GT6: GT3 vs. Super GT500 vs. Super GT300

[Mt. Lynx]

GTS didn't replace GT1, it replaced GT2.

GT1 was removed completely after 1998, and even though a GT1 class came later which replaced GTS it Didn't have the same Homologation rules, even though by then those cars where now lapping the same speed as the Superior rule set 90s version.

Ah, but GTS did replace GT1 as the top GT class in the FIA and ACO. Cars previously (pre -98) destined for GT2, was then to be in GTS, true, but GT2 was replaced by GT/N-GT as the second class.

 

[mustafur]

Ah, but GTS did replace GT1 as the top GT class in the FIA and ACO. Cars previously (pre -98) destined for GT2, was then to be in GTS, true, but GT2 was replaced by GT/N-GT as the second class.

Im talking about the Rule set, not the name.

 

[Mt. Lynx]

Im talking about the Rule set, not the name.

Well, since I was the one who brought this up, and I was only explaining succession, not homologation rules, wich you brought up...

 

[HKS racer]

Which class I prefer?

Here's my answer:
Livery Editor + self made balance of performance + AI using the cars I want.

 

[Gejabo]

Which class I prefer?

Here's my answer:
Livery Editor + self made balance of performance + AI using the cars I want.

And here is me thinking we were talking about real racing series to play in the game.

Silly me..

 

[HKS racer]

And here is me thinking we were talking about real racing series to play in the game.

Silly me..

Since SGT500 and SGT300 feature some random SuperGT cars from different seasons and the GT3 cars can be counted with the fingers of one hand, pretending to simulate real racing series is kind of silly indeed.

 

[Metfanant]

Nope. The other way around. The GTE cars have more trick aero and more mechanical grip. Although laptimes are very similar these days. In many cases GT3 cars are actually faster over a lap.

As for GT1 cars, here's the deal:
The Viper GTS-R and the Vette C5-R raced under the GTS monicker wich replaced GT1 when it died in -98. GTS eas rebranded to GT1 in 2003. Gran Turismo series have no representation from the latest GT1 era though.
That said, the Zonda LM and Ford GT LM spec II, do have real life counterparts in the GTS Class Zonda GR and the Matech Ford GT1.
Another car that raced in the old GT1 class, but in Gran Turismo is represented as a made up LM car, is the Jaguar XJ220 LM.

GT2 cars are only represented by BMW IIRC, with from GT6, 2 cars.

In terms of speed, the old GT1 class can be compared with the old LMP900 cars. GTS was about 7s faster around Spa than current GTE and GT3

so then United Sportscar Racing is going to SERIOUSLY be limiting the GT3 cars that find their way into the GTD class next year...because its not going to be a good idea to have the lower class outpacing the GTLM (GTE) cars...

 

[Zuel]

How is that @Metfanant? Though you comment may better in the motorsports thread

 

[Metfanant]

How is that @Metfanant? Though you comment may better in the motorsports thread

well according to USR regulations...GT3 cars are going to be eligible for the GTD class long with the existing GT cars from Gram-Am (which are slower)...The GTLM class is in line with regulations for GTE so that teams like Corvette Racing, and SRT Motorsports can keep their invitations to compete at Le Mans...

so if GT3 cars are as fast around the track as GTE...then USR is going to have issues with its "lower" class outpacing the higher GT class...

 

[Zuel]

The GTD and GTE cars are in miles apart in aerodynamics, weight and power. If I remember correctly @Metfanant the GTE car are 500kg lighter and produce an extra 500 pound of down force. Power numbers I couldn't tell you due to each manufacture will have there own power numbers.

 

[Metfanant]

The GTD and GTE cars are in miles apart in aerodynamics, weight and power. If I remember correctly @Metfanant the GTE car are 500kg lighter and produce an extra 500 pound of down force. Power numbers I couldn't tell you due to each manufacture will have there own power numbers.

