- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
New F1 Qualifying Format for 2016.
- Thread starter Furinkazen
- 377 comments
- 17,613 views
- 534
- Jakarta
- Chiyo_Cute
Hey guys, I have a CRAZY idea which I thought it's going to mix up the grid 100% and fairly (at least for the teams, not so fair for the drivers).
I'm sorry if this has been said before, but.. let me explain:
So my new qualifying idea is to split it into 2 sessions.
Session 1 (or Q1) is around 30 minutes, where everybody can just fly as fast as they could, put their best times.
And then based on the result, each of the slower driver of the same team will drop out, and the faster driver will advance to Session 2 (Q2)
CRAZY right?
YES.
so we got 11 drivers of each team at the bottom of the grid, including Hamilton or Rosberg, and Vettel or Raikkonen.
in Q2 the remaining 11 drivers (the faster ones of their team mate) will run again to finalize the grid.
So it will look similarly like this:
1. Lewis Hamilton
2. Sebastian Vettel
3. Daniel Ricciardo
4. Valtteri Bottas
5. Nico Hulkenberg
6. Romain Grosjean
7. Max Verstappen
8. Stoffel Vandoorne
9. Pascal Wehrlein
10. Marcus Ericsson
11. Kevin Magnussen
12. Nico Rosberg
13. Kimi Raikkonen
14. Daniil Kvyat
15. Felipe Massa
16. Carlos Sainz Jr
17. Esteban Gutierrez
18. Jenson Button
19. Sergio Perez
20. Jolyon Palmer
21. Rio Haryanto
22. Felipe Nasr
Now look at that exciting grid!
Not only it will mix up the grid, but also the championship! it's going to be fully unpredictable until the last race!
In Q1, we will watch so many fights between team mates, which is so exciting.
In Q2, we will watch fights between teams, like Hamilton vs Vettel, etc.
And then the day after, we will get a dramatic improvement of F1 race, lots of overtaking from p11, p12, p13 to the top of the field!!!
I'm sorry if this has been said before, but.. let me explain:
So my new qualifying idea is to split it into 2 sessions.
Session 1 (or Q1) is around 30 minutes, where everybody can just fly as fast as they could, put their best times.
And then based on the result, each of the slower driver of the same team will drop out, and the faster driver will advance to Session 2 (Q2)
CRAZY right?
YES.
so we got 11 drivers of each team at the bottom of the grid, including Hamilton or Rosberg, and Vettel or Raikkonen.
in Q2 the remaining 11 drivers (the faster ones of their team mate) will run again to finalize the grid.
So it will look similarly like this:
1. Lewis Hamilton
2. Sebastian Vettel
3. Daniel Ricciardo
4. Valtteri Bottas
5. Nico Hulkenberg
6. Romain Grosjean
7. Max Verstappen
8. Stoffel Vandoorne
9. Pascal Wehrlein
10. Marcus Ericsson
11. Kevin Magnussen
12. Nico Rosberg
13. Kimi Raikkonen
14. Daniil Kvyat
15. Felipe Massa
16. Carlos Sainz Jr
17. Esteban Gutierrez
18. Jenson Button
19. Sergio Perez
20. Jolyon Palmer
21. Rio Haryanto
22. Felipe Nasr
Now look at that exciting grid!
Not only it will mix up the grid, but also the championship! it's going to be fully unpredictable until the last race!
In Q1, we will watch so many fights between team mates, which is so exciting.
In Q2, we will watch fights between teams, like Hamilton vs Vettel, etc.
And then the day after, we will get a dramatic improvement of F1 race, lots of overtaking from p11, p12, p13 to the top of the field!!!
Last edited:
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- 2,281
- Moss
- hoydeskrekk
I don't see how an aggregate system will do anything to mix up the front row. It'll probably work for mid-field and the back, where drivers are less consistent and the cars are more closely matched. The Mercs just seem to be so much faster than the rest on a consistent basis that I think it'll make little to no difference. Ferrari have yet to prove they can go head to head with them in qualifying, they seem to focus on consistent race pace rather than raw speed over a single lap.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
I don't think anyone is trying to mix up the front rows. We already know Mercedes have an iron grip on it.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
The promoters think we do.
The real mystery is why the FIA and FOM listened to thrm, given that they were responsible for the double points travesty.
The real mystery is why the FIA and FOM listened to thrm, given that they were responsible for the double points travesty.
- 2,938
- Shrewsbury
- pezzarinho17
It's a horrendous situation really: The promoters don't want Mercedes and Ferrari topping the grid every race; The teams want a system that benefits them more than the others; The FIA can't be impartial in the matter. Might as well get it over with and let grid positions be randomly selected from a hat...
- 6,515
- Southampton
- RacingAtHome
I don't know how it's taken me so long to realise a major positive in terms of tyres for aggregate qualifying.
Basically, one of the issues in Australia was that teams were running out of Supersoft tyres. Aggregate qualifying would mean that each driver would only need to use 2 sets of tyres thus increasing the availabilty of the softer tyres in the race.
