Gran Turismo 7 “Power Pack” Paid DLC Now Available: New Races Including Endurance Events, Qualifying, and “Sophy 3.0”

[art3mis]

In the same way that if a Sophy agent lines up in P2, if you spin them out on the first lap, they'll drive at a million miles an hour and magically be back in P2 like it was always destined to be in the space of a lap

For me, this reads as scripted races, which isn't what I was expecting in a 'real racing' experience.

Unless that whole thing from Speed Racer where ever race is fixed is actually real 👀👀👀

I have tested this btw and yes that's how it always works provided the race itself is long enough. Anything under 5 laps and it won't get back to 2nd though if you watch the replay focusing on that car you'll see it goes far faster than it should.

I have also tested what happens if I drive around the back and stay far out of the way and yes, every race I've tried this in finishes in the exact same order every time.

While Sophy may have been trained on how to drive the actual settings for each driver in the race are individually curated by PD.

 

[eran0004]

I meant to say it is scripted.

Which is an incorrect statement, because that behaviour is not scripted.

I meant to say that because there is zero observable difference between scripted and "trained such that the line taken is the only line to take".

Would you say that gravity is scripted? After all, every time you drop an apple it falls to the ground.

Just because something behaves the same way every time you test it doesn't mean it can be described as "100% scripted".

 

[Lomic]

The real racing experience is Practice, Qualify then Race, that’s it, everyone’s over complicating this part.

One could imagine that "real racing experience" would be to experience real racing (crazy I know) during the race. No need for Sophy 3 something if real racing is only refering to "practice+qualify+race".

 

[mynameis66]

I've been in the Power Pack since day one and drive on two accounts. Basically, I enjoy the races. But what I don't understand is how good you all are.

Since the fix with update 1.66, the races without chili have become very easy, at least most of them.

1 chili is very challenging for me and sometimes impossible, such as the European classic cars. I can't beat the Alfa. I also tested the 24 Hours of Nürburgring, and even there I can't keep up with the Audi. With the AMG, it's very decent.

That's why I'm even more impressed by your performance.

I'm probably just not good enough as a D driver.

I drive with a steering wheel and VR.


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For me personally,level zero or whatever its called,is the level of my skill set.Ive won a few and failed a few but at the same time im having a blast.
Maybe in another update PD will up the difficulty with the one and two chilli races for the better drivers.Who knows.👍

 

[jad_morffier]

I've been in the Power Pack since day one and drive on two accounts. Basically, I enjoy the races. But what I don't understand is how good you all are.

Since the fix with update 1.66, the races without chili have become very easy, at least most of them.

1 chili is very challenging for me and sometimes impossible, such as the European classic cars. I can't beat the Alfa. I also tested the 24 Hours of Nürburgring, and even there I can't keep up with the Audi. With the AMG, it's very decent.

That's why I'm even more impressed by your performance.

I'm probably just not good enough as a D driver.

I drive with a steering wheel and VR.


Translated with DeepL.com (free version)

For me I had to study how car physics work to understand why I couldn't take corners as quick as others. And then practice, practice practice.

I'm not a fan of time trials (I get bored very quickly) so I just kept doing race after race. I found this more helpful as I had to learn how to take corners in multiple different scenarios. Before Sophy I used the old and predictable AI race events to practice clean overtakes. I'd repeat the same race in the same car over and over trying different ways to overtake the same car.

This also helped me learn where the limit of the tires were and how far I could push the car.

When Sophy arrived the opponents were less predictable so I had to think more on the fly with each overtake. And then practice, practice, practice.

The Sophy Quick Races in completely stock road cars is my one of my go-to places for learning to get gud and master a particular car. I repeat the race until I get the win with a Clean Race Bonus.

For the PP races Sophy 3.0 is much more difficult to win with a Clean Race Bonus. But it's not impossible. I do the same thing, repeat the same race over and over learning the track and car combo to the point where I'm quick enough to stay with the top opponents and from there have fun battling it out for some really good racing.

 

[art3mis]

Which is an incorrect statement, because that behaviour is not scripted.

Would you say that gravity is scripted? After all, every time you drop an apple it falls to the ground.

Just because something behaves the same way every time you test it doesn't mean it can be described as "100% scripted".