I understand...but there are those saying here that GT3 cars are just as fast (if not faster), and make more power (?) than GTE cars...so what modifications is USR going to mandate for GT3 cars so that they fit their specifications for GTD?

 

[Cap'n Jack]

@Metfanant I believe the GT3 spec cars will use a spec-rear wing and front splitter which produce much less downforce, amongst other changes I'm not entirely sure about. But yeah, you are absolutely correct - the GT3 cars will be dumbed down quite a bit, even more than need be, in my opinion.

 

[Metfanant]

@Metfanant I believe the GT3 spec cars will use a spec-rear wing and front splitter which produce much less downforce, amongst other changes I'm not entirely sure about. But yeah, you are absolutely correct - the GT3 cars will be dumbed down quite a bit, even more than need be, in my opinion.

i really, really wish EVERYONE could decide on an internationally recognized set of regulations and just stick to them...something like:

P1
P2
GT1
GT2
GT3

would just make so much sense (to me)...then a race series just has to pick and choose which classes to support...


- For instance...take SRT Motorsports as an example because they have cars that meet both regulations...

You have them working with 2 cars...The GTS-R and the GT3-R

http://www.drivesrt.com/racing/viper-gts-r/
http://www.drivesrt.com/racing/viper-gt3r/

Now, they are more forthcoming with specifications on the GT3-R (presumably because its a customer car)...but whats the difference??? The GTS-R is obviously is/was in the ALMS GT class (now USR GTLM) and the GTE class at Le Mans...the GT3-R is listed as:

FIA GT3
United SportsCar Racing GT Daytona
Pirelli World Challenge GT
NARRA
SCCA/NASA

 

[Zuel]

GT3 is GTLM @Metfanant GTD more of a GT4 class or American GT3. The major difference between world (FIA) GT3 and American GT3 are in the aerodynamics and weight. FIA GT3 had more freedom to do as they will with the limits of ruling with aerodynamics though the ruling body set the weight and power of each car after testing. American GT3 or GT4 through FIA ruling had a set ruling set ruling for weight to drive train, power to drive train along with a set manufacture aerodynamic package that keep the car as close as possible though some drive trains performed better on different track and conditions.

Now that FIA or ISMA have become or became the two controlling or single controlling race body pending how you look the race ruling have became or will become more streamed line in the world of racing. The racing world has evolved greatly within 15 years and things have changed for the worse and best pending on your insight to the issue. Though it will allow more individuals or privately owned teams to be involved in motorsports at a larger scale.

 

[Zuel]

You can look at NARRA, SCCA/NASA as your feeder racing championship; series just as a karting championship or series. Pirelli World Challenge GT would be more along the line of a multiple manufacture driver development cup championship @Metfanant .If the current GX class carries over to next year (Haven't been able to keep up due to school, working on a new club, and life) will fall in line with a multiple manufacture cup, or entry championship to the higher level of racing.

 

[Metfanant]

@Zuel

so if thats the case...

GT/GTLM(ALMS/USR) = GT3(FIA) = GTE(LeMans)??

then what do we make of the two different Vipers??

GTS-R = GTLM, GTE
GT3-R = FIA GT3, GTD

 

[Zuel]

@Metfanant

Correct on the Vipers.
GTS-R, FIA GT3 (R)=GTE=GTLM
FIA-GT4, American GT3 (GT4)= GTD

 

[Metfanant]

@Metfanant

Correct on the Vipers.
GTS-R, FIA GT3 (R)=GTE=GTLM
FIA-GT4, American GT3 (GT4)= GTD

SO...just to cover all basis...

GT1 = dead
GT2 = dead
FIA GT3 = GTLM (USR) = GTE (LeMans)

am i correct there?...

so my assumptions...is that the FIA GT3 cars that (may) enter GTD as part of USR...will likely have less aggressive aero packages, and probably some power restrictions to slow them down??

Now with the Vipers...seemingly the two cars are VERY similar...the GT3-R just being the customer version? I then also will assume that a Viper GT3-R entered in the actual FIA GT3 championships...would be much faster around the track...then one entered in USR GTD???

