Kevin Ward

[Coxis]

Sigh. Don't you just miss the times when you could actually browse GTP and not find TenEightyOne involved in some kind of Internet argument with someone?

 

[King_Fatts]

Heard a press conference on Nascar Race Hub today. The Sheriff of Ontario County said there was not a camera on Tony Stewarts sprint car. There is 2 videos though. He also said that cars were inspected as evidence and returned to their teams today.

He also said theres still no Charges, But its an ongoing Investigation.

 

[meek]

Actually, motion picture cameras pick up about a quarter of the light an eye sees, unless it's pointed directly at the sun. Even less so for a cellphone camera.

Still, the lighting at that track is quite minimal, which typical for most dirt short tracks. I'd guess it's literally 1/100th of the light during a cloudy daytime race from the angles I've seen (averaging out my experience with still photography light meter examples).

do you have a credible source for that? I've heard on TV for years the exact opposite. Now, I know what the TV says isn't always true, but I've heard it in different countries/languages...

Tony has a long history of fights and disagreements with drivers so to me its not a huge stretch to say he would run somebody over. A fight is one small step away from homicide in my opinion. Proving that is a different story and if it was deliberate maybe Tony has found the ultimate perfect crime.

Stewart wasn't fighting or disagreeing (that would be Ward), probably didn't even know the kid was there.

I remember during the Lance Armstrong scandals (there was several over a 10 year period as the French investigated him) the "star power" was unbeatable. Lance had 90% of the public including amongst Europeans. People love to latch on to a personality and make them a god. Examples of this exist throughout human history.

Do you mean Armstrong had 90% fans or 90% of people disliking him?
You might want to explain the Armstrong-Stewart analogy better, too.

How is it in North Korea this time of year anyways? Is it quite warm in August?

it's actually the South Korean flag, North Korea's flag:



@TheCracker
why the wrong flag? lol

 

[Zenith]

It's really disturbing how people are commenting on this that don't know squat about sprint cars. These are not even close to other race cars in terms of engineering and handling.

These aren't NASCAR's with different bodies. These aren't rally cars with V8's. Sprint cars are entirely different animals compared to other racecars. They have no transmission and no differential. They generate their cornering through different sized rear tires. They corner sideways with power on. This is how you go fast on dirt tracks and this is how sprint cars are built.

This is aside from the horrible visibility they provide and the fact that Ward was wearing a black outfit at night.

Why did Tony gun the engine? Because otherwise he would've plowed straight into Ward rather than at least trying to change direction.

 

[mustafur]

The person of the 45 car said, he didn't see Kevin untill a second before he jumped out of the way: https://www.facebook.com/mark.tychoniewicz/posts/844718932205116

Dark track, Black jumpsuit = next to no vision

Combine that with a roof and front wing that obstructs most of your vision and you really can't see crap.

 

[Tornado]

How internet of you.



Herein lies the problem. It appears you, and many others are completely ignoring the human element of all this, assuming every decision or action is the result of 100% pure motives and a complete lack of bias. Police can be corrupt, lazy, trying to cover the own skins, or any other manner of debased moral state. I can think of countless local police issues (many as serious as murder) where a grand jury had to be summoned to push a case to trial because the lousy police let the defendant off free.



Hilarious, I have a different opinion then what you agree with so your condemning me as a self proclaimed judge and executioner while saying nothing of the sort to the many others who have essentially exonerated Stewart. But go on, continue badgering me for wanting to hear more evidence.



I bet 12 Angry Men is one of your favorite films. You know the movie where simple facts are drowned out by what ifs and could haves? I bet you, like so many others, thought that was brilliant. Oh wait. I used the word fact. To people on the internet thats a dirty word with no source.



You want a 100% source? Sorry but thats impossible for someone such as you. Your entire life is predicated on the unknown, randomness, lawlessness, or in simple terms: there is no right or wrong, only opinion. Of course 100% offends you. Its complete, whole, something that your sense of justice is not.



Which means almost nothing.

I love how none of this actually says anything.

 

[TenEightyOne]

You want a 100% source?

You made the 100% claim, dude...

 

[fatkrakr]

From what I seen it looks like Tony has some responsibility here. While I don't think he hit the kid on purpose, he sure didn't do anything to avoid hitting him either. Its BS to say Tony couldn't see the kid, he was in the middle of the track, many other drivers where able to avoid him.

Heres how I believe it went down. Tony seen the kid and thought if this kid don't get out of the way Ill hit him (expecting the kid to jump out of the way), he goosed the gas to get the car sideways (from many witnesses and drivers) and the car stepped out farther than he intended and hit him.

