Gran Turismo 7 Physics

[JDMKING13]

Is sport hard supposed to be some kind of semislick?

Yes in my opinion, Sport hard tire in my league would be like an ADVAN NEOVA AD08 R… a tire like Michelin pilot sport 4s would be a comfort soft… these are for track rating… if we were to do a street challenge the Michelin pilot sport 4s would be rated as SH tire!

 

[szejok666]

A lot of my 90”s cars get Comfort hard or mediums Supra gets CM (Bridgestone Potenzas RE020) early 2000 cars mainly get mediums with the modern super cars getting comfort softs.. I am actually lapping the Supra faster with the mediums than before. I’m around 2.5 seconds behind the guys at BM which is cool because I figure the fasted guys on the game are usually 2 seconds ahead of me.

With my tire system I use, the cars feel very similar but better than the update we had before… only cars I feel they need to just dial the grip back a tad bit would be GT3…

I don't want to spoil your fun, but what I've experienced in this game seems that tires compounds within the particular group (Comfort/Sport/Racing) are just grip multipliers. And they doesn't resemble any specific real life tire. You mentioned Supra RZ - RE020's, very similar to 1992 NSX-R RE010's. Both on CM tires are underperforming in GT7, but NSX-R is much far behind real life lap times. Change to CS on both and you get NSX-R on par with RL (1:05,9 Tsukuba, 8:03 Nordschleife) and Supra waay faster than RL (1:42 at Laguna Seca - 4 seconds faster than RL). You say also, that You're 2,5 seconds slower than BM guys. I assume You compare Tsukuba times - where 2,5 seconds are a lifetime. You're not underperforming, this is a short and easy track to figure out. You just have fitted tires with less grip. If You want proof - play some of BM videos, choose footage of one corner (surely You'll find one with in-car camera), then drive the same car on the same corner in GT7 and play replay simultaneously. I'm 100% sure that You'll be slower - not because lack of skill, but because of speed that same car can maintain while cornering. Believe me, I've tried this Futhermore with CM tires on Supra you only get 0,89 lateral G. The lowest skidpad value for JZA80 Supra I've seen in car magazines is 0.93G. This just doesn't add up.
I'm aware that this is a very specific topic, but I'm writing this to make a point - I've spent too much time of my life comparing RL lap times to GT6 lap times not to pay attention But I'm 100% sure that car like Supra RZ is underperforming on CM tires in GT7, yet on CS is overperforming. This happens because gap between CH and CM in Lateral acceleration is 0,08G, and between CM and CS is 0,1G. You just can't select tires that resemble RL performance of this car in GT. Same goes with R33 Skyline, 300ZX, Corvette ZR-1 from the '90s and many others. And this is just strange to me, that they've figured this out years ago with GT6 (and partailly GT5) and now almost 10 years later we're back at the start.

 

[nummer0]

Previous physics was bad, the grip was horrible. But they've overdone it and now that messed up many of the cars. Take GR Yaris for example - it's a nice tossable car which can and will be a handful if you push it. In GT7 it has become just understeery. I can not make GR Yaris to oversteer under normal track driving. I feel this physics update is on GT5's level. So yeah, great job as usual from PD, they easily went back 12 years.

 

[betec18]

Please Mr. Kazunori go back to the previous physics please!!!! I don’t understand this new physic, it seems much arcade…. To much arcade…

 

[extreme car]

@szejok666 what a coincidence I just tested the nsx-r at suzuka circuit yesterday with comfort medium, and you're right it seems the nsx-r in real life has better cornering traction than in GT7 with comfort medium. weirdly GT7's nsxr has more power than IRL one and is making up a lot of it's time on the straight that by the end the lap the car is neck and neck. Also is there something wrong with GT7's timing? cause the car was neck and neck by the end but I got 2.32.893 and the BM video got 2.34.08

EDIT: better synced video for reference:

ViewSync - Multiple YouTube Viewer

Streamlined multiple YouTube viewer with built-in support for content creators.

viewsync.net

 

[Tenacious D]

Really? Cars behave differently in different modes?