 

[Zuel]

GT1,GT2 is no longer viable or active, FIA GT3, GTE are now GT Le Mans, GT3 CUP will flow into less aggressive aerodynamically American GT3 (FIA GT4 ruling) is now GTD GT Daytona. GTD will have a set aerodynamic package for each manufacture along with power, GTE will also have power grade or number to each manufacture also be able to have more aggressive over tube along with a diffuser and lighter.

 

[sk8er913]

@Zuel

so if thats the case...

GT/GTLM(ALMS/USR) = GT3(FIA) = GTE(LeMans)??

then what do we make of the two different Vipers??

GTS-R = GTLM, GTE
GT3-R = FIA GT3, GTD

You forgot the Rover, "NASA" regulations. XD XD!!!!! I just had too

 

[YayoiGT2]

FIA GT3 = GTLM (USR) = GTE (LeMans)

am i correct there?...

Not quite; GTE and GTLM are the successors to the previously GT2 class of cars. They're fairly similar in regulations, it's just that the GTE cars are newer and developed to a greater degree. Compare Porsche's 991 GTE car to for example, the 997 GT3-RSR or 996 GT3-RS.

 

[Metfanant]

Not quite; GTE and GTLM are the successors to the previously GT2 class of cars. They're fairly similar in regulations, it's just that the GTE cars are newer and developed to a greater degree. Compare Porsche's 991 GTE car to for example, the 997 GT3-RSR or 996 GT3-RS.

well from my understanding the whole point of USR's GTLM class was to stay inline with the requirements for those teams still being eligible for Le Mans...so i would assume they conform to the GTE standards exactly...

 

[Cap'n Jack]

GT3 is GTLM

No it's not. GT3 and GTLM are completely different classes. GTLM was formerly GT2. No GT3 spec car is eligible for GTLM, GT Pro or GT Am (as the class is known as in the ELMS/WEC). FIA GT3 has never, in its existence, been equivalent to GT2, GT Pro/Am/LM

GTD more of a GT4 class or American GT3.

Not quite. GT4 is much more production based than GTD (formerly Grand Am GT). GA GT featured cars which were far removed from their production counterparts, some not even production based at all, the same for GTD. GTD would be more equivalent to the ELMS GTC class, although obviously not quite the same regulations-wise; the main similarities being both classes feature cars originally built to FIA GT3 specification.

You need to read up a bit more on GT racing, Zuel. I've seen you posting a lot of misinformation throughout GTPlanet, it's great that you're trying to help others but it will only lead to confusion on their part. And while others have tried to correct you in the past, you still keep it up. Your enthusiasm for racing is fantastic but your knowledge doesn't quite go the same length.

SO...just to cover all basis...

GT1 = dead
GT2 = dead
FIA GT3 = GTLM (USR) = GTE (LeMans)

am i correct there?...

GT1 = Dead
GT2 = GTLM/GT Pro/Am
GT3 = GA GT/GTD*

*Basically but, as previously stated, the cars have been modified to be competitive with the non-GT3 based cars in the class (eg. Mazda 6, Chevrolet Camaro, Porsche 911 GT America).

so my assumptions...is that the FIA GT3 cars that (may) enter GTD as part of USR...will likely have less aggressive aero packages, and probably some power restrictions to slow them down??

Correct. 👍

Now with the Vipers...seemingly the two cars are VERY similar...the GT3-R just being the customer version? I then also will assume that a Viper GT3-R entered in the actual FIA GT3 championships...would be much faster around the track...then one entered in USR GTD???

While they look very similar on the outside, they are both built to different specifications. I'm not sure on the exact differences between both cars though. The GT3-R is built for customers, correct, and yes, a GT3-R racing in, say, the Blancpain Endurance Championship (an endurance championship for FIA GT3 spec cars) would be quite a bit faster than one racing in the GTD class.


