FEEDBACK FOR POLYPHONY DIGITAL: Less Forcing & More Options Please!

  • Thread starter VBR
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Sorry I've added quite a few more options there. I used to specify software systems for a living so always see how lots of extra options can make things more useable based on what users want to do. Everything in this thread would really help people get the most out of GT6. The way to improve the game is to listen to how people want to play it. Hopefully some of what we want/need will be present in the much needed community upgrade once that materialises.


No need to apologize, I asked people to post up what options should be available. I'll try & update the OP with as many as I can as I get the time. Hopefully PD will listen.

Got anymore?
 
Option for AI aggression and speed individually, everywhere in game where ai are raced against, except where there is a test or some other fixed skill level being tested or something I suppose.


Sadly, PD and KAZ will never listen to anyone, and this thread was created in vain.
 
BWX
Option for AI aggression and speed individually, everywhere in game where ai are raced against, except where there is a test or some other fixed skill level being tested or something I suppose.
You got my vote! 👍

BWX
Sadly, PD and KAZ will never listen to anyone, and this thread was created in vain.
I wouldn't be so sure of that.

I do wonder if anyone at PD is actually reading any of the player feedback from this or any other GT6 related forum?

VBR
@Johnnypenso - I have some hope that they do listen & can give us some of these options, because they did give us the option to turn off driver names which was asked for here. Also, they included the option in GT6 that was asked for here too.
VBR is referring to these two links:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...s-when-racing-online-optional-in-1-05.293888/

https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...real-setting-now-added-to-gt6-lobbies.271087/

I'm half drunk, sorry for the long links :cheers:
 
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Just because a couple of things mentioned here do get corrected doesn't mean they're listening to us, it can also be merely coincidence. After GT5 came out there was a huge feedback section here, where people suggested tracks, cars and features for GT5 and the future. The vast majority of those were not added in GT5 and still don't exist in GT6, some of them extremely simple.
 
@Samus - Most of the suggestions in this thread are things that could be done very easily & quickly, not really comparable to car/track/feature wish lists, most of which would take lots of time & resources to implement. Whereas allowing us the option to turn SRF off everywhere in the game for instance, could be achieved in a just few minutes by a PD employee & included in the next update.
 
@VBR

The same thing was with GT5 too, guess we'll just have to wait for updates about two or more years for the game to be completely polished and complete.

As much as I enjoyed this, PC gaming is still the place to be if you wish to be treated like an adult.

Sorry to crash your party but this is irrelevant. I've encountered a lot of so called 'kids' and 'adults' in both PS3 and PC (even had a chance to play PSP online) games and considering how the gaming market is growing up in every day, this brings us the newcomers to all platforms and yadda yadda yadda, I'm already off topic.
 
VBR
@Samus - Most of the suggestions in this thread are things that could be done very easily & quickly, not really comparable to car/track/feature wish lists, most of which would take lots of time & resources to implement. Whereas allowing us the option to turn SRF off everywhere in the game for instance, could be achieved in a just few minutes by a PD employee & included in the next update.
True, but the same was correct when they started forcing SRF in GT5 seasonals, they haven't listened since then.
 
True, but the same was correct when they started forcing SRF in GT5 seasonals, they haven't listened since then.


They did listen to two things though, hence this thread. No harm done in trying. 👍
 
Nice thread VBR, I havent read through it all yet but i'll read it tonight during my quite time at work :)

Let's hope PD or even better Kaz will notice this and starts to make some serious changes to GT. pCARS is out later this year and by the sounds of what I have been reading and seeing in video footages of pCARS, PD should be very worried indeed.

I fear for PD's sake we will see a mass exodus from GT to pCARS. My advice to PD would be not to be pressured to release GT7 early. If needed take some time and think about what we have been saying all this time and start implementing them, so be it if GT7 takes 2 years to make from now. If it is done correctly then all those people that will be buying pCARS will be back. But if it is rushed then not only will it be a disaster but they will probably lose their loyal fan base as well.

I think you should take it seriously PD, your name is at stake here.

*EDIT*

Your profile pic is hilarious, I p%$$ myself everytime I see it...lol
 
Nice thread VBR, I havent read through it all yet but i'll read it tonight during my quite time at work :)

Let's hope PD or even better Kaz will notice this and starts to make some serious changes to GT. pCARS is out later this year and by the sounds of what I have been reading and seeing in video footages of pCARS, PD should be very worried indeed.