 

[Tornado]

I really don't think reading two posts all of half a page above yours is really that hard before stating something conclusive.

Its BS to say Tony couldn't see the kid, he was in the middle of the track, many other drivers where able to avoid him

The person of the 45 car said, he didn't see Kevin untill a second before he jumped out of the way: https://www.facebook.com/mark.tychoniewicz/posts/844718932205116

While I don't think he hit the kid on purpose, he sure didn't do anything to avoid hitting him either.

Tony seen the kid and thought if this kid don't get out of the way Ill hit him (expecting the kid to jump out of the way), he goosed the gas to get the car sideways (from many witnesses and drivers) and the car stepped out farther than he intended and hit him.

Why did Tony gun the engine? Because otherwise he would've plowed straight into Ward rather than at least trying to change direction.

 

[Earth]

I love how none of this actually says anything.

So it just all blew right over your head. Advice for next time: dont admit that out in public.

You made the 100% claim, dude...

Maybe I should have claimed 90%? I could probably get you a link to a source backing up 90%.

Oh and look a couple of posts above you. A guy saying Tony gunned the engine to try and turn the car. And he has no source to back it up. Go badger him for a link proving that. Oh wait, you won't. Dont be a hypocrite.

 

[mustafur]

From what I seen it looks like Tony has some responsibility here. While I don't think he hit the kid on purpose, he sure didn't do anything to avoid hitting him either. Its BS to say Tony couldn't see the kid, he was in the middle of the track, many other drivers where able to avoid him.

Heres how I believe it went down. Tony seen the kid and thought if this kid don't get out of the way Ill hit him (expecting the kid to jump out of the way), he goosed the gas to get the car sideways (from many witnesses and drivers) and the car stepped out farther than he intended and hit him.

the guy that kevin jumped to avoid said he didn't see him till the last second. https://www.facebook.com/mark.tychoniewicz/posts/844718932205116

 

[TenEightyOne]

Maybe I should have claimed 90%? I could probably get you a link to a source backing up 90%.

Okay, go on then.

 

[Earth]

Okay, go on then.

I'll have it for you soon, just hang on a minute

 

[Tornado]

So it just all blew right over your head.

What part blew over my head? The entire post (since you like percentages, I'll say "90%") where you threw a fit about TenEightyOne while completely ignoring anything anyone else has said in this thread that already debunked all of your claims before then?


Or that little part of your post that wasn't completely useless for the conversation because it was actually related to what happened; which nonetheless still essentially amounted to the conspiracy theory angle you were already called out on before you even fully said it? You're saying police reports are worthless because the police department you know absolutely nothing about could be corrupt? Based on what?

Advice for next time: dont admit that out in public.

Advice for next time: Don't cast stones from glass houses. My memory is more than good enough to remember one of the previous times you went on a safety tirade; where all of the times you were called out on your strawmen arguments and general lack of knowledge of the subject culminated in you throwing a fit and deleting all of your posts.

This "Us vs. Them" mentality that you put into every single one of these threads you take part in after a racing accident doesn't make you look enlightened like you think it does. It just makes you look like you want people to die just so you can say "I told you so."

 

[fatkrakr]

the guy that kevin jumped to avoid said he didn't see him till the last second. https://www.facebook.com/mark.tychoniewicz/posts/844718932205116

If you watch the video though Kevin ran down the track and up to the side of his car and then jumped back. He was clearly out in front of Tony's car.

 

[Imari]

I bet 12 Angry Men is one of your favorite films. You know the movie where simple facts are drowned out by what ifs and could haves? I bet you, like so many others, thought that was brilliant. Oh wait. I used the word fact. To people on the internet thats a dirty word with no source.

You mean the film where the simple facts would lead to an innocent man being put to death if interpreted simplistically?

The one where a man asking unbiased questions leads to greater insight about those facts and a correct interpretation of them?

Are you sure you watched the same film as the rest of us?

I feel it's certainly a possibility that Tony simply had a disagreement with someone, they lost their cool & Tony saw somebody vulnerable he was angry at, he could kill and get away with it, blaming the guy for playing with the traffic which is what pretty much everybody here is doing apart from a few people. That and the "star power" Tony has which is is no doubt well aware of.

It's already been pointed out that Tony probably didn't know that Kevin had crashed. But let's assume that he did.

He can't know that Kevin is going to get out of his car and go storming down onto the racing line, because that's just crazy behaviour. But let's assume that somehow he's gotten a read on him and picked that one as well. He knows he's crashed him out, and he knows he's going to get him to run onto the track where he's vulnerable.