Well, I should test this again post update. Before, when I went from time trial on a track to racing on it, my times slipped on a clean open lap between 10 - 15%. Maybe I'm a weird case, but a couple of people mentioned this before in another thread.

 

[dabz343]

But I'm 100% sure that car like Supra RZ is underperforming on CM tires in GT7, yet on CS is overperforming. This happens because gap between CH and CM in Lateral acceleration is 0,08G, and between CM and CS is 0,1G.

Appreciate the specificity and authenticity of observed differences, but I'm not sure if GT7 deserves this level of scrutiny just yet...

To step back a bit, we are taking about a console game that has gone through a recent update which elevated grip across the board in sweeping fashion and some here are dissecting nuances about minute tire variations...I appreciate it and want PD to get there eventually to hone the tires, but isn't it a bit premature to bring out the sensitive instruments?

 

[JDMKING13]

Appreciate the specificity and authenticity of observed differences, but I'm not sure if GT7 deserves this level of scrutiny just yet...

To step back a bit, we are taking about a console game that has gone through a recent update which elevated grip across the board in sweeping fashion and some here are dissecting nuances about minute tire variations...I appreciate it and want PD to get there eventually to hone the tires, but isn't it a bit premature to bring out the sensitive instruments?

I can get the Supra down to low 1:10 to high 1:09 at Tsukuba… on comfort mediums if we took the best GT drivers I’m usually two seconds behind them… which would put the Supra right around the time it can hit at Tsukuba… When I do lap comparing, I never compare my lap but to what I think the best can do… We run Porsche series and I have people 2 seconds faster than me on RH tires while I’m on RM compound… I think GT did a pretty good job with this update!

 

[NikNakTobasco]

This will hopefully be perceived as one of those ‘there’s no stupid questions’ type of things. But what is dirty air? How do I know I’m in it and what am I meant to do about it? I hear it being mentioned in streams all the time. Is that why it’s seemingly impossible to hit my marks smoothly in race? It’s definitely not just the fuel that’s making the difference.

 

[Td04]

I don't want to spoil your fun, but what I've experienced in this game seems that tires compounds within the particular group (Comfort/Sport/Racing) are just grip multipliers. And they doesn't resemble any specific real life tire. You mentioned Supra RZ - RE020's, very similar to 1992 NSX-R RE010's. Both on CM tires are underperforming in GT7, but NSX-R is much far behind real life lap times. Change to CS on both and you get NSX-R on par with RL (1:05,9 Tsukuba, 8:03 Nordschleife) and Supra waay faster than RL (1:42 at Laguna Seca - 4 seconds faster than RL). You say also, that You're 2,5 seconds slower than BM guys. I assume You compare Tsukuba times - where 2,5 seconds are a lifetime. You're not underperforming, this is a short and easy track to figure out. You just have fitted tires with less grip. If You want proof - play some of BM videos, choose footage of one corner (surely You'll find one with in-car camera), then drive the same car on the same corner in GT7 and play replay simultaneously. I'm 100% sure that You'll be slower - not because lack of skill, but because of speed that same car can maintain while cornering. Believe me, I've tried this Futhermore with CM tires on Supra you only get 0,89 lateral G. The lowest skidpad value for JZA80 Supra I've seen in car magazines is 0.93G. This just doesn't add up.
I'm aware that this is a very specific topic, but I'm writing this to make a point - I've spent too much time of my life comparing RL lap times to GT6 lap times not to pay attention But I'm 100% sure that car like Supra RZ is underperforming on CM tires in GT7, yet on CS is overperforming. This happens because gap between CH and CM in Lateral acceleration is 0,08G, and between CM and CS is 0,1G. You just can't select tires that resemble RL performance of this car in GT. Same goes with R33 Skyline, 300ZX, Corvette ZR-1 from the '90s and many others. And this is just strange to me, that they've figured this out years ago with GT6 (and partailly GT5) and now almost 10 years later we're back at the start.

You are really an Alien if you get 4 second faster on supra with cs,at Laguna... I tryed and my best lap was behind 0.9 sec from reality 🥲.