I fear for PD's sake we will see a mass exodus from GT to pCARS. My advice to PD would be not to be pressured to release GT7 early. If needed take some time and think about what we have been saying all this time and start implementing them, so be it if GT7 takes 2 years to make from now. If it is done correctly then all those people that will be buying pCARS will be back. But if it is rushed then not only will it be a disaster but they will probably lose their loyal fan base as well.

I think you should take it seriously PD, your name is at stake here.

*EDIT*

Your profile pic is hilarious, I p%$$ myself everytime I see it...lol
Could I "like" this more than once please?

And I genuinely believe VBR's profile pic to be an actual image of himself. Don't care if it isn't. Every time I read his posts I see that guy saying it :P.
 
VBR
They did listen to two things though, hence this thread. No harm done in trying. 👍
Unfortunately 2 things out of dozens doesn't make a strong case for "listening" although I wish it were true. It looks more like coincidence given they also did stupid stuff like adding blue lines to qualifying "alone" when not a single person in the entire world (yes I can prove that:lol:) asked for that. And given one of the consistent requests for years and years is...wait for it..."OPTIONS"...to include the feature without the option to turn it off tells me they aren't listening at all, just randomly adding elements to the game on the basis of whims and brainstorms from the lunch room or watercooler.
 
WOW! For the first time in my life, I'm the optimist. ;) You're probably right though Johnny, but for the moment I shall hope against hope, that is until PD prove me entirely wrong. They did improve the clutch slightly in the 1.05 update, so maybe that's a trend that will continue if we keep making enough noise.


👍
 
Here is the GT5 feedback page on archive - https://web.archive.org/web/20130928095233/http://feedback.gtplanet.net/forums/96709-gt5-feedback

Standard to Premium - A few done.
More race events - GT6 has less than GT5, I believe.
Free DLC - Ok this was a bit of a silly request anyway but I guess they've done this.
More RM cars - Nope, they took this away again.
Drag racing - Still nothing official.
Fast Forward B-Spec - Didn't do it in GT5, not in GT6 at all yet.
More tracks with weather/time - They added a few, five I think? Decent.
Paint preview - Didn't for GT5, did for GT6.
Better sounds - Yeah, no.
More tracks - They did but sort of a given for GT6.

Most wanted cars.

BMW E30 - No
Senna's McLaren F1 - No
Koenigsegg CCX - No
Any Skoda - No
Ferrari FXX - Yes
Ariel Atom - No
Lamborghini Diablo - Yes
Premium Supra - No
New BMW M5s - No
Ferrari F50 - No
BMW M1 - No
1960s F1 - No
Bugatti Veyron Supersport - No
Reventon - Yes
Sierra Cosworth - No
Gumpert Apollo - No

That's why I get the feeling they're just hitting certain things by coincidence.
 
Could I "like" this more than once please?

And I genuinely believe VBR's profile pic to be an actual image of himself. Don't care if it isn't. Every time I read his posts I see that guy saying it :P.

Just look at his profile pic, he is so shocked and stressed that there is no shuffle.

The man is distraught PD, you got to help him out and stop him from pulling out all his hair!
 
On the whole I agree with OP's sentiments. There are so many ways to add depth to the racing experience simply by opening some options to the player or allowing the room host to set parameters.

A few examples:

- Allowing the host to create a 'championship' series of races. ie. 3 races back-to-back on different tracks.

- Allowing the host to set tyre parameters - eg. SS and RS must be run during the race.

- Allowing the drivers to choose their own fuel level for qualifying and/or race start.

- Allowing the option to tune setup between quail and race.


Of course this probably won't appeal to the masses who just want to race, but for those of us who appreciate the strategic side of racing, it gives us the option to nerd out !!
 
VBR
In so many areas us players are forced to do things a certain way, without being given any option to do otherwise (or sometimes we just have very limited options). In my humble opinion, this is one of the biggest problems with the way you approach game design at Polyphony Digital, & it impacts on many aspects of the game, causing much grief to those trying to enjoy it. You make it impossible for us to customize our Gran Turismo experience to our own liking, & many of us are left feeling frustrated &/or patronized.




Here are just a few examples of what I mean, in no particular order.