Then Stewart has to get himself into a position behind another car where he can reasonably claim that he didn't see Kevin, judge exactly where on the track Kevin would be despite all his jumping around, and then somehow nail him.

And he has to come up with that plan, as well as run through all the possible consequences and come to the conclusion that he could indeed get away with it, while driving a race car on dirt.

I mean, I'm sure Tony Stewart is awesome and all, but I'm not sure anyone is so awesome that they're able to plan and execute the perfect murder on 20 seconds notice, let alone in the situation he was in. Maybe he's just that great, and has secretly been killing guys when nobody would notice for years. It's just this one time that someone happened to catch it on tape.

 

[mustafur]

If you watch the video though Kevin ran down the track and up to the side of his car and then jumped back. He was clearly out in front of Tony's car.

yeah, but keep in mind the track is dark and he is wearing black,.

 

[fatkrakr]

yeah, but keep in mind the track is dark and he is wearing black,.

You could see him just fine from the stands all the way on the opposite side of the track, so it wasn't a lighting issue. Like I said I don't think he meant to hit him, but meant to scare him and make him jump. It just that the car got away from him.

 

[mustafur]

You could see him just fine from the stands all the way on the opposite side of the track, so it wasn't a lighting issue. Like I said I don't think he meant to hit him, but meant to scare him and make him jump. It just that the car got away from him.

thats different, in a moving Sprint car with wings taking about 65% of your vision its much harder, not to mention the fact it was very likely that he didn't even know what caused his crash as ward hit the wall outside of his vision.

 

[fatkrakr]

thats different, in a moving Sprint car with wings taking about 65% of your vision its much harder, not to mention the fact it was very likely that he didn't even know what caused his crash as ward hit the wall outside of his vision.

Im not saying he did or didn't know what caused it, but there is no way in hell he didn't see a person standing in the middle of the track directly in front of him.

 

[Panoz]

A better view with how the wings and the seat padding blocks the driver's vision, the camera is placed higher up than the driver's eyes.

 

[MustangRyan]

It took all of five seconds to have his view obstructed by dirt.

 

[fatkrakr]

It took all of five seconds to have his view obstructed by dirt.

Except they where at caution lap speeds. there was no dirt being kicked up in his face.

A better view with how the wings and the seat padding blocks the driver's vision, the camera is placed higher up than the driver's eyes.

I sure wouldnt have any issue seeing someone in the middle of the track. I could see all the way to the next corner.

 

[mustafur]

Im not saying he did or didn't know what caused it, but there is no way in hell he didn't see a person standing in the middle of the track directly in front of him.

like i said, the cars have very limited vision, its very possible by the time he saw him it was too late.

 

[fatkrakr]

like i said, the cars have very limited vision, its very possible by the time he saw him it was too late.

Well then that kinda flies in the face of he goosed the gas to avoid him than, doesn't it? What would of been the point of Tony goosing the gas when coming up on the safety crew?

 

[GTPorsche]

Well then that kinda flies in the face of he goosed the gas to avoid him than, doesn't it? What would of been the point of Tony goosing the gas when coming up on the safety crew?

There was no safety crew there at that moment.

 

[Tornado]

Well then that kinda flies in the face of he goosed the gas to avoid him than, doesn't it?

Not... really, no. No one is arguing that by the time Tony saw him it was too late to do anything, so the fact that what he did do was done too late to avoid Ward doesn't contradict the idea that he didn't see him until that point.

 

[fatkrakr]

There was no safety crew there at that moment.

How would Tony know? He could see anything in front of him remember. With the yellow flag is in the air you assume the safety crew is at the crash. So why goose the gas?

 

[Zenith]

Im not saying he did or didn't know what caused it, but there is no way in hell he didn't see a person standing in the middle of the track directly in front of him.

This guy is hilarious. How can one learn to write but not how to read?

All of your points have been addressed on this page.

 

[fatkrakr]

Not... really, no. No one is arguing that by the time Tony saw him it was too late to do anything, so the fact that what he did do was done too late to avoid Ward doesn't contradict the idea that he didn't see him until that point.

Im arguing that exact point. The guy was in the middle of the track during a caution and Tony goosed the gas on his car and the kid was hit. So again if he wasn't trying to scare the kid why goose the gas when you are approaching a crash?

This guy is hilarious. How can one learn to write but not how to read?

All of your points have been addressed on this page.

No they haven't LOL.