FIA Race Discussion [Archive]

[theschledy]

Edit: In fact, I might skip Red Bull too and it's x15 tire wear...

LOL! Even though my season was ruined after yesterday I still wanted to try out the remaining events. But x15 Tire wear in the TT? Sounds like a waste of a Sunday.

I honestly don't get the logic of these combos. It seems like every race either caters to a certain set of cars, or it destroys any possibility of getting results for others. Seems like we're competing against our own cars more than anything.

 

[CodeRedR51]

LOL! Even though my season was ruined after yesterday I still wanted to try out the remaining events. But x15 Tire wear in the TT? Sounds like a waste of a Sunday.

I honestly don't get the logic of these combos. It seems like every race either caters to a certain set of cars, or it destroys any possibility of getting results for others. Seems like we're competing against our own cars more than anything.

The last two events are x8 tire, x3 fuel with RM required and RS available so they should be fine. Looking forward to them.

 

[Benay79]

I'm really hating the amount of slots and multiple shots happening at the moment, it's becoming a pure luck fest for points, positions, splits. Might as well roll dice for your championship position at this stage .

With extra slots, its spreading the players out too much. If you do a later slot, most the people have had a race by then so won't race again. I'm only in mid to high B lobbies usually with top points being around 115ish but i did the latest slot the other day and the prize for 1st was 35!!! Choice of either quit and lose DR or spend half an hour racing for terrible points.

 

[05XR8]

The 1995 Porsche 911 that was recently added to the game. That’s my favorite generation of the 911, so I’m looking forward to Nations this weekend.

Nice a "proper" 993 Cup race.

 

[Hygrade B]

I am enjoying no assist driving.
Last night I went out got last for Q and got blocked which is normal, I was on H this was going to be my test race so take it easy forgot about Q. I got pole ok now I finish and start to I am at the start and I always get hit, and it happen maybe it my fault my be being nervous I don't push like I should also it's coldish tyres.
I start my race on M looking to do a 1stop onto H.
Turn 1 I get hit by P2(finishes P2), I go a bit wide & loose time but still in P1, turn two I am on the outside which is not a good place to be. By turn three just gone under the bridge P3(finishes P14) runs me on to the grass no reason there was plenty space then on the same corner it takes out P4, P3 is now P2 with no penalties & very happy ,I guess that's the way you keep you space.
I drop to P8 not even completed a lap yet, as I am about to get off the gravel about to get onto the grass I get hit by a car going off after hitting two cars this car also keep its place P10 also no penalties.
I am now P16 and14 laps to go, I get my head down & race.
I decided if the car Infront is slower than me, I'll give them a few corners to let me pass them clean, if each time the car brakes to early or push me wide when I am about to pass I will continue pushing through.
Lap4 I catch up the the car that pushed me onto the grass on the 1st lap & the car that hit me back onto the grass.
Both cars as I passed them push & hit me trying to take me out with no luck, coming to the end of lap 4 near drive bomb strip, one car dive bombed me I had enough time to give it space & let it through, on the chicane the second car dive bombed me but this time I was pushed wide & i got a .5 sec penalty.
The last chicane before the start stop line I took my normal braking & decided I would not brake early & I hit the car that dive bombed me & took me out this was not my plan. The car took the corner wrong & tried to stop me passing which didn't work, We both reset.
I carried on passed both cars again & continued passing cars until reached lap10 time to pit my tyres where still perfect but it was time H
I was P8 thinking about how I could get to P4/5 I could see P6 and 7 Infront, P6 I let pass earlier after because it had pitted lap before and I know it was burning it tyres trying to catch me.
One car made a pitted on lap13 I was not close to P6 & thought I let it pass with no problems, so I know I can pass this car easy last lap I am no P6 pushing to get P5.

I do love driving in cockpit view.

I love the high tyre wear & fuel wear it show who can race and think and who just what's to go round & round with no strategy.
I hope we get night racing, more strategy, higher penalties for not following the rules 20 sec for not following the rules is not enough when the driver rams off the person who can beat them.

 

[OutlawQuadrnt]

Same as @TRL LIGHTNING
I think PD stored wrong values of griplevel for this curb

I watched Lightning spin live on his stream and figured it was his Lambo and an upshift that caused it. Then an Aston right in front of me spun early in my race followed by yours truly.