1) Skid Recovery Force: Why is SRF forced on? You give us no reason, therefore you come across as being unreasonable. You call it a "beginners aid" yet you force it upon all players at certain points throughout the game, even though many of them are not beginners! This contradiction makes no sense at all, & ruins our enjoyment of the physics model. Please, give us the option of turning it off everywhere in the game. Also, please give us separate online leaderboards for SRF Off, & SRF On lap times (like a tickbox filter). I understand that having it on by default helps those who are new to the GT series, but not allowing the more experienced players to turn it off is patronizing, & annoying. By giving us the option, you'll keep everyone happy, not just the inexperienced players. More Feedback For PD.

2) Automatic Traction Control: Why is traction control forced on if I go off track? If I have turned TC off, why is it forced back on? I can understand that it would help new players, but by forcing it on everyone you just end up aggravating the more experienced players. Please, allow us the option of turning it On or Off completely for ourselves, or just set it to On when track Grip is set to Low, & Off when Grip is set to Real. More Feedback For PD.

3) Auto Drive In The Pits: You trust us to drive around all these beautiful tracks you have recreated at very fast speeds, so why is it that you force Auto Drive on us in the pit lane when at very low speeds? This makes no sense whatsoever! Again, you are inadvertently patronizing the experienced players who have already proven that they are capable of handling their cars. Please, give us the option of turning Auto Drive in the pit lane On or Off when racing online, & offline too. A pit speed limiter button would be a welcome addition.

4) Global Traction Control: Why is there no global option to turn traction control off in certain events & license tests? It is really annoying to have to remember to turn it off every single time we enter a new one. Is there any reason why you force us to turn it off every single time? Please, give us a global option for traction control in these events so that once it's been turned off it stays off until we want to turn it back on again.

5) Automatic Replays: Why is there no option to turn off the automatic replays? Many people do not like being forced into watching them after each race, & having to press a button to turn them off every single time gets tiresome. Please, give us the option to choose whether to have them On or Off in the main menu. More Feedback For PD.

6) Default Driving View: Why is there no option to choose the default driving view? Why are we forced into "Normal View" every single time we start the game? For example; I go to Free Run & in the pit lane I'm forced into "Drivers Eye View", then I'm spat out of the pit lane & forced into "Normal View" again, & then I have to go through a series of unnecessary button presses in order to choose my preferred view. This gives the game a rather unprofessional, unfinished, & sloppy feel. Please, give us the option of choosing our default view in the main menu, or at the very least have the game permanently remember it & use it at all times (like when we're in the pit lane).

7) HUD Configuration: Why are the HUD options so restrictive? Is there any reason for the lack of options? Please, allow us the option of turning On or Off every single item of HUD individually to our liking, then give us the ability to toggle all the HUD on or off while racing via a simple button press. Having to pause the game & go to an off screen menu to do this is clunky, & cannot even be done while racing online without compromising our lap time/position. Also, why can we not turn the wrong way indicator off? This is something that is needed, especially by the drifting community. Besides, many of us know the tracks very well & do not need to be patronized with a flashing red symbol. More Feedback For PD.

8) Automatic Game Saves: Why are automatic game saves forced upon us? Is there a reason why you have given us no option to turn them off? I remember we did have the option in a previous GT title, & it was a very good thing to have too. I suspect that this might be causing corrupted game saves, because some people are moving between menus while saving is in progress. How ironic it is that the menus in GT6 are faster, but the Auto Save is slower! Please, give us the option to turn this feature On or Off in the main menu.

9) Power Limiter Online: Why is there no option to ban the use of the power limiter in online lobbies? It ruins PP based racing when everyone is choosing overpowered cars, & then pulling the BHP down 50% or so with the limiter. The power limiter is broken anyway as it creates a flattened BHP curve that gives them a power advantage over those who are choosing cars normally. Please, give hosts the option of allowing it or disallowing it & being able to set what percentage of power limiting is allowed.

10) NOS Online: Why is there no option to enable NOS in Tuning Prohibited Races? Many people enjoy racing without tuning, & if NOS could be independently allowed or disallowed, this would create a whole new racing experience for them. Is there any reason as to why, or have you simply not considered it? Please, give us the option to enable or disable NOS for Tuning Prohibited races, & One Make Races as well.