Basically, one of the issues in Australia was that teams were running out of Supersoft tyres. Aggregate qualifying would mean that each driver would only need to use 2 sets of tyres thus increasing the availabilty of the softer tyres in the race.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
No, they want bums on seats in every session. They feel that the old system of qualifying wasn't exciting enough to attract audiences, but you'll note that they never gave any explanation as to what they would consider "exciting".
Like I said following Melbourne qualifying - I think the FIA (or at least the promoters) had grand visions of drivers racing one another to the line in a desperate bid to avoid elimination ... which clearly didn't happen.
- 9,554
- Vermont
- catamount39
Please tell me it's nothing like the aggregate qualifying back in 05'.
That is exactly what Bernie is trying to do, that's why he had the reverse grid top 10 idea, anything he could think of to push Mercedes down the grid.
It's basically identical to the 2015 system but instead of just taking the best lap from each session to determine the order, their best two laps are aggregated and that is the order.
- 9,554
- Vermont
- catamount39
- 2,998
- England
- Peasantslayer
- 534
- Jakarta
- Chiyo_Cute
Why must teams have to agree to a new qualifying format? as if our current qualifying format has been agreed by them? or has it? cmiiw..
And I don't think it's a gimmick actually, think of it like this: only one car of each team can occupy each half of the starting grid, and the faster drivers earn the first half.
True, but hamilton or rosberg, it doesn't really matter anymore for now..
at least in the race we get to see one of them climbing up from p11 which is going to be interesting to watch!Not fair to the drivers who is constantly beaten by his team mate.. but because of a long 30 minutes Q1, they have the time to get it right, so if within 30 minutes they still can't beat their team mate, then I say it's fair to place them in the back half of the grid.
Unlike our current system, where Manor drivers (for example) only have like 1 or 2 shot to get it right, which is very unfair to me..
That is how F1 currently works. Not all teams, but the 6 that sit on the Working Group. Yes, they did all agree to the current system. They, along with the FIA and FOM, have to unanimously agree on any proposal.
So even if they have the second fastest time behind their team mate it's fair for them to start no better than 11th? That is the pure definition of a gimmick.
- 20,685
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
How do you persuade Mercedes, for example, to continue spending $200m a year to win races when they know that one of their cars will always start in the dangerous midfield? It's a gimmick fo'sho.
You'll tell them what a great show for the fans, I guess? Newsflash; Mercedes (or Ferrari, or Red Bull, or McLaren, or Williams) might love racing but that's not the reason they're all still around.
dopedog
(Banned)
- 880
- United Kingdom
Silly thing is Merc are so far ahead that if one did qualify at the back it would be towards the front anyway after a few laps, only problem being because of that your robbed of watching 2 Mercs i.e similar quality cars race together at the front. Yesterday showed that as Roseburg was just untroubled at the front whole race....
Whilst we have almost a class spec grid class A/B/C and the rest we the only fun of top cars out of grid place is the first few laps. Would i rather watch Lewis or Nico blitzing past cars for a few laps as they get back to 2nd place or would i rather see Lewis and Nico battling.... well the latter..but truth is i'd rather just be watching MotoGP...
Whilst we have almost a class spec grid class A/B/C and the rest we the only fun of top cars out of grid place is the first few laps. Would i rather watch Lewis or Nico blitzing past cars for a few laps as they get back to 2nd place or would i rather see Lewis and Nico battling.... well the latter..but truth is i'd rather just be watching MotoGP...
- 31,893
- Buckwheat City
- Dennisch
Bernie lashes out at the whiney drivers.
Bernie Ecclestone says drivers "shouldn't even be allowed to talk" and are only interesting in making money from Formula One.
The Grand Prix Drivers' Association (GPDA) recently called for an overhaul of F1's "obsolete and ill-structured"governance, which it felt had been shown up by the ongoing uncertainty and lack of decision over qualifying. F1 boss Ecclestone wrote back to the drivers asking for them to put forward some suggestions of how to fix the sport in its current guise.
However, speaking in Bahrain, Ecclestone said drivers are self-interested and only care about the sport because it rewards them so well financially.
"What sort of interest do they have, the drivers, other than taking money out of the sport?" Ecclestone said. "I've never seen one of them put one dollar in, you go to dinner with them and they don't even pay the bill. They shouldn't even be allowed to talk. They should get in the car and drive it."
One of the concerns the GPDA letter raised was the move away from free-to-air TV, highlighted by the recent announcement that Sky will be the exclusive broadcaster in the UK from 2019.
Asked why F1 did not want to extend Channel 4's current deal, which allows it to show a certain amount of races live on free TV alongside Sky's coverage, he said: "But more people watch Sky ... The world is changing unfortunately in lots of wrong ways."
Ecclestone understands why people would not want to pay to watch TV when he has previously said he personally would not buy a ticket to watch F1 in its current guise.