Anyways i get what you mean,and It will be great have cars that match irl times 1:1
I think that even the times you can read on Fastlaps are not always the best times that the car "x" are capable. As i saw in best motoring gr86 test at tsukuba,where the time between the pilots could be very different,and the track Is short.
Probably 1.45.7 made on supra rz at Laguna Is not the best time that the car is able to do,i don't know.
What i know is that prepatch we were underdriving cars,and i like a lot the physics even before,but that oversteer we have was not correct.
Match reality cause a physics issue is not good in my opinion.

 

[Tenacious D]

So I tried the McLaren 650S Gr3 at Lago Maggiore to see how well the "glue" supposedly stuck the racers to the road. Not much glue on my racing hards, so some people are telling whoppers. It's tuned up tight, a modified Praiano tune, so it drives like a dream, but it's just another Gr3 experience as far as I can tell. It might have a scouche more grip, but I spun out once and had to restart, and nearly oversteered off the track at the last curves before the sweeper leading into the starting straight. I also made 9th place at race finish, from 10th.

I knew I could improve, maybe a lot, and tried again. This time I was a little more careful, but darn, the bots in this race are hard even on normal difficulty. I made it to 7th place within a lap but it was a struggle to reel in the two in front of me. It was a constant battle between an AMG and Viper, who were both battling for 5th and mostly ignoring me. I finally made it in-between them, putting the Viper behind me, but he wouldn't settle for 7th place and kept slipping in front of me, then pushing ahead of the AMG. This nip and tuck battle lasted for two more laps, with me struggling to so much as get between them. In the fourth lap I tried to follow the Viper around the S curve right after the straight, but he went off the track and I followed him, unaware of my predicament until I was flinging grass. He managed to get back on before I did, and the two of them shot off, leaving me to play a lap of catch up.

In spite of edging off the track again on the long sweeper curve, thank God only two wheels, I managed to keep my speed up and stay out of the mob trailing me, and could see the nefarious pair several hundred feet up ahead. Flooring it, I dove down the slope to the tight turn leading back up the steep incline and managed to catch up with them atop the hill. Trying just a bit of late braking, I slid past the AMG and tried to do the same for the Viper, but it edged past me once more, leaving me to keep a close pace on their heels down the sweeper to the starting straight. But this time I caught the Viper and drafted to close in on the 5th place AMG. The Viper misjudged the first turn again, finally leaving us alone to duke it out caro a caro. The AMG tried to pull away, but I was, dare I say it, tenacious and kept dogging him through the entire lap.

In the long straight leading down hill, I caught a good draft, and with the turbo spooling like mad, I just edged past him before the turn. A solid bump in the rear let me know he was displeased at taking his place, and the impact or the shock of it had me going off track again as he pulled up close to sneak ahead. But fortune was with me and I managed to keep the McLaren straight and used the bumpers to pull me back onto the track ahead of the AMG. Thumps on my rear let me know he wasn't going to be left behind, and damn if he didn't pull ahead after those last curves. I tried to fight him for it but then realized it might not end well for me if I overdid it, and let him take the lead. I could really use some of that "glue" here. But I pushed the Mac as hard as I dared down that sweeper towards the finish, and saw an opportunity as he took the turn too wide and had to correct just before leaving the track. Pulling the nose in just a hair around the turn, I avoided a collision and the 650 just edged past to where I could straighten out. The AMG couldn't muster the energy for a pass, and I shot across the finish for 5th place. That was a fight worth saving the replay.

So needless to say, I'm not of the opinion the Grs have godly amounts of grip. I didn't have downforce maxed, though it was pretty strong, and the racing hards would slip around turns. Rather than flooring it, I did a lot of pedal lifting because she wouldn't keep from slipping under full power. They may possibly have too much grip, but that whole "glued to the road" meme won't fly with me.

 

[R3V]

Seems like they built in some form of driver aid. The gr3 cars especially have unlimited traction in any gear, and turning on TCS has terminal understeer, in the same way the cars did with counter steer assist. Also trail braking isn't as effective as it used to be. You can only do it with 10% braking or so, and the rotation is minimal.