That section of track with the white triangles is definitely uneven. In fact, the left side of my car is sinking a bit compared to my right just before my spin.

 

[Famine]

I love the high tyre wear & fuel wear it show who...

... has a lightweight, rear-wheel drive car.

For certain brands, high tyre wear makes the Gr.4 car unusable. In the Mazda I have to make twice as many stops on the same tyres as a GT86 driver does - and the cars aren't balanced enough to make the Mazda quick enough to offset the extra stops.

 

[CodeRedR51]

I love the high tyre wear & fuel wear it show who can race and think and who just what's to go round & round with no strategy.

Sometimes the actual racing is what counts.

 

[watto79]

I love the high tyre wear & fuel wear it show who can race and think and who just what's to go round & round with no strategy.

There's a balance though, and actually PD were really close to finding that balance in the first Exhibition season with the longer races and lower multipliers. One of the main complaints after the 2019 season was that races were too short with too extreme tyre/fuel multipliers and for a while it looked like that had been addressed. Sadly we seem to be going back in that direction and it's just not fun. It doesn't mean a good strategy wins, it just means the OP car for that track wins as they have access to strategies other cars don't.

Having high multipliers is a way to force a pit stop strategy into a short race, but it in reality it magnifies the weaknesses of some cars while magnifying the strengths of others, creating a very unbalanced playing field.

The next Manufacturers race at RBR with x15 tyre wear is basically pointless for anyone with FF or 4WD cars. That's not down to the driver not being able to race, their soft tyres will melt after a handfull of laps at anything close to half decent pace.

 

[GTWolverine]

There's a balance though, and actually PD were really close to finding that balance in the first Exhibition season with the longer races and lower multipliers. One of the main complaints after the 2019 season was that races were too short with too extreme tyre/fuel multipliers and for a while it looked like that had been addressed. Sadly we seem to be going back in that direction and it's just not fun. It doesn't mean a good strategy wins, it just means the OP car for that track wins as they have access to strategies other cars don't.

Having high multipliers is a way to force a pit stop strategy into a short race, but it in reality it magnifies the weaknesses of some cars while magnifying the strengths of others, creating a very unbalanced playing field.

The next Manufacturers race at RBR with x15 tyre wear is basically pointless for anyone with FF or 4WD cars. That's not down to the driver not being able to race, their soft tyres will melt after a handfull of laps at anything close to half decent pace.

Not to mention your race is potentially ruined after one slide, because now your tires are shot and you either lose even more time due to an extra pitstop, or you do the rest of the stint on tires that now feel like they're 10 laps older.

 

[Granadier]

Halve the tire wear multipliers and double the race laps and the FIA races would world class IMO. Make the races take around 45 mins.

 

[05XR8]

Halve the tire wear multipliers and double the race laps and the FIA races would world class IMO. Make the races take around 45 mins.

I'd love the races to be longer. On the flipside, for us DS4 users, could be a bit taxing on the fingers at certain tracks.

Must be a adrenaline/mind thing. I can race the hour long GT League races with no problem. Some of the short Daily Races, I get numbness at certain tracks. I may need to relax more, but it's common for many DS4 users.

Anyway, I'd prefer longer races than what we have now. Numbness be damned!

 

[CodeRedR51]

Halve the tire wear multipliers and double the race laps and the FIA races would world class IMO. Make the races take around 45 mins.

Perfect.

 

[LLOYDZELITE69]

Halve the tire wear multipliers and double the race laps and the FIA races would world class IMO. Make the races take around 45 mins.

Exactly, imo. Just at least races long enough to where you can recover if you’ve made a mistake or you’ve been crashed into. Plus, longer races will more than likely calm people down naturally since it’s a longer race and not everyone acting like maniacs for a quick 9 lap race.

 

[Hygrade B]

Sometimes the actual racing is what counts.

There's a balance though, and actually PD were really close to finding that balance in the first Exhibition season with the longer races and lower multipliers. One of the main complaints after the 2019 season was that races were too short with too extreme tyre/fuel multipliers and for a while it looked like that had been addressed. Sadly we seem to be going back in that direction and it's just not fun. It doesn't mean a good strategy wins, it just means the OP car for that track wins as they have access to strategies other cars don't.