Also, sorry for further dragging this thread off-topic.

 

[05XR8]

Trying to make a "realistic" series for SGT is only a bit difficult becasue there arent enought SGT tracks. And since its a JDM series (even if they raced at California and Malyasia), it feels less authentic, to me, racing outside of Japan. GT3 races are pretty much everywhere. GT6 fantasy tracks give us some alternatives but, some of them are plain insane (Eiger..ahem..). DTM tracks are few as well. We'll have ro see what we get as future DLC.

I believe GT3 will feel at home at any track. From Laguna Seca to Ascari. Apricot Hill to Special Stage 5. Mainly Spa at night. Mount Panorama at 5am. Silverstone at high noon. Nurburgring at dusk.

 

[Zuel]

I do understand and know the GT2 ruling and how it was divided into Pro/Am not to long ago, though with performance ruling that was done in the later part of 2012 GT2 spec car basically gone or either filtered up or down in class. And from the last IMSA and FIA briefs they clearly stated that current Le Mans FIA GT3 race car will stay in place and will be classed as GTLM. It did state anything of or about GT2. I believe I still have the IMSA TUDOR PDF's saved that also states the FIA GT3 cars along with P2, PC GTD and GX.

Addition:

You know as well as I do with upcoming performance ruling GT2 may never a solid racing body as before.

 

[Mt. Lynx]

The differenced between GTE and GT3, are how they are built. GTE follows a fairly strict formula of construction, whereas GT3 basically only have a power-to-weight ratio to follow at its core. Usually GT3 class cars have between 550 and 650 bhp, where GTE runs around 500 bhp. GTE have a weight limit at 1250kg, but a GT3 car can weigh in at above 1400kg (but also as low as under 1200kg), depending on how much power the homologated car have.
Before every season starts, GT3 runs a performance test, and from that they get designated restrictors, weight and even wings, to make for as level a playing field as possible.
In GTE, the mfg's themselves have to apply for technical changes they want, and then it's up to ACO to grant these bent rules to the mfg (f ex the BMW M3 GTR transaxle) A sort of self regulatory balance of performance.

 

[Zuel]

OK, now where getting off track to what the OP is asking for. So let me try and redirect, with almost 103 votes stating yes people will be more likely to run GT3 more than the other class. With that said I have few questions; are some of you going to carry some of the same tuning methods used in GT5 over to GT6 knowing that the physics have changed greatly? Or will you explore to see what will carry over from GT5? If we have the same build option as in upgrading the motor with engine upgrade along with adding larger turbocharger or a supercharger. The reason why I ask these questions is due to the similarities in tuning methods used GT5. I wounder how many may care it over once GT6 in ower hands and we get to exploring the setting.

 

[05XR8]

OK, now where getting off track to what the OP is asking for. So let me try and redirect, with almost 103 votes stating yes people will be more likely to run GT3 more than the other class. With that said I have few questions; are some of you going to carry some of the same tuning methods used in GT5 over to GT6 knowing that the physics have changed greatly? Or will you explore to see what will carry over from GT5? If we have the same build option as in upgrading the motor with engine upgrade along with adding larger turbocharger or a supercharger. The reason why I ask these questions is due to the similarities in tuning methods used GT5. I wounder how many may care it over once GT6 in ower hands and we get to exploring the setting.

Im hoping to run stock cars with only suspension tuning and tire compound choices. Heres hoping no one change the oil when they buy the car to keep all engines stock (aint gonna happen).

 

[o9lifted]

Voted not sure yet, I've raced alot of gt500 in gt5 and I know gt300 gives really good close racing. I'm really really interested in the gt3 class much much because of the cars but I'm sure the gt500 are faster and probably more cars in the grid so I don't really know yet until I get my hands on them. Two more weeks brothers

 

[xStretch-]

I only race GT500's online really so thats my main request. Would have been good to move over to new DTM cars but meh lol

How many GT3 cars are there in GT6?