11) Motion Blur: Why is motion blur on some views, & not on others? At the moment the inclusion of motion blur seems to be random. It's on all views when spectating online, but when watching an online replay it's not on any views of my own car. It's not on any views when watching a replay of a Free Run, except the two interior car views. Why? Are you having problems with it, is it a bug, or is this deliberate for some reason? The most important views we want it on is all those whilst playing! Please, give us the option of turning it On or Off for all views in all modes, & then give us a slider so we can choose the amount applied.

12) Nag Screens: Why so many nag screens asking us to click OK or Cancel, & more importantly why no option to turn them off? When I enter a Time Trial for an event where the times are no longer being counted, why do I have to be reminded of it every single time I move from one screen to the next? If I've had the oil changed in my car, why do I need to click an OK button? Just tell me it's done, & then take me back to the GT Auto menu. This game is riddled with so many time wasting & entirely unnecessary button presses! Please, give us the option in the main menu to turn all such nag screens off, because forcing us to interact with them over & over again can become extremely annoying.

13) Name Changes: Is there any reason why we are limited to only 3 name changes? Please, allow us to change it as many times as we like, after all it is our name! Also, please allow online hosts to choose whether PSN names or driver names are displayed. First you forced us to have driver names in lobbies, then you forced us to have only PSN names! Why not simply give us the option to do either &/or both? Sometimes you think in such black or white terms & it shows in so many areas of the game, this being just one tiny example.

14) Blue Lines In Online Lobbies: In the 1.05 update, you have provided us with Blue Lines when qualifying. This seems to be another classic example of the 'either or/all or nothing' type thinking plaguing your studio & which is ruining the game for many of us, as you have not provided us with the option of turning them off! Why is this new feature being forced on us, is there any real reason for it? Some people find the lines very distracting (myself included), & being forced into having them on permanently is not only annoying, but also counter productive to getting fast lap times. Please, give us the option of turning them On or Off just like we can in other parts of the game. More Feedback For PD.

15) Slipstream & Mechanical Damage In Online Lobbies: In the 1.05 update, you have also added the options of Time Trial, Drift Trial & Free Run in online lobbies. Thank you! However, you have taken away the Slipstream & Mechanical Damage options in these 3 modes. We are now forced to drive with Slipstream set to 'dunno whatever', & no damage even if we want it. Is there any reason you have taken these options away from us? Please, give us the option to set Slipstream & Mechanical Damage as we wish in all online modes (& all offline modes as well).

16) Qualification In Online Lobbies: Why have you taken away the option of qualifying sessions that are under 5 minutes in the 1.05 update? Why are you forcing us into a minimum of 5 minutes, is there any reason behind this? Why thoughtlessly fiddle with things that are not even broken? If it ain't broke, don't fix it! Now you have made it impossible for us to set up 1 lap qualifying without wasting our time, especially for tracks that are around 1 minute in length. Please, let us choose the length of qualifying sessions starting at 1 minute & going up in 15 second increments, & also give us an alternative option of choosing the amount of laps for qualifying instead (from 1 lap upwards). More Feedback For PD.

17) Tyre wear/Fuel Depletion & Mechanical Damage: Is there any reason why we do not have these options in Career, Arcade, & Free Run modes offline? Why are you restricting us by taking options away & forcing us to do without them? I would very much like to drive in Free Run with all these options enabled, but you have taken this choice away from me & many others. Please, just allow us all options in all modes so that we can tailor our Gran Turismo experience to our own liking.

18) Tuning Restrictions In Online Lobbies: Why is it practically 'all or nothing' when it comes to tuning restrictions in online lobbies? You either allow us to tune, or not; why so black & white? Is there any reason for this? Please, give hosts the option to enable or disable each tuning function individually in online lobbies. Think of the potential variety of races that could be made by the community if only they were given the proper tools! Also, allow us to specify which individual car or cars are eligible, all you'd need to do is add 1 more tickbox option to the sort by Country/Manufacturer options.

