Gran Turismo Sport: General Discussion

[gtracedriver1]

How can it be no significance that a milestone they planned in the development cycle wasn't met on time?

Because the beta would not be any use to them. Pcars had early access on PC. The incentive was that people already pay for the product and they get to play the beta, pre-beta even alpha version. Other games that do on consoles do not hold much significance either because it is not really testing. It is a demo or early demo at best but obviously they mention it as a beta test instead.

 

[Samus]

Because the beta would not be any use to them. Pcars had early access on PC. The incentive was that people already pay for the product and they get to play the beta, pre-beta even alpha version. Other games that do on consoles do not hold much significance either because it is not really testing. It is a demo or early demo at best but obviously they mention it as a beta test instead.

That isn't relevant to the point I'm making. Their development cycle planned to include a beta early in the year. They didn't have the time to do it, ergo something went wrong somewhere.

 

[Scaff]

Because the beta would not be any use to them. Pcars had early access on PC. The incentive was that people already pay for the product and they get to play the beta, pre-beta even alpha version. Other games that do on consoles do not hold much significance either because it is not really testing. It is a demo or early demo at best but obviously they mention it as a beta test instead.

Early access and beta are two very different things.

I'm a Sony beta tester and have never paid for a single one and have always provided feedback.

PD have never run an external Beta on the PS3 or PS4.

Respawn have just released a pre-alpha network test of Titanfall 2 and haven't charged for it.

The timescale it was supposed to release would have allowed changes to be made, particularly to netcode and servers.

Don't conflate sometimes that is unique to PC as an excuse for PD missing a commitment they made.

 

[trustjab]

Is it really that big of a deal right now? I know I prefer the game release on time and miss out on a beta than to have a beta but the release get delayed. Maybe both happen and the release date is still pushed back. Then it'll look even worse. Hopefully they can stick to their time schedule and have what they feel is a finished product to sell. This thread and gts threads in general will blow up if not. Quite a few here won't let PD off the hook on that one, even if the game blows us away!

 

[Scaff]

Is it really that big of a deal right now? I know I prefer the game release on time and miss out on a beta than to have a beta but the release get delayed. Maybe both happen and the release date is still pushed back. Then it'll look even worse. Hopefully they can stick to their time schedule and have what they feel is a finished product to sell. This thread and gts threads in general will blow up if not. Quite a few here won't let PD off the hook on that one, even if the game blows us away!

Not if it releases and the net code is a mess and a beta would have helped resolve it.

 

[Samus]

Is it really that big of a deal right now? I know I prefer the game release on time and miss out on a beta than to have a beta but the release get delayed. Maybe both happen and the release date is still pushed back. Then it'll look even worse. Hopefully they can stick to their time schedule and have what they feel is a finished product to sell. This thread and gts threads in general will blow up if not. Quite a few here won't let PD off the hook on that one, even if the game blows us away!

I only brought up the beta as a possible example that they are/were running behind on development in relation to the discussion about whether there may be a delay on the full game. It could have been anything that they said they'd deliver, the pertinent point is that they didn't.

Obviously by not delivering the beta they've saved themselves time but what we don't know is if it has/will save them enough time.

 

[Zlork]

@Zlork mate, it's pretty much the weekend now.

Observations? Comments? Please?

I almost finished writing my impressions but it's in French for now.

Tonight, it should be good.

 

[super_gt]

Fuchsrohre,the last left turn.He brakes during cornering which in real world would lead to monstrous oversteer but his car is doing exactly the opposite of the real world,understeer.

 

[freedom1104]

Fuchsrohre,the last left turn.He brakes during cornering which in real world would lead to monstrous oversteer but his car is doing exactly the opposite of the real world,understeer.

And the cars can ride the curbs anyway he like and get out of it like nothing happened.

 

[queleuleu]

It's a mainstream game... What kind of game do you expect? Rfactor, iRacing, AC, R3E? I'm sure Poly must know that their engine is not the most realistic. Sony wants to sell millions of GT and you can't sell millions of a real simulator.
The first comment I've read on a website about GTSport screenshots was : "And still no word on tyre pressure?" lol...
I'm not against more simulation but GT is not the game for you @freedom1104 and @super_gt.

 

[freedom1104]

It's a mainstream game... What kind of game do you expect? Rfactor, iRacing, AC, R3E? I'm sure Poly must know that their engine is not the most realistic. Sony wants to sell millions of GT and you can't sell millions of a real simulator.
The first comment I've read on a website about GTSport screenshots was : "And still no word on tyre pressure?" lol...
I'm not against more simulation but GT is not the game for you @freedom1104 and @super_gt.

