Why Kaz needs to go...

Do you think Kaz should retire from GT?


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That's not the reason.

Outside of a few forums, pcars is relatively unknown. A demo or prologue could spark a lot of interest. The combined user base of PS3 and xbox360 is about 160 million. It was originally slated for this generation, but they decided to delay it.

Plenty of games release demos.

They decided to delay as specified on thread here that you can follow and see. I agree you have a point interest will help them sell it more, problem is as I said the team is smaller than PD and they don't have a bank roll or at least not one anywhere near the level of Sony and MS or their former EA. Also the game will be able to retain more of what it does on the PC with the current gen better than the outgoing.
 
Yeah I've also heard about Project Screenshot. Really hope they get the physics right! Don't want they remain drooling screenshots only. We need GT/Forza alternatives on console asap.

They don't have to be perfect, just passable. As long as they're closer to the physics of something like say GTR 1 rather than Shift (take the F out) they'll be plenty good enough if they deliver on all the features that will actually make it something different and unique...a racing game that's actually trying to be a racing game.
 
They decided to delay as specified on thread here that you can follow and see. I agree you have a point interest will help them sell it more, problem is as I said the team is smaller than PD and they don't have a bank roll or at least not one anywhere near the level of Sony and MS or their former EA. Also the game will be able to retain more of what it does on the PC with the current gen better than the outgoing.

I heard they are releasing another racing game soon. Where did they get the development money for that one?
 
They don't have to be perfect, just passable. As long as they're closer to the physics of something like say GTR 1 rather than Shift (take the F out) they'll be plenty good enough if they deliver on all the features that will actually make it something different and unique...a racing game that's actually trying to be a racing game.
Yeah. Well said.
 
I disagree. Kaz is still expanding the genre boundaries. Has any other developer planned GPS course maker, projects similar to VGT or GT Academy?

Even if GT fails, these are things that will influence the direction of other games for years to come.
True. Although those features are taking forever to come. :P
 
Are you talking about World of Speed?

Yes. If they can bank roll World of Speed, then I would think a console demo for pCars would be within budget, and money well spent.

I'm as keen as anyone for pCars to release and succeed, but I reserve my judgement until it releases and I have played it.
 
Yes. If they can bank roll World of Speed, then I would think a console demo for pCars would be within budget, and money well spent.

First off how do you know that's not there way of getting people into PCars with a more expansive mmo, that is probably on the same engine as PCars for PC...

I'm as keen as anyone for pCars to release and succeed, but I reserve my judgement until it releases and I have played it.

That's cool, 1. never said you wanted to see it die and burn before release I only gave that right of passage to a certain user, 2. I nor you seem to be passing judgement on anything. I haven't said I think Pcars will be epic, rather wait and see since there isn't enough to go on history wise with SMS to see why it wouldn't fail or be a hit. I don't see anything in your post that doesn't do the same...
 
First off how do you know that's not there way of getting people into PCars with a more expansive mmo, that is probably on the same engine as PCars for PC...



That's cool, 1. never said you wanted to see it die and burn before release I only gave that right of passage to a certain user, 2. I nor you seem to be passing judgement on anything. I haven't said I think Pcars will be epic, rather wait and see since there isn't enough to go on history wise with SMS to see why it wouldn't fail or be a hit. I don't see anything in your post that doesn't do the same...


I believe the console user base is what will drive the majority of sales for pCars, and ultimately, it's success. I don't think a PC (I'm assuming PC based, as I haven't seen console reference to it) based MMO will have the same effect as a console demo. A demo would only need a couple of tracks and cars to show the physics engine off, to wet our tongue, so to speak.

That said, I don't need it to succeed commercially. I just want it released, and for it to be good.
 
Well, sorry but I'm not a mind reader. You toss out "attention to detail" as if it had some discreet, universal and easy to grasp meaning. So what exactly do you mean? A long and varied single player career? You might be thinking of GT4. Detailed tracks and car models? That would be GT5 and 6. Sounds? Again, GT6. Weather and time of day stuff, technical details or whatever? You think maybe you could have been more specific or something?
Going on the GT6 car list, they usually just change the string in the car name and a couple badges and call it a different car; to the extent of making up "versions" that don't exist either. When they get a car that presents the chance to actually add significant revisions that would legitimately diversify the car list (in a way that an E30 similarly would and another minor revision of an already made up car does not), even ones that would be simple to do, they mostly don't bother.
But I'm looking down a game that not only ignored dozens of separate issues with car accuracy since they were introduced in the series (some of them in GT3, some in GT4, most in GTPSP, but a not-inconsequential number new with each game since) despite all of PD's grandstanding about "unprecedented manufacturer access"; but went so far as to make it implied with GT6's release that they are purposely ignoring them in favor of pursuing raw numbers and making the cars the way they want them rather than how they actually were, so if someone was to disagree they would hopefully bring some sort of substance to the debate.
The best part is that both of those quotes are from the same post, the one you seemed to have glossed over to respond with a thoroughly odd line about how liking GT2 over the rest of the games implies an inability to properly critique the rest of the games.