19) Force Feedback Wheel & Pedal Options: Why do we only have 1 option for force feedback? I have a Logitech G25 & can only adjust the amount of feedback in this game. Is there any reason as to why you restrict us in this regard? Please, allow us a similar amount of FFB & pedal options as there are in most PC based simulators. And while we're on the subject; why did you change the bite point of the clutch to be at the bottom of the pedal travel? Are you trying to simulate a worn out clutch for all cars! This is extremely annoying for those of us who have spent large amounts of money on wheels/race seats to play Gran Turismo. Please, simulate 2 clutch types; a plate clutch with lots of slip (for road cars), & a dog box with virtually none (for race cars & Fully Customizable Transmission), then allow us to adjust the bite point to our liking. AND PLEASE STOP THROWING US INTO NEUTRAL!

20) 1:1 Wheel Animations - Cockpit Shake - Exterior View: Why did you remove 1:1 wheel animations from the GT series? Is it because they looked bad when players used a DS3? Please, have 1:1 animations default for wheels users, & what we have now default for DS3 users. And Please, give us the option of hiding the wheel & hands, as some of us who own steering wheels do not want to see another one on screen. Why add cockpit shake, & then remove it entirely after a just few complaints? Please, give players the option to decide whether they want it or not, an On/Off setting in the main menu would suffice. Why did you "fix" Exterior View, when it didn't even need fixing? Please, give players the option to choose between the old loose version & the more recent rigid one. 'Either Or' thinking is fallacious, as there is always more than just 2 ways of doing things! More Feedback For PD.

21) Standing Starts: Why are single file rolling starts forced upon us for most of the offline events? Why can we only have standing starts for most online races? Is there any reason for this? Again, you don't give us one, therefore you come across as being unreasonable. Please, give us a mixture of different start types in Career mode (suited to the event), & give us the option of choosing whatever start type we want online & in Arcade mode. More Feedback For PD.

22) Access To Garage In Free Run Mode Offline: Why is there no option to access our Garage in Free Run mode offline? Why do you force us to leave the track with all it's settings & go all the way back to the garage, change cars, & then return only to have to set the track up all over again? Is there any reason why you make changing between cars while trying to Free Run so awkward & time consuming? We can access our Garage & change between cars in an online lobby, so why not in Free Run offline? Please, give us the option to change between cars while at a track in Free Run mode.

23) 500 Car Garage Restriction: Why are we forced to choose from only 500 cars with no option of choosing from our other cars? Why did you restrict the garage in GT6 to only 500 cars, was it because loading times for online players were very slow? Please, give us several different garages containing 500 cars each (that we can name), & let us have access to all of them online so we can choose which garage to open. That way we'll have access to all our cars, & loading times won't be affected. Or, lift the garage restrictions entirely, & then using something similar to the Car Search feature for the dealerships, let us decide what cars to load first. More Feedback For PD.

24) Penalties & Ghost Cars In Online Lobbies: Why is there no option to have penalties on & ghost cars off at the same time? Why are we forced to have both either on of off? Cars ghosting & driving through each other looks incredibly unrealistic, & ruins the racing simulation for many of us. Please, give us the option of turning ghost cars & penalties On or Off individually. Also, please add the option of Drive Through penalties (like in GT4), & allow us to be able to choose between them & the Slow Down penalties we currently have.




A Cautionary Tale For Kazunori.


Once upon a time there was a master shoe maker. His shoes were the best shoes in the world, & he knew it. Everyone else knew it too, & his designs were the envy of all other shoe makers. Try though they might, they could not even come close to mimicking his great artistic flair. However, while his designs were indeed second to none, he would only sell shoes that were tailored to his own feet & that of those closest to him; much to the annoyance of his customers! When they bought his shoes, they never really fitted properly, & this caused them such discomfort. Some of the other shoe makers, although creating designs inferior to his, eventually became far more business savvy & started tailoring their shoes to their customers feet. As a result, many of the master shoe maker's customers stopped buying his shoes altogether, even though they were far better looking, because now they had experienced the relief of tailored footwear & therefore could no longer go back. When the master shoe maker saw that sales were plummeting, he said to himself, "Aha! I know what I shall do! I will keep on designing shoes according to my great artistic talent, for it is second to none, but I also will tailor them to my customers feet just like my rivals. Then, not only will I be the best in the business, but I will also win back my customers & keep their feet happy too!"


That's so true! If they gave us all the options under the sun as requested, they could still set up the default settings to make Gran Turismo appeal to casual gamers initially. That way they'd keep everyone happy, as the more experienced players could then simply tailor the game to their own liking by changing said options. With a certain "Community Assisted Racing Simulator" coming out on the PS4 later this year, which is packed full of options, the GT series is in real danger of being left behind for dead & eating it's dust.