It's funny you ask. I am one of those people who are firmly convinced "reality" as we know it is an incredibly powerful computer simulation run by beings we cannot fathom.

So yes, Gravity is Scripted

 

[luv2drive]

I've done about 10 races so far. I'm enjoying the competition trying to win all of them with two chilis.

A couple were fairly easy, but most I have to really practice to improve my lap times a second or two.

i'm still struggling with the one-lap race at the Nordschleife where the two chili car is the BMW M4 '14. I always thought I was pretty good on the Ring, but the fastest lap I can turn is low 7:18s, but the AI are doing 7:15s, so not sure how I'll ever beat this race on 2 chilis.

I wish the PP would allow us to use ghosts and other tools in the Practice mode so that we could improve our lap times. As far as I know, we can't do Time Trials with these exact tunes back in the main game mode.

Well, I conquered it!!

I ran several more practice laps to see how far I could push the car, and finally got my qualification time down to 7:13.5xx, took pole position, and won the race with a 7:14.232 lap. @jad_morffier, perseverance is definitely the key.

Now I need to figure out how to lower my lap times by a few seconds on Tokyo Expressway, one of my worst tracks.

 

[Tommy_D]

Just bought the DLC. My first race was in the American Muscle Car division. Took out the Camaro as I wanted to test the waters. An hour of practice…. Really? Really, PD? An hour of practice for a 6 minute race? And I can’t skip out of practice after 20 minutes of sitting 2.5 seconds ahead of the second fastest car? Okay, I’ll go in the pits and let time expire while I do other things.

On to qualifying. 10 minutes of qualifying for a 6 minute race… Okay…. Qualified first. 2.5 seconds ahead of second place.

On to the race. Out in first, stayed in first the whole way. Made the last turn on the last lap and the game decides to have an “unexpected error” as I’m 5 seconds away from winning. The game quits out and I have to start the whole thing over again. You got to be kidding me.

Is it just me or did PD set this up all backwards? Shouldn’t it be an hour of optional practice, 10 minutes of qualifying and at least a 20-25 minute race? This is stupid to force people to drive around in free practice for an hour when the race is only 6 minutes long. Less practice, more racing. That’s what people want.

 

[Nebuc72]

Just bought the DLC. My first race was in the American Muscle Car division. Took out the Camaro as I wanted to test the waters. An hour of practice…. Really? Really, PD? An hour of practice for a 6 minute race? And I can’t skip out of practice after 20 minutes of sitting 2.5 seconds ahead of the second fastest car? Okay, I’ll go in the pits and let time expire while I do other things.

On to qualifying. 10 minutes of qualifying for a 6 minute race… Okay…. Qualified first. 2.5 seconds ahead of second place.

On to the race. Out in first, stayed in first the whole way. Made the last turn on the last lap and the game decides to have an “unexpected error” as I’m 5 seconds away from winning. The game quits out and I have to start the whole thing over again. You got to be kidding me.

Is it just me or did PD set this up all backwards? Shouldn’t it be an hour of optional practice, 10 minutes of qualifying and at least a 20-25 minute race? This is stupid to force people to drive around in free practice for an hour when the race is only 6 minutes long. Less practice, more racing. That’s what people want.

It is optional, you can skip practice entirely.

 

[jad_morffier]

Well, I conquered it!!

I ran several more practice laps to see how far I could push the car, and finally got my qualification time down to 7:13.5xx, took pole position, and won the race with a 7:14.232 lap. @jad_morffier, perseverance is definitely the key.

Now I need to figure out how to lower my lap times by a few seconds on Tokyo Expressway, one of my worst tracks.

Well done!

Such a good feeling. A rewarding sense of accomplishment.

Yes the Tokyo Expressway race is very challenging. I lost count of how many times I repeated it before getting the win with a CRB.

 

[wowbaggerBR]

Hate those dirt races. Why do they bother with this still?

 

[ScottPuss20]

I did the GT ONE race on Le Mans in the '95 McLaren F1 GT-R and won it easily. Things very much go your way if you don't crash.

 

[Tired Tyres]

Had my first test at Le Mans for the 24 hours. First question. Why doesn't the 962 handle like it does in the normal game? It was very wet at the start of practice and i was fastest on full wets. I was 6 tenths off the top AI pace on intermediates. There was zero dry running so I cancelled the event. Is it always wet in practice?