I'd rather deal with a pointy car than terminal understeer tbh.

edit

Here's an exercise for you. Turn the car left and right back and forth with no TCS. It won't slide. Then do that with TCS 1. You'll see TCS intervening as if the rears are supposed to slide.

edit

Turning on traction control*

edit 4 days later -

Road cars are somewhat fine, they just snap at higher threshholds and have a little more understeer than before.

 

[Lord Protector]

I’ve just tried the game and I’m very disappointed. It’s back to GTS’ chronic understeer acceleration. It’s kinda what I expected from the update description when it said “updated suspension geometry”… it’s not a suspension problem, it’s a tyre problem. Cars still launch as complete trash with no grip, it’s just freaking spinning the tyres under acceleration, 6 seconds for a C6 ZR1 to reach 60 mph give me a break…

PD please, roll back this crap and make a significant improvement to the tyres already!

I’m done with this game for now.

 

[BigSarj]

This will hopefully be perceived as one of those ‘there’s no stupid questions’ type of things. But what is dirty air? How do I know I’m in it and what am I meant to do about it? I hear it being mentioned in streams all the time. Is that why it’s seemingly impossible to hit my marks smoothly in race? It’s definitely not just the fuel that’s making the difference.

From what I understand, it is turbulent air coming off the car in front of you that messes with your downforce, thereby making it harder to grip the track. This effect of dirty air is especially prevelant in high downforce cars like Gr2.

 

[NikNakTobasco]

From what I understand, it is turbulent air coming off the car in front of you that messes with your downforce, thereby making it harder to grip the track. This effect of dirty air is especially prevelant in high downforce cars like Gr2.

I guess that’s why I’m suddenly seeing it come up in race C

 

[Tenacious D]

I'd like to add something to my above post. I know the A.I. is kind of a sore point with us, pretty much universally. I've done my share of grouching. There are either scripted events or the bots really are chronic in their personality, such as the Gr4 Huracan overdoing it at Tertre Rouge and lunging back on track in the first lap.

But there are some races in which the bots are kind of sort of rather authentic, like the Gr3 race at Maggiore. That was a challenge, a three pepper race - woops, two pepper - so pretty tough on normal difficulty, and the bots were a little annoying but quite a bit like I remember humans online in many races. They still don't like to take turns as fast as they can except when you're just ahead of them, but in this race they didn't give up quite as badly when you get twenty car lengths or so ahead of them. And even with a rolling start, the field didn't spread out thinly. If PD would make the bots universally like this, they would have quite a racer, and I'm looking forward to meeting Sophy. Now, about that physics...

 

[SPOOLMAN]

Speaking of physics. The M4 is probably the most challenging car to handle in GT7

It requires delicate throttle control and steering input.

 

[B80]

Speaking of physics. The M4 is probably the most challenging car to handle in GT7

It requires delicate throttle control and steering input.

Glad it's not just me. Was a tough one to control oversteer on sh and ss the other day. Played it first after update the other day and wondered what people were on about with this 'on rails' and 'glue' stuff.

 

[Mc_Yavel]

This will hopefully be perceived as one of those ‘there’s no stupid questions’ type of things. But what is dirty air? How do I know I’m in it and what am I meant to do about it? I hear it being mentioned in streams all the time. Is that why it’s seemingly impossible to hit my marks smoothly in race? It’s definitely not just the fuel that’s making the difference.

Dirty air is the whole of low pressure air (less density) created by the car in front of you. It's what enable slipstream, the low pressure air will suck your car in.

You know you're in when the gap start closing to the car in front of you, around 0.7 sec behind. You can also ear it. The sound of the wind on your windshield will greatly reduce to almost non existent. (The same apply when cycling, when I get close to the bike in front the sound of the wind in my ears stop completey and pedaling become easier.)

The effect of dirty air help overtake on straight but there is also donwside coming into braking zone. Dirty air is less dense so it pushes less on the wings of your car. Less aero push = less grip for your tires. This make your braking distance longer, cornering harder and therefore sliding more, bad exit and more tire wear. Like said above, this is for high downforce cars like GR.2 and above but can be feel in GR.3 too.