Thank you very much indeed Kazunori Yamauchi San, Polyphony Digital, & Sony, for considering these points. :cheers:






PS: There are many more examples of our being forced instead of being given options that I don't have time to write up at the moment, & some that I can't recall at present. If anyone else thinks of some, please post them up in this thread & I'll update the OP as & when I'm able to.
Really nice OP . Also IMO nobody from PD go to gtplanet because if they already been there they will feel full of Shame and half of the pd staff will prefer to go for a sucide lol. Also what is really annoying is in the gAme you are able to increase inches of wheels but not to have them more large and I can't understand why , this is so stupid IMO . Again It will be to much freedom !!!!
 
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VBR
4) Rubber Banding In Career Mode: Why is there no option to turn off the rubber band effect in Career Mode? Why is it forced upon all players regardless of their individual abilities? In the 2002 F1 Austrian Gran Prix, Rubens Barrichello was forced to slow down & let Micheal Schumacher win, & there was a huge uproar from the fans afterwards. Many GT fans feel a similar sense of anger & disappointment that you have programmed the AI to slow down & let them win! Please, for the love of racing stop patronizing us & give us the option to turn rubber banding off in the main menu for Career Mode (& Arcade Mode as well). Also, please give us similar options for Slipstream so that we can change the setting.


I thought this was an important one so moved it nearer the top of the list. I only wrote it up just now as I keep remembering more & more examples of PD forcing things upon us all regardless, instead of giving us options.
 
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My eyes hurt.

@VBR Great post. Some of the points were conveyed in a condescending tone (and rightfully so), which may detract from the issue they were targeted at, but it was put together very well and, honestly, didn't come off as whiney. Major issues that need to be resolved and suggestions on how to do so. Two thumbs way up.
 
Another option that should be selectable is differentiating track cutting penalties from collision penalties. As an example, we should be able to turn track cutting penalties on for a race but leave collisions off. We should have that flexibility whether offline or online.
 
My eyes hurt.

@VBR Great post. Some of the points were conveyed in a condescending tone (and rightfully so), which may detract from the issue they were targeted at, but it was put together very well and, honestly, didn't come off as whiney. Major issues that need to be resolved and suggestions on how to do so. Two thumbs way up.

Sorry for hurting your eyes! :lol:

I didn't mean for it to come across as condescending though, I was trying to reason with Polyphony Digital to show them how unreasonable they can seem to us at times. I was also trying to get get them to see that it doesn't have to be that way, & that you can appeal to all players through options as @Johnnypenso so eloquently put it. However, they are causing their customers much frustration, & I did not hold back from drawing attention to that fact.
 
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VBR
Sorry for hurting your eyes! :lol:

I didn't mean for it to come across as condescending though, I was trying to reason with Polyphony Digital to show them how unreasonable they can seem to us at times. I was also trying to get get them to see that it doesn't have to be that way, & that you can appeal to all players through options as @Johnnypenso so eloquently put it. However, they are causing their customers much frustration, & I did not hold back from drawing attention to that fact.

I think the tone is about right. Questioning with a bit of frustration is ok. As long as it doesn't turn into a rant I think it's more than fair.

And NEVER lose the avatar VBR. Can anyone else find a better one?
 
And NEVER lose the avatar VBR.
Still think it's a selfie :lol:.

Can anyone else find a better one?
@TB 's is awesome too. Looks like he's done with the internet!

@VBR I've just re-read the OP after the recent edit. Nice job. I can't think of anything else to add, I think you've covered the vast majority of cases of a lack of options. Here's hoping PD have had a good read after our recent tweets :cheers:.
 
Just because a couple of things mentioned here do get corrected doesn't mean they're listening to us, it can also be merely coincidence. After GT5 came out there was a huge feedback section here, where people suggested tracks, cars and features for GT5 and the future. The vast majority of those were not added in GT5 and still don't exist in GT6, some of them extremely simple.
Oh, so PD have got no chance with you then, if they don't correct anything they're wrong and if they do correct things they're wrong, throw them a bone ffs.
Some issues mentioned here are a bit silly though, auto replays ? all you have to do is hit a button to cancel, can't see that being a priority and auto game saves, why would you want that off ?
 
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