And exactly who are you to decide GT is not the game for me ?

 

[queleuleu]

And exactly who are you to decide GT is not the game for me ?

Sorry, if you're here I'm sure that's because you enjoy GT. Simply, some posts are like : "the rally track is too wide, no tyre flex, no engine and suspension failure, brake fade." And so on...
I know it's the "Real driving simulator". I just want to warn some members that GT will never be a true simulator even if they pretend it in their marketing speech.

 

[Doudii_nside]

I almost finished writing my impressions but it's in French for now.

Tonight, it should be good.

Zlork, I want them in french on Play3live, i can't wait the english version !!!

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Definitely agreed that when the wheel is self centering , its faster to let go. But still not such centering speed existed yet in the steering wheel set of virtual racing. Maybe only direct drive can reach that kind of speed. But the thing existed now still no where near as fast.



Actually i do this all the time, just G27 is stupidly slow i need to pull to fasten the action

It's not only about hardware limitation, but physics of the game, like caster and kingpin offset influence on self centering force ( or better put as self aligning torque that is hard to be properly simulated ) as well as camber thrust and scrub radius ( high scrub tend to make steering heavier/kick back when cornering at higher load - real surprise on non power steering high power car, also have some effect on self centering and feedback ) Some of these contributes to torque steer, so maybe one of the reason of lack torque steer in GT series is that these are not properly simulated or use preset and symmetrical value on all cars.

 

[freedom1104]

Sorry, if you're here I'm sure that's because you enjoy GT. Simply, some posts are like : "the rally track is too wide, no tyre flex, no engine and suspension failure, brake fade." And so on...
I know it's the "Real driving simulator". I just want to warn some members that GT will never be a true simulator even if they pretend it in their marketing speech.

"the rally track is too wide, no tyre flex, no engine and suspension failure, brake fade." And so on..."
These are for hardcore simulator i agreed. But simpler things such as the clutch, sounds and curbs physics should be a basic.

"GT will never be a true simulator even if they pretend it in their marketing speech." This however i agreed. Not sure why there are some here argue time and time again about this. I dont think you should had said this statement, this may spark some fury here

It's not only about hardware limitation, but physics of the game, like caster and kingpin offset influence on self centering force ( or better put as self aligning torque that is hard to be properly simulated ) as well as camber thrust and scrub radius ( high scrub tend to make steering heavier/kick back when cornering at higher load - real surprise on non power steering high power car, also have some effect on self centering and feedback ) Some of these contributes to torque steer, so maybe one of the reason of lack torque steer in GT series is that these are not properly simulated or use preset and symmetrical value on all cars.

Sometime i believe its not the steering wheel set limitation, its the console limitation, I had tried t500rs and g27 in both ps3 and pc. When plugged into pc, even on default setting, i get more FFB whether in rotating speed, or vibration. So maybe this is a deciding factor as well, probably console usb port dont output as much power as the PC one.

 

[Imari]

So maybe this is a deciding factor as well, probably console usb port dont output as much power as the PC one.

That's not how it's works. The wheel motor is drawing wall power through the adapter you plugged in. Normal USB power isn't nearly enough, particularly for a strong wheel like the T500.

The difference is how strong whatever program it's attached to tells the wheel to turn. If it's told to turn at 100% force, it will.

 

[Tornado]

PS reminder to Zlork.

"they have respected the release date for Gran Turismo PSP" still gets me every time.

 

[SlimCharles]

It's a mainstream game... What kind of game do you expect? Rfactor, iRacing, AC, R3E? I'm sure Poly must know that their engine is not the most realistic. Sony wants to sell millions of GT and you can't sell millions of a real simulator.
The first comment I've read on a website about GTSport screenshots was : "And still no word on tyre pressure?" lol...
I'm not against more simulation but GT is not the game for you @freedom1104 and @super_gt.

The problem is not that GT Sport could be less simulation. The problem is that there are people defending GT could be as simulator as Assetto o Project Cars.

Until the release I will not judge the final product, but the behaviour of the cars doesnt seems at all as simulation.

 

[PhaedrusSocrate]

Fuchsrohre,the last left turn.He brakes during cornering which in real world would lead to monstrous oversteer but his car is doing exactly the opposite of the real world,understeer.

Gee, you're such super expert that you have no knowledge of a little thing known as "driving ASSISTS"? And how such driver like in that video are bound to use everything available (and still need more )
Or you know all that but just cant resist the urge... Or "tribal crud" or something.