"Sky say that they are going to start broadcasting to 25 million people who will be able to watch it, if they want to. The problem is today is do they want to? Because I got slaughtered for saying that I wouldn't buy a ticket for a Formula One race, which is true I wouldn't.
"Because I know full well before I go to the race who's going to be first, who's going to be second and there's no racing that's going to happen anyway. So why would I want to sit in the bloody grandstand for with my wife and two kids or somebody else's wife, for what? To see what?"
Bernie Ecclestone says drivers "shouldn't even be allowed to talk" and are only interesting in making money from Formula One.
The Grand Prix Drivers' Association (GPDA) recently called for an overhaul of F1's "obsolete and ill-structured"governance, which it felt had been shown up by the ongoing uncertainty and lack of decision over qualifying. F1 boss Ecclestone wrote back to the drivers asking for them to put forward some suggestions of how to fix the sport in its current guise.
However, speaking in Bahrain, Ecclestone said drivers are self-interested and only care about the sport because it rewards them so well financially.
"What sort of interest do they have, the drivers, other than taking money out of the sport?" Ecclestone said. "I've never seen one of them put one dollar in, you go to dinner with them and they don't even pay the bill. They shouldn't even be allowed to talk. They should get in the car and drive it."
One of the concerns the GPDA letter raised was the move away from free-to-air TV, highlighted by the recent announcement that Sky will be the exclusive broadcaster in the UK from 2019.
Asked why F1 did not want to extend Channel 4's current deal, which allows it to show a certain amount of races live on free TV alongside Sky's coverage, he said: "But more people watch Sky ... The world is changing unfortunately in lots of wrong ways."
Ecclestone understands why people would not want to pay to watch TV when he has previously said he personally would not buy a ticket to watch F1 in its current guise.
"Sky say that they are going to start broadcasting to 25 million people who will be able to watch it, if they want to. The problem is today is do they want to? Because I got slaughtered for saying that I wouldn't buy a ticket for a Formula One race, which is true I wouldn't.
"Because I know full well before I go to the race who's going to be first, who's going to be second and there's no racing that's going to happen anyway. So why would I want to sit in the bloody grandstand for with my wife and two kids or somebody else's wife, for what? To see what?"
- 13,328
- GTPlanet
- Street-King-07
- Quattro Saltire
It's time that little hobbit troll Ecclestone quit for saying the drivers shouldn't voice their opinions. What's next? Banning drivers from being interviewed by the media duting the weekend?
Utterly ludicrous.
Utterly ludicrous.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
Sounds like he's venting frustration more than anything else. Between the FIA, the teams, the promoters and FOM, the sport's governance is complex enough as is. Inviting a fifth party to the table when everyone is already at loggerheads with one another seems like a bad idea.
- 6,293
- Canada
Can't disagree, but saying "inviting a 5th party when everyone is already at loggerheads" is slightly different than saying "drivers only have their own self interest in mind. They contribute nothing to the sport, they should just shut up and drive. Now will someone please buy my broke ass some lunch?"
The driver's letter was them venting their frustration, but they managed to do it in a much better way.
And who the hell is Bernie to accuse others that they're only in the sport to make money. If that's not a pot and kettle situation, I don't know what is.
dopedog
(Banned)
- 880
- United Kingdom
In bernies defense people these days rant on about the "stale PR driven drivers scared to say anything outrageous" then when Bernie comes along and talks from the heart and Alonso slags off Jonny Herbert the internet melts.
Look, whatever Bernie is doing its generating gossip and panto and intrigue.... I say he pretty clever with this. Its entertainment and this is entertaining when the racing on track is so dull.
Thank God i'm not one of those people who only follows F1 and nothing else as its apparently some sort of 'pinnacle' ... whilst Moto3 Moto2 and Moto GP and BTCC exist i don't care frankly if F1 just disappeared..
Look, whatever Bernie is doing its generating gossip and panto and intrigue.... I say he pretty clever with this. Its entertainment and this is entertaining when the racing on track is so dull.
Thank God i'm not one of those people who only follows F1 and nothing else as its apparently some sort of 'pinnacle' ... whilst Moto3 Moto2 and Moto GP and BTCC exist i don't care frankly if F1 just disappeared..
- 20,685
- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
Why? He doesn't work for them and they don't work for him.
Unlikely, and it's not as though they have a choice - it's mandatory for the drivers' employers (the teams) to make them available for interviews... because it suits Bernie.
Why isn't it, if I take your point correctly?
- 30,400
- Bratvegas
Which is how it was done in motor racing before qualifying as we know it was invented at Monaco 1933.
I still maintain that the old system of 12 laps and that's it is the best way; Friday session, Saturday session and whichever of your times is the fastest counts. Brundle was spot on when he said that qualifying doesn't need to be gimmicked and that the third tyre has done wonders for on-track action.
I know it's frivolous writing these things on fora where it will go perpetually unknown to the powers that be at the FIA and FOM but... NO GIMMICKS NEEDED!
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