What I like to do when following a car to a braking zone is to get out of dirty air for braking. It has many effect: I have full downforce for braking, I will not hit the guy in front if he brakes sooner than me and I'm playing a mind game because I move on the inside line even if I have no intention of overtaking him. Sometime it's enough to get them out of shape and make a mistake.

 

[LSFDRX]

I’m done with this game for now.

Man, if I had a dollar for each time someone on this site "gave up" on the game only to be right back here on the forums the same day playing it again...

6 sec 0-60 in a ZR1. You really think that on this game you can match the acceleration threshold of a real car? What are you doing, mashing the throttle and expecting it to go fast? You think you have the ability to maximize traction in a 640hp RWD car without being able to feel the tires? Are you using the TCS that is in no way indicative of real life?

Nobody gets fast 0-60 times in the game, but I guarantee there are plenty of people going 0-60 quicker than 6.

Once again, all these posts are up to the abilities of the person, and I really don't trust the abilities of many people... IRL and in game.

 

[TNumbers1946]

I am going to leave a link to a lobby race I did with the 458 gt3 with BoP applied around Trial Mountain with the latest patch. I'm not the fastest person out there but I feel it would be a better contribution than just sharing anecdotes which have been echoed a thousand times already.

edit: yes this is on controller

 

[Voodoovaj]

I don't want to spoil your fun, but what I've experienced in this game seems that tires compounds within the particular group (Comfort/Sport/Racing) are just grip multipliers.

You are correct. There is a general "tire" model and each group is just a modified amount of lateral and longitudinal grip. This has always been the case. The underlying model might change, but the philosophy has always been the same.

And they doesn't resemble any specific real life tire. You mentioned Supra RZ - RE020's, very similar to 1992 NSX-R RE010's. Both on CM tires are underperforming in GT7, but NSX-R is much far behind real life lap times. Change to CS on both and you get NSX-R on par with RL (1:05,9 Tsukuba, 8:03 Nordschleife) and Supra waay faster than RL (1:42 at Laguna Seca - 4 seconds faster than RL). You say also, that You're 2,5 seconds slower than BM guys. I assume You compare Tsukuba times - where 2,5 seconds are a lifetime. You're not underperforming, this is a short and easy track to figure out. You just have fitted tires with less grip. If You want proof - play some of BM videos, choose footage of one corner (surely You'll find one with in-car camera), then drive the same car on the same corner in GT7 and play replay simultaneously. I'm 100% sure that You'll be slower - not because lack of skill, but because of speed that same car can maintain while cornering. Believe me, I've tried this Futhermore with CM tires on Supra you only get 0,89 lateral G. The lowest skidpad value for JZA80 Supra I've seen in car magazines is 0.93G. This just doesn't add up.

Lots to unpack here.

I've been to the same track, two weekend in a row, and be over 1 second a lap different in timing. That's the same person, same vehicle, same set up, same track, just different days. The point being, there are lots of little things that can affect a lap time.

The only truly valid comparison is if a person were to drive a car in real life, at a given track, and then go replicate that as best they can in the game. So, for instance, fly to Japan and lap Tsukuba for real. Still, as mentioned, the tires are a big differentiator, never mind that the underlying system of the game is the same basic car system with modifiers for everything else. So, IMHO, comparisons to real life are difficult to make at the best of times.

Not to mention the lateral forces on your body. That alone will change the performance over a lap.

I'm aware that this is a very specific topic, but I'm writing this to make a point - I've spent too much time of my life comparing RL lap times to GT6 lap times not to pay attention But I'm 100% sure that car like Supra RZ is underperforming on CM tires in GT7, yet on CS is overperforming. This happens because gap between CH and CM in Lateral acceleration is 0,08G, and between CM and CS is 0,1G. You just can't select tires that resemble RL performance of this car in GT. Same goes with R33 Skyline, 300ZX, Corvette ZR-1 from the '90s and many others. And this is just strange to me, that they've figured this out years ago with GT6 (and partailly GT5) and now almost 10 years later we're back at the start.