Having high multipliers is a way to force a pit stop strategy into a short race, but it in reality it magnifies the weaknesses of some cars while magnifying the strengths of others, creating a very unbalanced playing field.

The next Manufacturers race at RBR with x15 tyre wear is basically pointless for anyone with FF or 4WD cars. That's not down to the driver not being able to race, their soft tyres will melt after a handfull of laps at anything close to half decent pace.

Your both right to a point.

I always watch back different races that I have had.
I watch cars like mine to see how that cars tyres & fuel wear and pace, I am not fast but I normally keep up & have better tyres & fuel level at the end of the race, unless I mess up & don't count when adding fuel.
I also do that with cars around me any make.

I see a lot of like mine have to pit more often for fuel & tyres but still had a good race pace to a point.
So it does matter on the driver as much as the car.

Every car is made different because it's a race, each car has a weak spot & a strength on each track much less each sector.
It's down to the driver to get the best out of the car.
But that's me maybe I have been watch car sports to long, maybe I am to use to F1 games where this is normal.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Your both right to a point.

I always watch back different races that I have had.
I watch cars like mine to see how that cars tyres & fuel wear and pace, I am not fast but I normally keep up & have better tyres & fuel level at the end of the race, unless I mess up & don't count when adding fuel.
I also do that with cars around me any make.

I see a lot of like mine have to pit more often for fuel & tyres but still had a good race pace to a point.
So it does matter on the driver as much as the car.

Every car is made different because it's a race, each car has a weak spot & a strength on each track much less each sector.
It's down to the driver to get the best out of the car.
But that's me maybe I have been watch car sports to long, maybe I am to use to F1 games where this is normal.

The driver getting the best out of the car for 45 minutes with little input from pit stops is far more impressive to me.

 

[Hygrade B]

The driver getting the best out of the car for 45 minutes with little input from pit stops is far more impressive to me.

Ok your a sprint person, I understand now.

 

[watto79]

Your both right to a point.

I always watch back different races that I have had.
I watch cars like mine to see how that cars tyres & fuel wear and pace, I am not fast but I normally keep up & have better tyres & fuel level at the end of the race, unless I mess up & don't count when adding fuel.
I also do that with cars around me any make.

I see a lot of like mine have to pit more often for fuel & tyres but still had a good race pace to a point.
So it does matter on the driver as much as the car.

Every car is made different because it's a race, each car has a weak spot & a strength on each track much less each sector.
It's down to the driver to get the best out of the car.
But that's me maybe I have been watch car sports to long, maybe I am to use to F1 games where this is normal.

F1 cars have very similar tyre wear and fuel consumption, so isn't really a fair comparison.

Don't get me wrong, I like the fact that GTSport has tyre wear and fuel consumption to manage as this is indeed part of motorsports. But high multipliers expose the differences between cars. This is more apparent if you watch some streams of the top split racers who know how to get the best from each car.

To do your own test you could enter an online lobby with this Sundays Red Bull Ring settings, select soft tyres and drive as many hotlaps as you can in your Merc. Note how many laps you can do before times drop to more than a second slower than your fastest lap. Then repeat the test with any FF or 4WD car and see how quickly the lap times drop off.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Ok your a sprint person, I understand now.

*Not a Sprint person.

 

[Granadier]

Ok your a sprint person, I understand now.

45 minutes is not a sprint

 

[05XR8]

I've said before, PD can do away with the multipliers as we know they have track surface data. It may or may not be implemented in the next game.

Some players test the wear, some players don't have time to test. Some rely on others to seek the best strategy, some just jump in and gamble/guestimate how they'll go during the race.

Track surface does the same thing. If you can only do two laps on an RS/RSS tyre, you have your data. If your fuel drops to 50% on lap 6 of 15, you have your data. It's all car/driveline dependent, just like the multiplier.

I'd rather see:

Track surface - abrasive, smooth, patchy

This way, players know Sainte-Croix is smooth and maybe time of day comes into how much tyres will wear. Nurburgring is patchy, Interlagos abrasive, etc.

 

[Lost Sheltie]

These exhibition seasons are good ways for Polyphony to try out different things. Remember they introduced mandatory tyre compounds and they extended the race lengths in the first couple of seasons this time. Hopefully they will learn from this what works and what doesn't, but at the end of the day they will go on how many people enter the competitions and how long they play for.