(to both super_gt and SlimCharles)

 

[karelpipa]

I see you can still brake partially on grass and tarmac (two wheels on grass and two on tarmac) and get on with it.
Also driving on grass is still too easy.

 

[PhaedrusSocrate]

So you think that driving with assists isn't just like that in pCARS or Assetto (btw, can't wait!) or anywhere else as well? Interesting idea.

 

[jm79]

So you think that driving with assists isn't just like that in pCARS or Assetto (btw, can't wait!) or anywhere else as well? Interesting idea.

Yeah this is definitely full on assists.

When I played this, I turned them all off, as far as I could tell, and there's no way you could be getting away with driving like that.

Also, when curbs are hit, there are notable jolts, as far as I can see.

 

[Tired Tyres]

It's a mainstream game... What kind of game do you expect? Rfactor, iRacing, AC, R3E? I'm sure Poly must know that their engine is not the most realistic. Sony wants to sell millions of GT and you can't sell millions of a real simulator.
The first comment I've read on a website about GTSport screenshots was : "And still no word on tyre pressure?" lol...
I'm not against more simulation but GT is not the game for you @freedom1104 and @super_gt.

Of course you can. The only thing you have to do is load the simulation down with assistance for everyone else. Then it's up to those who want a simulation to switch them off. GTS will sell, IF it sells, on its name.

I almost finished writing my impressions but it's in French for now.

Tonight, it should be good.

Pointless. You are not even remotely neutral at all when it comes to PD and GT. Therefore your rose tinted view will just feed the expectations of fans of the series.

 

[SlimCharles]

Of course you can. The only thing you have to do is load the simulation down with assistance for everyone else. Then it's up to those who want a simulation to switch them off. GTS will sell, IF it sells, on its name.

That is very inaccurate. Switching off or on driving assists dont make the game more simulation or less. Many racing cars have driving assists (LMP1, GT3...). What makes a game a simulator is the physics only.

 

[Tired Tyres]

That is very inaccurate. Switching off or on driving assists dont make the game more simulation or less. Many racing cars have driving assists (LMP1, GT3...). What makes a game a simulator is the physics only.

No it is not. If you think assists don't make it easier to driver then you are very inaccurate.

Additionally, being an owner of Assetto Corsa since early access days, more realistic physics makes it easier to drive in the sim because the cars react as they are supposed to.

 

[GTEFGHA]

The problem is that there are people defending GT could be as simulator as Assetto o Project Cars.

God forbid that GTS is as Pcars that game is utter **** literary unplayable...
The sounds and visuals are amazing tho

 

[Donnced]

That is very inaccurate. Switching off or on driving assists dont make the game more simulation or less. Many racing cars have driving assists (LMP1, GT3...). What makes a game a simulator is the physics only.

Can't say it better 👍
Like you said, switching off driving assists like ABS, stability control or TC off don't make a game more simulation.
Only more "complicated" because the car depends on you more than the electronic assists.

What makes a simulation game a simulator is purely and only the Physics.

And just like you also said, lots of real life cars, even race cars have TC and other electronic assists.

A point that i liked form games like assetto or Pcars is the option "factory" in one and "real" in the other, that makes you drive the car with the electronic assists they got in real live.

 

[Cocomoto]

I think SlimCharles are mistaking real world assist vs racing games assists.

For example; braking and steering assists. In the real world you can't have that(until google do it). But in games, you can. And it make the game A LOT easier.
I remember when Pcars released on the PS4 and a friend of mine, who basically plays Battlefield, and sometimes racing games like NFS, The Crew and even GT... well, we got to a private run and messed around in the Nordschleife.

I was surprise how well he could handle the track even without having any kind of experience with more sim like games. He had all the assists on, of course he wasn't fast at all, but he could put some decent drive based on his level of skills.

 

[jm79]

Pointless. You are not even remotely neutral at all when it comes to PD and GT. Therefore your rose tinted view will just feed the expectations of fans of the series.

I think describing someone else's opinion as 'pointless' is not the wisest approach here, my friend.

 

[Ameer67]

I agree with @SlimCharles and @Donnced on this one. You can turn on every single assist in the game put the physics themselves won't change. Even if the game drives the car basically by itself (meaning auto brake and auto steering on like in Forza or in DiRT), the physics are still the same. The only exception to this is Skid Recovery Force which alters the physics to help the player. Thankfully though, SRF seems to be removed from GT Sport.