one pedal drive mode on the Ioniq 5 (and assumedly the EV6 and GV60), the brake lights do not come on until you're completely off the accelerator pedal, which is dangerous because it can be pulling 2G's of deceleration without the brake lights coming on.

When he looks into the regulations, it is actually not necessary for the brake lights to come on, because regenerative braking using one pedal drive is not considered to be "service brakes" but rather "supplemental brake system", thus the brake lights do not need to be on.

 
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When he looks into the regulations, it is actually not necessary
The SAE is not very good at its job. NHTSA, yes, SAE borderline useless. They're not interested in safety standards, they're not interested in ergonomic standards, they don't consider human factors, etc etc. And when they do, car manufacturers simply ignore it to pinch pennies. There are SO many things wrong with American automotive regulations and engineering and design practices it is embarrassing.

The way the new Chevy Colorado buries its headlight controls deep within the infotainment system is actually one of the most clever solutions to an extreme problem that I've heard in a long time. Ever since some idiot college-educated engineer decided to combine always-lit gauge clusters with DRLs as bright as headlights, the number of mindless drivers turning their automatic headlights off has skyrocketed. So Chevy says, screw these dumb people, we'll just default the vehicle to automatic and then bury the headlight controls so deep that only a mechanic will be able to find it. Genius.

I personally think they should tie all interior lighting to the headlights which is how it worked for like 110 years before the late 2000s. That way, at night time, you get in your car and are forced to turn on the lights because the interior is pitch black and you can't even see the shift knob to put it in D.
 
Consumer Reports tests Technology Connections' claims and confirms that brake lights on Hyundai, Kia, and Genesis EVs do not illuminate when using one-pedal modes and the car is decelerating with the accelerator still depressed

They also note the Mercedes EVs have a similar, but different problem

Following up on the report of the Ioniq 5, CR’s team of auto experts tested the brake-light behavior on each of the 24 EVs in our own fleet (all purchased for our auto-test program) to see how widespread this issue might be across brands and models.

CR’s engineers measured how quickly each car slowed down when using the vehicles’ one-pedal-driving regenerative-braking modes, and observed at what rate of deceleration each vehicle’s brake lights came on. “On average, we found that the brake lights of most EVs in our fleet illuminate when the regenerative braking system is slowing the car at about 0.1g (g-force), which could be described as a slight but noticeable amount of braking force,” says Alex Knizek, CR’s manager of auto testing and insights. “We think that is a level of deceleration that warrants informing other drivers via the car’s brake lights.”

While most of the EVs in CR’s fleet did illuminate their brake lights appropriately during aggressive regenerative braking, several of them did not, even when deceleration levels were considered more aggressive. Those include:
  • 2022 Hyundai Ioniq 5 SEL AWD
  • 2023 Genesis GV60 Advanced
  • 2023 Genesis Electrified GV70
  • 2022 Kia EV6 Wind AWD
  • 2023 Kia Niro EV Wind

This potentially dangerous issue doesn’t exist on CR’s 2023 Hyundai Ioniq 6 SEL AWD test vehicle, as it operated consistently with proper brake-light illumination when slowing the vehicle in its i-Pedal mode, even if the driver maintained some pressure on the accelerator pedal.

[...]

CR contacted Hyundai and Genesis, as well as Kia separately, to find out whether the companies are aware of the potential safety risk, and whether the problem could be rectified by an over-the-air update or a recall. Miles Johnson, Hyundai senior manager for quality, service, and technology public relations sent the following statement, which he said covered the Hyundai, Kia, and Genesis brands: “Hyundai is aware of the customer concerns regarding EV brake light illumination. Hyundai engineering teams are investigating and reviewing our EV braking strategies. All Hyundai Motor Group electric vehicles meet the FMVSS No. 108 standard that regulates all automotive lighting. Hyundai is committed to vehicle safety and the well-being of our customers.”

Kia’s James Hope responded similarly: “Kia America is aware of comments concerning i-PEDAL brake light logic on the 2023 Niro EV and 2022/2023 EV6 (excluding GT trim) and is evaluating the matter. Kia places a priority on vehicle safety, and all Kia vehicles sold in the United States meet or exceed all federal motor vehicle safety standards.”

[...]