If more people play when there are 5 rounds that you can enter (and there seems to be a lot of people who do rounds until they get a score they are happy with), instead of just one, and if it is races with high tyre wear then that is what we will get, no matter what anyone says.

I quite like the strategy side of things tbh, so I will accept tyre wear in races that hurts some cars (eg. this weekend when my poor VW has virtually no chance at the Red Bull Ring), but I do think that variety is needed so there should be some races where it is just flat out from start to finish (Nations race this weekend looks to be pretty much like that).

At the end of the day Polyphony have done a pretty good job as this is a game that is nearly 3 years old and it still has a lot of active players from all skill levels, which isn't something many games can say. Just give a little power bump to the gr.4 mitsubishi, and drop the tyre wear on the FF cars a little

 

[CodeRedR51]

and drop the tyre wear on the FF cars a little

FF cars shouldn't even be in the Gr4 category.

 

[KaiB]

Ok your a sprint person, I understand now.

Your getting it wrong...

Puting high tyre wear in short races doesn´t benefict any kind o driver or decent driver, only beneficts rushed drivers that make mistakes and punt other players to get the a better position fast, in the other hand longer races with less tyre wear benefict the more constant drivers cause they can deal with rushed drivers better and have time to compensate any mistakes made by trying to avoid dirty drivers.

In terms of driving skills it´s better also cause longer races you need to be quick and preserv tyres and fuel depending on your situation, actually strategy it´s more important then in short and high tyre wear races, this kinda of races are more like a lotery then pure skill.

 

[Lost Sheltie]

FF cars shouldn't even be in the Gr4 category.

Probably true, but the problem is that very few manufacturers do cars that are rear wheel drive. If I was a manufacturer then I would want my latest cars in game so you really need a section that has FF cars in it (Even BMW's 1 series is now FF). I still hold that they could make it work if they just changed the criteria of testing a little (test pace over 3 laps instead of say 1) and reduced the tyre wear a little.

It is possible to balance RR and FF cars in a championship with a bit of effort

 

[koshmare]

Round 8 hot laps

 

[skyline1683]

Probably true, but the problem is that very few manufacturers do cars that are rear wheel drive. If I was a manufacturer then I would want my latest cars in game so you really need a section that has FF cars in it (Even BMW's 1 series is now FF). I still hold that they could make it work if they just changed the criteria of testing a little (test pace over 3 laps instead of say 1) and reduced the tyre wear a little.

It is possible to balance RR and FF cars in a championship with a bit of effort

the BTTC only works so well with it’s different drivetrain layouts because the success ballast they implement so if one car/driver has a good run of results they load it up with as much as 75kg of weight to keep the championship on a level playing field and il admit it works very well but for this to work on gt we would pretty much require two updates a week to the bop to keep all cars at a equal level

 

[Famine]

for this to work on gt we would pretty much require two updates a week to the bop to keep all cars at a equal level

What GTS needs is a system that replicates real life GT racing - per-race BOP.

Setting the BOP at the start of the season, based on single-lap pace of one track (or an average of single-lap pace at a number of tracks) and then letting everyone is... not conducive to close racing. The point of BOP isn't to qualify in the same time, it's to finish the race in the same time.

The cars should be equalised as closely as possible for the track they're racing at and it should take into account stint lengths. If two cars have identical lap times, but over a 12-lap race one needs a pit stop and the other doesn't, the car that stops will lose 30 seconds. That should be reflected in the BOP - that car should be more than two seconds a lap faster.

With tens of thousands of players driving all of the cars at all of the tracks in the FIA Championships, this data shouldn't be that hard to assemble.

 

[CodeRedR51]

Probably true, but the problem is that very few manufacturers do cars that are rear wheel drive. If I was a manufacturer then I would want my latest cars in game so you really need a section that has FF cars in it (Even BMW's 1 series is now FF). I still hold that they could make it work if they just changed the criteria of testing a little (test pace over 3 laps instead of say 1) and reduced the tyre wear a little.

It is possible to balance RR and FF cars in a championship with a bit of effort

But Gr4 is based on the GT4 class, where FF has no presence. We're missing quite a few GT4 cars, I would rather have those in place of the current FF cars.

 

[Famine]

But Gr4 is based on the GT4 class, where FF has no presence.

The front-wheel drive Audi TT is indeed homologated in GT4.