Oh and happy new year.

 

[savior972]

For me personally,level zero or whatever its called,is the level of my skill set.Ive won a few and failed a few but at the same time im having a blast.
Maybe in another update PD will up the difficulty with the one and two chilli races for the better drivers.Who knows.👍

Yes, you're right, of course. First and foremost, it's about having fun in the races. And you definitely have fun. But it also spurs me on to get better so that I can beat even the tougher opponents fairly on the track. That's why I'm always amazed by these comments and videos.

For me I had to study how car physics work to understand why I couldn't take corners as quick as others. And then practice, practice practice.

I'm not a fan of time trials (I get bored very quickly) so I just kept doing race after race. I found this more helpful as I had to learn how to take corners in multiple different scenarios. Before Sophy I used the old and predictable AI race events to practice clean overtakes. I'd repeat the same race in the same car over and over trying different ways to overtake the same car.

This also helped me learn where the limit of the tires were and how far I could push the car.

When Sophy arrived the opponents were less predictable so I had to think more on the fly with each overtake. And then practice, practice, practice.

The Sophy Quick Races in completely stock road cars is my one of my go-to places for learning to get gud and master a particular car. I repeat the race until I get the win with a Clean Race Bonus.

For the PP races Sophy 3.0 is much more difficult to win with a Clean Race Bonus. But it's not impossible. I do the same thing, repeat the same race over and over learning the track and car combo to the point where I'm quick enough to stay with the top opponents and from there have fun battling it out for some really good racing.

Practice makes perfect, I agree with you there. But I quickly get bored with these time trials and prefer to race. I started with the normal difficulty level, but now I race all the world circuits on the hard level, which is usually no problem.

But I've also noticed, at least in my case, that you want to push the cars beyond their limits, which of course doesn't work. I noticed this particularly in the Group C races with the Nissan. I love this car, but here I push it beyond its limits, so that it's really difficult to keep it on the track at times. You simply want too much and it goes wrong. When time is running out in the race, this creates additional pressure and the error rate increases. Maybe you shouldn't approach the whole thing too doggedly.

Thank you for your words.


Translated with DeepL.com (free version)

 

[eran0004]

It's funny you ask. I am one of those people who are firmly convinced "reality" as we know it is an incredibly powerful computer simulation run by beings we cannot fathom.

So yes, Gravity is Scripted

Touché!

 

[jad_morffier]

When time is running out in the race, this creates additional pressure and the error rate increases. Maybe you shouldn't approach the whole thing too doggedly.

Ah yes the additional pressure you put on yourself. Reminds me of the adage, "Racing is 90 percent mental and 10 percent physical." - Stirling Moss.

He argued that once a driver reaches a certain level of physical competence, the difference between winning and losing is entirely psychological.

If you think about it the additional pressure we put on ourselves is similar to the physical pressure we put on the car to find the limit. We learn from it.

You could probably think of some difficulties you had six months ago with a certain car on a certain track that you can now do quicker with a much lower error rate and no additional pressure at all.

So the pressure isn't necessarily a bad thing. It has the potential to improve your racecraft.

 

[CTRL Garage]

One could imagine

Well that’s the problem right there

 

[Lomic]

Well that’s the problem right there

In the mean time, that's what was advertised and touted everywhere, so you don't need much imagination.

 

[savior972]

Ah yes the additional pressure you put on yourself. Reminds me of the adage, "Racing is 90 percent mental and 10 percent physical." - Stirling Moss.

He argued that once a driver reaches a certain level of physical competence, the difference between winning and losing is entirely psychological.

If you think about it the additional pressure we put on ourselves is similar to the physical pressure we put on the car to find the limit. We learn from it.

You could probably think of some difficulties you had six months ago with a certain car on a certain track that you can now do quicker with a much lower error rate and no additional pressure at all.

So the pressure isn't necessarily a bad thing. It has the potential to improve your racecraft.

Yes, I know what you mean. I've already learned a few things, but the time pressure often gets to me. You try to overtake in places where it's not possible. I still need to work on that. Maybe then I'll be better as a D driver online too. Although that depends a lot on who you're driving with online and how fairly they drive.

 

[CTRL Garage]

In the mean time, that's what was advertised and touted everywhere, so you don't need much imagination.