In the process of our EV brake-light testing, we uncovered another potential safety issue with some electric Mercedes-Benz models: When the Strong Recuperation regenerative-braking mode is engaged (which is Mercedes’ term for its one-pedal driving), the brake lights on the vehicles we tested turn off as the vehicle comes to a complete stop. Initially, after the driver steps off the accelerator pedal in Strong Recuperation mode, the brake lights illuminate when deceleration reaches about 0.15g. Then, as the speed drops down to about 5 mph—and as the vehicle reduces its deceleration rate to smooth out the stop—the brake lights suddenly turn off. They remain off for more than 15 seconds, which is long after the vehicle has stopped. They illuminate again automatically after about 15 seconds.

The vehicles that exhibited this behavior, all purchased as part of CR’s regular test program, are:
  • 2022 Mercedes-Benz EQS 580 4Matic
  • 2023 Mercedes-Benz EQS SUV 450 4Matic
  • 2023 Mercedes-Benz EQE SUV 350 4Matic
  • 2023 Mercedes-Benz EQE 350 4Matic sedan


 
Consumer Reports tests Technology Connections' claims and confirms that brake lights on Hyundai, Kia, and Genesis EVs do not illuminate when using one-pedal modes and the car is decelerating with the accelerator still depressed

They also note the Mercedes EVs have a similar, but different problem




I was sitting behind a Plaid at a red light yesterday and noticed that its brake lights weren't on. We creeped up a couple times and it came to a complete stop before turning right on red and I never saw its brake lights.

That Mercedes issue is pretty weird. Amazing how something like that gets past their on-road pre-production testing. That could easily cause a rear-end fender bender if the driver behind responds to a false green light, thinking the Merc is about to drive away.
 
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More teasers of the Ioniq 5 N at the Nurburgring with fake engine noise


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Now rocking a much-needed rear wiper, the Ioniq 5 N has completed an endurance test of 10,000 kilometers (6,213 miles) on the 'Ring and is currently being pushed through its paces in a full-throttle evaluation of the same length. We're being told Hyundai's engineers have fitted larger 400-mm brake discs and a so-called N e-Shift to mimic the eight-speed, dual-clutch automatic transmission found in the N models equipped with a combustion engine.

The Ioniq 5 N has eight interior speakers and two external ones for the N Active Sound + setup with three sound themes: Ignition, Evolution, and Supersonic. The first one replicates a turbocharged 2.0-liter gasoline engine from a conventionally powered N car, complete with pops and bangs. Evolution takes after the "electronic sound" from the N 2025 Vision Gran Turismo Concept and RN22e, while Supersonic makes the hot crossover sound like a fighter jet, apparently.


 
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Kia EV9 first impressions in South Korea

The interior packaging seems good, but that should be a given given how large the car is. He says according to Kia, the car should be in the $50k range and will be on sale in Q4 of this year

 
I like it a lot. The fender flares improves the looks of the car. I like that new steering wheel and the N logo, but I think it looks a bit less sporty than the one in other N models. Black screen bezels looks so much better than the white. The UI looks a lot more modern than the one in other N models.
 
641HP with boost, 601HP without and 545lb-ft of torque. Looking like the hot hatch we always wanted out of the Ioniq 5, but of course still crossover sized. So much more attractive than the other N products. Not sure how I feel about the simulated manual shifting with the simulated fuel cutoff.

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Edit: Finally a rear wiper too! Almost missed that part.
 
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Did Hyundai just convince me to think about an electric car? I really like how the N version looks. I wonder though if the handling can keep up with its looks. I have a feeling it will, considering the recent N variants.
 
The regular Ioniq 5 was quite convincing after driving a couple and loving the design, but the crossover cladding took away from the more hatchback look. But as an N, it looks even better. Just hope they offer more colors, but have some doubts beyond the usual N colors which is rather lackluster. After testing those seats in the Elantra N and EV6 GT, I don't think they'd be comfortable for my...fairly wide waist.
 
A couple of thoughts after watching Jonny Smith's walkaround video.