Hell, we can even bring up the assertion that I was arguing against in the first place:
I see the kind of nerdy detail - the love of one single concept, the passion for one particular car, the idea of simulating the driving experience as closely as possible on a console, I feel my own slightly weird passion for motoring minutiae reflected in GT.
I've made heavily researched threads detailing how little care seems to be put into "motoring minutiae" and that constantly trotted out close cousin "automotive encyclopedia" concept, and how that care slides further and further with each game despite the increasing hullabaloo PD makes about their close manufacturer partnerships. I sat down and hashed every duplicate car present in GT5, going so far as to present the exact reasoning why for the ones people claim aren't duplicates as well as the ones that are duplicates to the point of not actually existing; even noting ones that shouldn't be duplicates but PD's laziness (a laziness largely not present in GT1 or GT2) made it so they are as presented in the game. I defended PD when they did it right, and people acted like they didn't. I've contributed to threads by other people detailing how PD seemingly makes the cars the way they want them rather than how they really were; and even posited theories about how they are trying to induce some fake car balancing (as with all of the LMP cars; which was a carryover behavior they sadly pulled with the GT500 cars in GT2) or possibly even a way to circumvent shortcomings in the physics engine. I've talked about how they seem more interested in making up more and more fictional race cars so they have something to compete with their incorrectly modeled real race cars rather than fixing those real cars so they could be naturally competitive. None of this is some new thing I'm only now springing on in this thread because it is convenient as a rebuttal.



About the only thing I haven't detailed in the past that is related to the argument about the lack of care regarding that "motoring minutae" is note how ridiculous it was that PD made it clear they know of the evermore more absurd car padding for GT6, but also that with the redone Standard cars they seem to actively not care about fixing it. And even that I've touched on in light, even if I haven't explained it to the extent of the above.
 
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The best part is that both of those quotes are from the same post, the one you blatantly glossed over to respond with a thoroughly odd line about how liking GT2 over the rest of the games implies an inability to properly critique the rest of the games.
Uhm... I guess since I'm not even sure what the heck your knickers are in a bunch about, and I'm long past caring, I'll just say have a nice weekend. I have a Jupiter-50 to play with and Assetto Corsa to install... when I get motivated enough to want to anyhow. ;)

For that matter, there are discussions of much more consequence to follow here, and are more straightforward to boot, like why two to one, Kaz should stay, what GT7 development is going to mean for GT6, and how cool P CARS will be, or not.
 
Why would it be endless cause you say so and you're probably hoping it fails cause you can try to put PD on higher pedestal than you already do? Also (1)I've never seen you post on the PCars thread so not sure what features you're talking about that are sprinkled from GT and FM. Also (2)it's funny you bring up Shift since they made that game...so (3)I'm guessing you only know of SMS by word of mouth and not actually trying to study up on them which is fine some cant be bothered, but they should if they're going to argue the subject. Also even if it is delayed I could accept that far more than I can big title games that have deep pocket financial backers that own them, which SMS doesn't.
1. So? In case you haven't noticed, I also haven't posted in the PC sim/game section, any Assetto Corsa threads or any sim threads to any real extent. But since you're evidently so engrossed in the game that the GT/Forza-like aspects have escaped that razor sharp mind of yours, I'll clue you in on the supposedly awesome sauce career path in the game, and the modifications for the street cars, which I believe includes some sort of custom liveries, but I can't recall if those are in or a hoped for feature. That's how eager I am to see P CARS on my HDTV.

Hey, I'll peek in on it from time to time, especially when it's close to release, but right now it's just another sim as far as I know, the career path may only be a cut-n-paste from TOCA, and I think you know how excited the average racing gamer is about PC sims.

2. I am aware. ;) I'm also aware of how SMS complained about how Shift suffered NFS-itis, and fought to get away from EA as fast as possible for their own sim endeavors, like P CARS. I don't know how much of that is CYA, but supposedly the pre-release Shift 1 was a much better game than what happened.

3. You have a nice weekend too.
 
Releasing a PCars demo on PS3 would be like trying to release GT5 or 6 on a PS2. It's a PC/PS4 grade game, there's no winning in downgrading everything so it fits onto a PS3. I think they made the right decisions, or rather the community made the right decision because it was a community vote, to release on the next generation console.