Again, this goes back to the reality of the game being 1 basic tire, 1 basic car, and modifiers for everything else. As the game evolves and they chase a better "model" the values change as well. The amount of adjustment now maybe be radically different to the previous titles. You can't really compare it. You can compare the "feel" but everything else is kind of incomparable.

I think that, given that Michelin is a featured provider of the game, it's reasonable to make comparisons with their line up of tires. I had Michelin Pilot Super Sports on my golf. 235/35/19's. I would consider this to be an SM tire (because there are longer lasting, harder sport tires available). The Pilot Sport Cup 2 R is a track tire, but not a slick, so I would consider that an SS tire. What tire would Michelin have as a CH, or CM, or CS? What's their performance difference?

This is just my opinion though.

Here's the link to Michelin's page of tires. You can somewhat see where these would slot in to the game, but again, this is just a supposition. I have no idea if they even thought about trying to simulate these tires in any way.

https://www.michelin.ca/en/auto/browse-tires/all-tires

 

[JDMKING13]

You are correct. There is a general "tire" model and each group is just a modified amount of lateral and longitudinal grip. This has always been the case. The underlying model might change, but the philosophy has always been the same.

Lots to unpack here.

I've been to the same track, two weekend in a row, and be over 1 second a lap different in timing. That's the same person, same vehicle, same set up, same track, just different days. The point being, there are lots of little things that can affect a lap time.

The only truly valid comparison is if a person were to drive a car in real life, at a given track, and then go replicate that as best they can in the game. So, for instance, fly to Japan and lap Tsukuba for real. Still, as mentioned, the tires are a big differentiator, never mind that the underlying system of the game is the same basic car system with modifiers for everything else. So, IMHO, comparisons to real life are difficult to make at the best of times.

Not to mention the lateral forces on your body. That alone will change the performance over a lap.

Again, this goes back to the reality of the game being 1 basic tire, 1 basic car, and modifiers for everything else. As the game evolves and they chase a better "model" the values change as well. The amount of adjustment now maybe be radically different to the previous titles. You can't really compare it. You can compare the "feel" but everything else is kind of incomparable.

I think that, given that Michelin is a featured provider of the game, it's reasonable to make comparisons with their line up of tires. I had Michelin Pilot Super Sports on my golf. 235/35/19's. I would consider this to be an SM tire (because there are longer lasting, harder sport tires available). The Pilot Sport Cup 2 R is a track tire, but not a slick, so I would consider that an SS tire. What tire would Michelin have as a CH, or CM, or CS? What's their performance difference?

This is just my opinion though.

Here's the link to Michelin's page of tires. You can somewhat see where these would slot in to the game, but again, this is just a supposition. I have no idea if they even thought about trying to simulate these tires in any way.

https://www.michelin.ca/en/auto/browse-tires/all-tires

Michelin Pilot SS tires would get a SH street rating… with a CS track rating in my league… the tires has great grip for the street, but it is not a dedicated track tire… once that heat sets in them from track use they would show their true face.

 

[PirovacBoy]

Hope you are keeping well mate. Long time no type or race

Thanks Mate, I’m doing fine.
Marlboro Bros‘ 😉
I was always around, I just noticed you disappeared out of nothing.
Anyway, hope to catch you out there sooner or later.

 

[HyperSpeeder]

Man, if I had a dollar for each time someone on this site "gave up" on the game only to be right back here on the forums the same day playing it again...

6 sec 0-60 in a ZR1. You really think that on this game you can match the acceleration threshold of a real car? What are you doing, mashing the throttle and expecting it to go fast? You think you have the ability to maximize traction in a 640hp RWD car without being able to feel the tires? Are you using the TCS that is in no way indicative of real life?

Nobody gets fast 0-60 times in the game, but I guarantee there are plenty of people going 0-60 quicker than 6.

Once again, all these posts are up to the abilities of the person, and I really don't trust the abilities of many people... IRL and in game.

C6 ZR1 was first Corvette with launch control too. Easier IRL.