From PD themselves: https://www.gran-turismo.com/us/news/00_5250784.html

The Power Pack ushers in a fresh kind of challenge for Gran Turismo, offering a new structure designed to bring players closer than ever to the authentic racing experience.

This is exactly it, just Practice, Qualify and then Race for the authentic racing experience.

Same article:

GT Sophy 3.0, delivering the most authentic AI behavior to date. Expect relentless, tail-to-nose battles and racecraft that keeps the pressure on every lap, making each encounter on track a true test of skill.

Where does it say real racing experience? Yes it’s a lot of marketing verbiage going on and for some people and their skill level it’s good AI and for others it’s not, but sounds like you’re drawing unrealistic conclusions from what was marketed.

 

[jrbabbitt]

Has anyone really tested if the difficulty setting in options makes a difference in the PP races? I've tried it with same race at Fuji with different difficulty and got three different results...

 

[jad_morffier]

Yes, I know what you mean. I've already learned a few things, but the time pressure often gets to me. You try to overtake in places where it's not possible. I still need to work on that. Maybe then I'll be better as a D driver online too. Although that depends a lot on who you're driving with online and how fairly they drive.

Online is a different kettle of fish. Most drivers aren't interested in better racecraft or racing etiquette so the entire approach is more about predicting and anticipating kaos.

 

[savior972]

Online is a different kettle of fish. Most drivers aren't interested in better racecraft or racing etiquette so the entire approach is more about predicting and anticipating kaos.

That's right, you're correct. Very few drivers in daily races drive cleanly and fairly.

 

[jad_morffier]

That's right, you're correct. Very few drivers in daily races drive cleanly and fairly.

And unfortunately, if you want to succeed in GT7 online atm an "If you can't beat them - join them" mentality is required. Either that or a continuous bombardment of frustration, anger, and annoyance.
It's just not racing imo.

 

[savior972]

And unfortunately, if you want to succeed in GT7 online atm an "If you can't beat them - join them" mentality is required. Either that or a continuous bombardment of frustration, anger, and annoyance.
It's just not racing imo.

I only race online occasionally, mainly when I like the track. I've had some good races there. I haven't usually managed to win, but they were fair fights. It's particularly disastrous in Gr 4 races.

 

[Voodoovaj]

One could imagine that "real racing experience" would be to experience real racing (crazy I know) during the race. No need for Sophy 3 something if real racing is only refering to "practice+qualify+race".

Again, we are drawing assumptions of what constitutes "Sophy 3".

This Sophy runs on dirt, and does standing starts. Who knows what else it does behind the scenes.

 

[jad_morffier]

I only race online occasionally, mainly when I like the track. I've had some good races there. I haven't usually managed to win, but they were fair fights. It's particularly disastrous in Gr 4 races.

Yes there are going to be some good races. But today they are few and far between. It has more to do with luck and blue moons now.

The ratio of good to bad races has tipped too far to one side for me. Time is precious and when I want to escape this world after a hard days work I want to choose that time wisely. Sadly, online Daily Races in their current state isn't worth the gamble anymore.

 

[savior972]

Yes there are going to be some good races. But today they are few and far between. It has more to do with luck and blue moons now.

The ratio of good to bad races has tipped too far to one side for me. Time is precious and when I want to escape this world after a hard days work I want to choose that time wisely. Sadly, online Daily Races in their current state isn't worth the gamble anymore.

I understand how you feel. That's why I rarely go online. I'd rather race against Sophy, or now in PP I have enough to do and practice. I'd rather invest my time there.

 

[jad_morffier]

I understand how you feel. That's why I rarely go online. I'd rather race against Sophy, or now in PP I have enough to do and practice. I'd rather invest my time there.

Same. I sometimes jump in for a look if the car\track combo tickles my fancy. I enter with a little bit of hope and a hint of optimism but that quickly gets shut down with a cold, hard reminder of why I left lol.

 

[luv2drive]

Well done!

Such a good feeling. A rewarding sense of accomplishment.

Yes the Tokyo Expressway race is very challenging. I lost count of how many times I repeated it before getting the win with a CRB.

Yeah I went back and beat it yesterday after I posted the last message. Finally qualified first but I was still 4th into the first corner because I can't figure out how to match the AI pace on the standing start. No CRB for me on this one