I also love it when people call it Project Screenshots. The best criticism anyone can come up with is that it takes pictures so lifelike, it's hard to tell them from the real thing sometimes.

View attachment 128030
 
I also love it when people call it Project Screenshots. The best criticism anyone can come up with is that it takes pictures so lifelike, it's hard to tell them from the real thing sometimes.

Ehhhh. I think that's pushing it.
 
1. So? In case you haven't noticed, I also haven't posted in the PC sim/game section, any Assetto Corsa threads or any sim threads to any real extent. But since you're evidently so engrossed in the game that the GT/Forza-like aspects have escaped that razor sharp mind of yours, I'll clue you in on the supposedly awesome sauce career path in the game, and the modifications for the street cars, which I believe includes some sort of custom liveries, but I can't recall if those are in or a hoped for feature. That's how eager I am to see P CARS on my HDTV.

I don't recall your comment that I orginally quoted being about Assetto Corsa, nor where any cares given by me on this day in regards to such a game. The subject was shifted to PCars trying to run in the console racing world. Also the features you are talking about are retained from games SMS already made several years ago like gee, what could it be, oh that's right Shift, d'oh. I see but those features can't possibly be in any other game without first being called mainstay features of FM and GT only, not that would be ignorant to think anyone else could use those and make it there own. Rather dogmatic fans get to say they're sprinkled or ripped features to save face when utilized differently and more efficiently for example.

Hey, I'll peek in on it from time to time, especially when it's close to release, but right now it's just another sim as far as I know, the career path may only be a cut-n-paste from TOCA, and I think you know how excited the average racing gamer is about PC sims.

Yet it's not solely a PC sim...and their year or two ago release of that biker arcade game for multi-platform shows they have the ability to release to all consoles so...

2. I am aware. ;) I'm also aware of how SMS complained about how Shift suffered NFS-itis, and fought to get away from EA as fast as possible for their own sim endeavors, like P CARS. I don't know how much of that is CYA, but supposedly the pre-release Shift 1 was a much better game than what happened.

Yeah cause EA is a tyrant and gets last say hence why they are doing a project like PCARS, rather than make an arcade crash em up that quickly sales so EA keeps their pockets filled.
 
Wow, people on gtplanet are actually talking about pCars "delays" the irony is too much.


With a much smaller team than PD and 1/15th of the budget , I'd say SMS is doing a pretty good job with pCars. Not to mention pCars is actually about racing, while GT is about space, deep sea fishing, and with GT7 we may even get wild life exploration.
 
I don't think PCARS looks life-like at all, if anything, they've gone way too far with their lightning and motion effects. PCARS is really just being hyped so much not because of the game itself but because of the concept of a community assisted game and because the other 2 big franchises are stuck, GT just sucking hard on all fronts and Forza not going forward enough to really stand out.

I think PCARS will be a great refresh for everybody but I don't expect it to do anything for the genre.
 
You might as well be Zer0 at this point.

I thought he was a doppelganger

I don't think PCARS looks life-like at all, if anything, they've gone way too far with their lightning and motion effects. PCARS is really just being hyped so much not because of the game itself but because of the concept of a community assisted game and because the other 2 big franchises are stuck, GT just sucking hard on all fronts and Forza not going forward enough to really stand out.

I think PCARS will be a great refresh for everybody but I don't expect it to do anything for the genre.

I'd have to disagree too far with lighting is FM 3 and 4, I'd say 5 is perfect and the gameplay reflects this as it looks quite real and in some areas beats out P CARS, while GT6 doesn't come close from the looks of it. But PCARS looks very close to real life I'd say.

@jimipitbull First off their mmo could be targeting all PC online racers like Assetto, SRW, iRacing and so on. It could be one or the other and really if the game isn't at a stage that a demo is realistic then why should they release one? I don't know what deadline you're working from. Also as for the image @Johnnypenso put up the tires don't have square corner...what you're seeing is caster and camber angle with a bit of deformation but that doesn't look like 90 degree corners as you've suggested
 
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In real life, would all the windscreen wipers be in the same position?

And would the tires have square corners?
They aren't square....but darn close.

BMW-M3-E30-.jpg


Real car's wiper position:

BMW M3 E30 wiper position.jpg


BMW M3 E30 wiper position 2.jpg

Any other questions?
 
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It's a viscous circle

Like I said some of us actually stick to the big issues that are important and the 2D trees, non-moving mudflaps and so on about GT are quite stupid for critics to bring up. And this is a two way street really, so when others do the same with competition because their drug of choice (figure of speech) is bashed, it really doesn't add anything.

It looks to me to be a default position and obviously there will be change when they're in use but they aren't in that moment
 
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