 

[Lord Protector]

Man, if I had a dollar for each time someone on this site "gave up" on the game only to be right back here on the forums the same day playing it again...

6 sec 0-60 in a ZR1. You really think that on this game you can match the acceleration threshold of a real car? What are you doing, mashing the throttle and expecting it to go fast? You think you have the ability to maximize traction in a 640hp RWD car without being able to feel the tires? Are you using the TCS that is in no way indicative of real life?

Nobody gets fast 0-60 times in the game, but I guarantee there are plenty of people going 0-60 quicker than 6.

Once again, all these posts are up to the abilities of the person, and I really don't trust the abilities of many people... IRL and in game.

Me being on the forum doesn’t equal me playing the game.

And TCS1 is objectively the fastest way to launch cars in GT7 so of course I test it with that. It also makes sense to use it because you get one less variable. You don’t need some God gifted talent to launch a car decently… a driving rookie would learn to launch the real car faster than I can in GT7 and believe me, there’s no ability shortage in me, I can guarantee you that.

 

[LSFDRX]

Me being on the forum doesn’t equal me playing the game.

And TCS1 is objectively the fastest way to launch cars in GT7 so of course I test it with that. It also makes sense to use it because you get one less variable. You don’t need some God gifted talent to launch a car decently… a driving rookie would learn to launch the real car faster than I can in GT7 and believe me, there’s no ability shortage in me, I can guarantee you that.

IRL launching a car on street tires is still a challenging thing, but there is so much more to be felt and communicated by the car that makes it a more reasonable task to accomplish whereas the total lack of feeling in GT will leave throttle control up to what amounts to a guess and check scenario. I still wouldn't go so far as saying a noob could do it quickly, or that a clutch would survive their attempts! I've spent a lot of time in my life at test and tune drag nights and know enough about getting the most performance out of a street tire, but almost none of that real world experience translates to this game.

The primary reason most of us use TCS1 on launch is for this very reason. Not even the best, and it looks like you have accomplished a lot in the world of GT, are able to find that sweet spot between traction limit and boiling the tires up in smoke from a standstill.

I realize my comment was very snarky and assholish, and I'm sorry for that, but you and others aside, I still take most of the opinions on vehicle metrics here with a huge grain of salt.

I also see many people echo the same "not gonna play no more" sentiment and return with new stories of failures and successes, so pardon me for lumping you into that group. But still, you're going to come back, and it seems like you have more than enough skill to overcome whatever challenges this strange set of physics throws at us.

 

[sixty4half]

Ya'll aren't kidding. I literally can not get a Ferrari or Mustang to oversteer. Two of the most notorious oversteering cars IRL. Even if you enter the corner way to fast and force the oversteer, the game still corrects it and throws you into understeer. Its like they took the earlier bug and flipped it the opposite way. Way to much overcorrection


Edit, also that is a horrible explanation of dirty air. We dont have dirty air in GT7, we have slipstream. Dirty air is turbulent air that does not produce a good slipstream. It is air that tumbles off the back of a car in swirls and cyclones that then causes problems with the aerodynamics on the car behind it. It causes your tyres and engine to accumulate extra heat without any benefit of a slipstream

The only reason you have to break earlier in GT7 is because you're going faster from picking up the slipstream, not because dirty air is messing with your downforce.

 

[extreme car]

Well, I should test this again post update. Before, when I went from time trial on a track to racing on it, my times slipped on a clean open lap between 10 - 15%. Maybe I'm a weird case, but a couple of people mentioned this before in another thread.

Nope it's not just you, this happened to me too pre-patch. Was testing and tuning a RX8 and I'm 1 second slower around deep forest when tyre wear is on. The car is a lot slidier then when the tyre wear is off. Haven't tune and tested car since post patch so I can't say if they fixed this physics difference.

 

[B80]

Doing brans hatch CE with the Radical, finding I'm lapping quicker with tcs off. Have to be mindful flooring it out of some turns, but car noticeably lags when accelerating, feels a bit numb/less sharp with tcs1 on. I'm a pretty average driver too.