First, the tires...21 inch wheels are too big, especially with a 35 series sidewall IMO. That tells me the ride will be super hard and crash over bumps. Second, the weight...all steel panels and a bigger battery pack tell me it will be over 4500 pounds, especially when the normal Ioniq 5 is over 4000 pounds. That's way too much for a "sporty" version of anything not a truck. Why can't we get an electric car under 3000 pounds? Last...all the details make it look incohesive on the exterior. That little strip of orange on the grille and rear doesn't need to be there IMO. Then there's the awkward orange stripe around the entire perimeter. I understand that pastel blue and orange is their motorsport colors, but i think it needs to be more subtle, like just the one on the splitter and diffuser is enough. The checkered flag pattern seems to be incorporated throughout the entire design, which I do like. I'm interested to see how the e-shift system works like it's claimed to. As a package, it has a lot of promise.
 
First, the tires...21 inch wheels are too big, especially with a 35 series sidewall IMO. That tells me the ride will be super hard and crash over bumps.
They're 275/35, which mean that they have 3.8" of sidewall, which is not too bad. My Veloster N came with 235/35r19, which means 3.2" of sidewall and it's certainly not super comfortable, but it's fine.

Second, the weight...all steel panels and a bigger battery pack tell me it will be over 4500 pounds, especially when the normal Ioniq 5 is over 4000 pounds. That's way too much for a "sporty" version of anything not a truck. Why can't we get an electric car under 3000 pounds?
It'll probably be around 4800-5000 lbs yeah. Caterham is making a sub 3000 lbs electric car.
 
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They're 275/35, which mean that they have 3.8" of sidewall, which is not too bad. My Veloster N came with 235/35r19, which means 3.2" of sidewall and it's certainly not super comfortable, but it's fine.
That's not terrible. At least they aren't runflats! I can see a lot of bent wheels, especially where I live, with all the pot holes and our terrible roads. I did check tire rack for the tire. Jonny said they are a bespoke tire, but the Tesla spec Pirelli in that same size is $520USD per tire. That's crazy expensive for a tire, no matter how special they are. Also, that's another reason why I'm not a fan of big wheels.
It'll probably be around 4800-5000 lbs yeah. Caterham is making a sub 3000 lbs electric car.
I saw that. It will be interesting to see how it develops and hopefully it shows a different approach than throwing more weight and power at the electric car formula. 🤞
 
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A couple of thoughts after watching Jonny Smith's walkaround video.

First, the tires...21 inch wheels are too big, especially with a 35 series sidewall IMO. That tells me the ride will be super hard and crash over bumps. Second, the weight...all steel panels and a bigger battery pack tell me it will be over 4500 pounds, especially when the normal Ioniq 5 is over 4000 pounds. That's way too much for a "sporty" version of anything not a truck. Why can't we get an electric car under 3000 pounds? Last...all the details make it look incohesive on the exterior. That little strip of orange on the grille and rear doesn't need to be there IMO. Then there's the awkward orange stripe around the entire perimeter. I understand that pastel blue and orange is their motorsport colors, but i think it needs to be more subtle, like just the one on the splitter and diffuser is enough. The checkered flag pattern seems to be incorporated throughout the entire design, which I do like. I'm interested to see how the e-shift system works like it's claimed to. As a package, it has a lot of promise.
I can see why it needs 21's to keep those hot hatch proportions in check, anything smaller would look at odds with that sporty design. But that's the issue i have with it - the Ioniq 5 is a big car, it's roughly the size of my 2nd-gen BMW X3, if a few inches less tall. I'm not convinced Hyundai's 'N' brand styling works on something that size. You can get away with it on something small and youthful, but it starts looking a bit Mansory on a bigger vehicle IMO.
 
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I feel it’s cool regardless of weight. It’s a Hyundai quicker than a Lamborghini SUV(which is $400,000 AUD). I guess that’s job done.
 
I feel it’s cool regardless of weight. It’s a Hyundai quicker than a Lamborghini SUV(which is $400,000 AUD). I guess that’s job done.
I didn't say it wasn't cool. It's very cool concept of a hot hatch EV that frankly I wish VW would've done with the e-Golf. There are a lot of very cool and neat features about this N EV. It will weigh over 1000 pounds more than the Type-R, with no signs of lightweighting anywhere in a "track focused" hatchback. It will probably also cost north of 70k USD as well, which isn't really accessible to most.
 
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